[Tom's Hardware] Chips, 10nm Ice Lake, 18% IPC Improvement, Sunny Cove Cores, Gen11 Graphics, Thunderbolt 3 - Page 2 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[Tom's Hardware] Chips, 10nm Ice Lake, 18% IPC Improvement, Sunny Cove Cores, Gen11 Graphics, Thunderbolt 3

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post #11 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 08:33 AM
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All this tells me is that they are still having troubles with 10nm as they can only go up to 28w TDP max and 4.1 Ghz boost clock on 4C/8T parts. In other words, they still weren't able to get out of mobile territory, just like with the Cannon Lake affair. Now let's see if they can make these in volume anytime soon or if it's also smoke and mirrors like last time. If they can make them in volume, mobile is very important, so not all is lost.

The existence of the 9900KS tells me that higher core count with higher clockspeeds on the desktop is still many months away. 18% IPC uplift since 2015's Skylake arch (Coffee Lake refresh is still Skylake CPU cores under the hood) is decent, but they need the high clocks on the desktop too to remain competitive. Apparently only the 14nm++ process can do it as of now.

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post #12 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 08:35 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by anejchy View Post
So... AMD might not totally destroy Intel in the upcoming years?
Considering they cannot scale their core count as well as AMD, that it cost them much more to create high core count CPUs compare to AMD's chiplet design and that AMD's zen 3 will also have some IPC increases.. Ice lake was announced in 2014 for a 2016 release and we wont see it until at least the end of 2019 and even then, I would not bet in it, it's been delayed many times. This news article is reactionary to AMD's presentation, I would not read too much into it. Intel has been plagued with many security issues, AMD is offering a really compelling offering for the server market. Also *Performance results are based on [...] and may not reflect all publicly available security updates*. I'd say Intel is still in hot waters.
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post #13 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 08:42 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by doom26464 View Post
These are all low wattage small 4 core mobile parts. While its finally good for intel to get 10nm out the gate, high perfomance desktop parts will be awhile yet.

By time intel gets them ready for high end desktop I imagine amd will be ready for there refresh of zen 2. Intel will have to be ready to deal with that.

Competition is finally taking hold but its safe to safe intel will be loosing the high end enthusiast desktop space for the next 1-2 years till they can come swinging back. Hopefully in this time AMD as well can plan there next move carefully for zen 3 and there zen2 refresh.

If AMD is already out selling intel 1 to 2 it will probably move to 1 to 3. As we see even more mid range and high end gaming pc move over to AMD.
AMD outselling Intel by 1 to 2, 1 to 3? Which factual data are you basing this off of? World marketshare has typically been Intel 75-80%, AMD 15-20%, Other 1-2% for the last several quarters.
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post #14 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 08:46 AM
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Zen2 would have to bost ~ 4.4 Ghz on all cores to mach 5ghz all core 9900KS.
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post #15 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 08:54 AM
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If you read the footnote on the ipc slide...

Quote:
Originally Posted by BiG StroOnZ
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
No I said if Vega is clocked @ 1600MHz out of the box, I will eat my shoe on Twitch.tv.

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Not in games, which is what 99.9999 percent of us care about

And unless you own a business, you get paid for your time. So your compute power just makes more work for you not less

Ryzen is a joke to the vast majority of the market who would consider buying their product.
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post #16 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 09:02 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post
All this tells me is that they are still having troubles with 10nm as they can only go up to 28w TDP max and 4.1 Ghz boost clock on 4C/8T parts. In other words, they still weren't able to get out of mobile territory, just like with the Cannon Lake affair. Now let's see if they can make these in volume anytime soon or if it's also smoke and mirrors like last time. If they can make them in volume, mobile is very important, so not all is lost.

The existence of the 9900KS tells me that higher core count with higher clockspeeds on the desktop is still many months away. 18% IPC uplift since 2015's Skylake arch (Coffee Lake refresh is still Skylake CPU cores under the hood) is decent, but they need the high clocks on the desktop too to remain competitive. Apparently only the 14nm++ process can do it as of now.
IMO the 18% assumed IPC is only okay since as you stated, in reality it's really being compared to Skylake architecture. Credit to Intel's engineer, they've been able to do wonders with 14nm and monolithic cpu designs. As a someone who's all for tech advancement miniaturization, I hope Intel stays with monolithic for as long it they can. Likely, Intel will drop monolithic designs down the road because it makes great business sense like when AMD did it. Though in AMD's case, their engineering expertise was a limiting factor with monolithic designs compared to Intel.

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post #17 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 09:03 AM
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With all the issues they have had on 10nm, I wouldn't be surprised to see Sunny Cove end up on 14nm+++ then in 2021 finally getting shrunk down onto 7nm.

That's just fine with me as a consumer though, I want AMD to take the lead and gain a bunch of the market share. That way they can be on more equal footing as they go blow for blow in the future.

Sunny Cove looks like it's gonna be a real step forward for intel finally which is great, but in 5 or 10 years I want to see this time as the time when AMD and Intel squared up and really started fighting, rather than a small hiccup for Intel before going back to business as usual.


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post #18 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 09:09 AM
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Important to note: 18% IPC improvement can be accurate in whatever metric Intel used. But they've lost ~10%~ clockspeed from Whiskey Lake to Ice Lake, so that IPC bump is necessary to make up for the clock deficit. Actual overall performance increase will depend both.

Whiskey Lake 15W boosts to 4.7Ghz, this 15W was 4.1Ghz only (someone correct me if I'm wrong I can't remember exact figures)


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post #19 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 09:11 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by D-S-J View Post
IMO the 18% assumed IPC is only okay since as you stated, in reality it's really being compared to Skylake architecture. Credit to Intel's engineer, they've been able to do wonders with 14nm and monolithic cpu designs. As a someone who's all for tech advancement miniaturization, I hope Intel stays with monolithic for as long it they can. Likely, Intel will drop monolithic designs down the road because it makes great business sense like when AMD did it. Though in AMD's case, their engineering expertise was a limiting factor with monolithic designs compared to Intel.

I would be giving the credit to their FABs. Intel has essentially not really done anything architecturally in the last 4 generations. They've simply demanded better binned chips that they can clock higher from their fabs. That's all 14+++++++++ (whatever) is.

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post #20 of 67 (permalink) Old 05-28-2019, 09:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by dj_tokyu View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by D-S-J View Post
IMO the 18% assumed IPC is only okay since as you stated, in reality it's really being compared to Skylake architecture. Credit to Intel's engineer, they've been able to do wonders with 14nm and monolithic cpu designs. As a someone who's all for tech advancement miniaturization, I hope Intel stays with monolithic for as long it they can. Likely, Intel will drop monolithic designs down the road because it makes great business sense like when AMD did it. Though in AMD's case, their engineering expertise was a limiting factor with monolithic designs compared to Intel.

I would be giving the credit to their FABs. Intel has essentially not really done anything architecturally in the last 4 generations. They've simply demanded better binned chips that they can clock higher from their fabs. That's all 14+++++++++ (whatever) is.
It's not like they made a 28 core monolithic chip or anything.

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