[Tom's Hardware] AMD Launches Radeon Pro Vega II And Pro Vega II Duo 7nm GPUs - Page 4 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community
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post #31 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-04-2019, 07:38 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by SuprPwrUsr View Post
Anyone else confused about this whole AMD Radeon Pro Vega II vs Radeon VII, I thought Radeon VII stood for Vega II but the announcement would suggest this Pro Vega II is a different release from the VII. During apple's keynote they specifically called it Radeon Vega II rather than Radeon 7.

EDIT: Nevermind. Just read the article and all the questions will be answered.
Honestly i had the same question when "Radeon 7" was announced i just thought it was the "vega 2/V II". this would also mean the vega pro duo is the "vega ~14/ Vega 20x2"... idk cursive is gone, latin is dead, so why not just bury roman numerals too, huh?

yea i mean sure nvidia has a clear advantage in the market right now... until stadia attempts to prove the OCN community futile that is, sure. but most of what you just listed is ML, and i thought that was kind of the idea behind the VII. Machine learning/Compute on the enterprise side, but placed at a consumer price point, given heat, TDP, etc. the card still has its purposes.

and before its mentioned, RTX has been brought up by Su on both aspects of Hardware or Software, and stated that “we’re working very closely with the ecosystem on both hardware and software solutions and expect that ray tracing will be an important element especially as it gets more into the mainstream.”

https://www.analyticsindiamag.com/do...market-divide/

but this is the last straw for vega, given personally i never really accepted them as fails... the competition in gaming performance was debated over at least, that says something. lets just hope the next generation gives us the new 6990/590/7990/690/295x2/MARSii whatever card. a single card to punch any one system with two cards right in their smug faces. something we can say we spent $X on and never regretted it till it was generations behind the standards gtx 260. im looking forward to both AMD and Nvidia's upcoming cards, cant wait to ditch my budget VR card

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post #32 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-04-2019, 08:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by nonametoclaim View Post
yea i mean sure nvidia has a clear advantage in the market right now... until stadia attempts to prove the OCN community futile that is, sure. but most of what you just listed is ML, and i thought that was kind of the idea behind the VII. Machine learning/Compute on the enterprise side, but placed at a consumer price point, given heat, TDP, etc. the card still has its purposes.

and before its mentioned, RTX has been brought up by Su on both aspects of Hardware or Software, and stated that “we’re working very closely with the ecosystem on both hardware and software solutions and expect that ray tracing will be an important element especially as it gets more into the mainstream.”

https://www.analyticsindiamag.com/do...market-divide/

but this is the last straw for vega, given personally i never really accepted them as fails... the competition in gaming performance was debated over at least, that says something. lets just hope the next generation gives us the new 6990/590/7990/690/295x2/MARSii whatever card. a single card to punch any one system with two cards right in their smug faces. something we can say we spent $X on and never regretted it till it was generations behind the standards gtx 260. im looking forward to both AMD and Nvidia's upcoming cards, cant wait to ditch my budget VR card
I'm not talking about performance just pure partnerships/deals that recently happened which @Zam15 completely missed in their comparison.

I'm glad AMD cards are being used in the data center. They finally found a use for their Radeon Pro V340 cards.

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post #33 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-05-2019, 12:44 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by nonametoclaim View Post
yea i mean sure nvidia has a clear advantage in the market right now... until stadia attempts to prove the OCN community futile that is, sure. but most of what you just listed is ML, and i thought that was kind of the idea behind the VII. Machine learning/Compute on the enterprise side, but placed at a consumer price point, given heat, TDP, etc. the card still has its purposes.
The VII idea was to use leftover MI50 cores that AMD couldn't sell and keep themselves relevant in the general market until navi shows up.
The VII doesn't have the full suit support (mainly software) as its datacenter counterparts (MI50/60), and is not as largely used for ML or compute in the enterprise market.
Yes, some people do use it for ML, just like some people use the 2080 TI or titans etc. But overall, it is just a drop of water compared to datacenter cards sales.

Currently even with their newest cards, AMD are not a big threat to nvidia to worry right now. Google are actually the threat to nvidia, as they are trying to make their own hardware. Market wise, nvidia revenue is more than twice that of AMD in the ML/AI/Data center market. They had a bigger growth than AMD in 2018 and are set to do so in 2019 as well.

While nvidia basically gave up on the consoles several years ago (beside the switch), revenue wise, it is a market which gets smaller compared to data centers. So future view wise, they made a good choice. While AMD concentrated on custom hardware for consoles (basically stagnating their technology), nvidia pushed for new technology and suits for data centres, which is expected to be 100B$+ market in 4-5 years.


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post #34 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-05-2019, 01:03 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Defoler View Post
The VII idea was to use leftover MI50 cores that AMD couldn't sell and keep themselves relevant in the general market until navi shows up.
The VII doesn't have the full suit support (mainly software) as its datacenter counterparts (MI50/60), and is not as largely used for ML or compute in the enterprise market.
Yes, some people do use it for ML, just like some people use the 2080 TI or titans etc. But overall, it is just a drop of water compared to datacenter cards sales.

Currently even with their newest cards, AMD are not a big threat to nvidia to worry right now. Google are actually the threat to nvidia, as they are trying to make their own hardware. Market wise, nvidia revenue is more than twice that of AMD in the ML/AI/Data center market. They had a bigger growth than AMD in 2018 and are set to do so in 2019 as well.

While nvidia basically gave up on the consoles several years ago (beside the switch), revenue wise, it is a market which gets smaller compared to data centers. So future view wise, they made a good choice. While AMD concentrated on custom hardware for consoles (basically stagnating their technology), nvidia pushed for new technology and suits for data centres, which is expected to be 100B$+ market in 4-5 years.
I dont think aiming for the console market is actually stagnating their progress. You have actually really tight requirements for the hardware. You cant just put a 300W GPU in it. Good performing, efficient CPU+GPU+VRAM/RAM is not something easy to achieve.

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post #35 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-05-2019, 02:48 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Defoler View Post
The VII idea was to use leftover MI50 cores that AMD couldn't sell and keep themselves relevant in the general market until navi shows up.
The VII doesn't have the full suit support (mainly software) as its datacenter counterparts (MI50/60), and is not as largely used for ML or compute in the enterprise market.
Yes, some people do use it for ML, just like some people use the 2080 TI or titans etc. But overall, it is just a drop of water compared to datacenter cards sales.

Currently even with their newest cards, AMD are not a big threat to nvidia to worry right now. Google are actually the threat to nvidia, as they are trying to make their own hardware. Market wise, nvidia revenue is more than twice that of AMD in the ML/AI/Data center market. They had a bigger growth than AMD in 2018 and are set to do so in 2019 as well.

While nvidia basically gave up on the consoles several years ago (beside the switch), revenue wise, it is a market which gets smaller compared to data centers. So future view wise, they made a good choice. While AMD concentrated on custom hardware for consoles (basically stagnating their technology), nvidia pushed for new technology and suits for data centres, which is expected to be 100B$+ market in 4-5 years.
AMD also concentrated on compute performance over gaming in their architecture.... besides a console is just a mini server.

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post #36 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-05-2019, 08:46 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
I'm not talking about performance just pure partnerships/deals that recently happened which @Zam15 completely missed in their comparison.

I'm glad AMD cards are being used in the data center. They finally found a use for their Radeon Pro V340 cards.
Didn't miss them, I said RECENT. As in Computex and CES, not last year. Most of the articles you linked talked about product being offered, not actually in use and are for development Key words; "positioning" "In the works" "preview" "available" I'm not saying they haven't made sales but I don't see the same commitments that were made to AMD. It's obvious from AMD announcements that millions of units that will be shipping. Yes I know these are low margin compared to enterprise parts these will be huge volumes for each deal.

Anyways you think auto manufactures are going stick to Nvidia for self driving tech? Tesla already developed their on in house solution. I expect the rest to eventually follow their lead. So that big future market Nvidia was pursuing? Gone

My main thing is seeing more developers of applications I use (Gaming, VR) will be developing for use on AMD hardware as that's what the majority of the market will be going forward. Major company's are jumping on the AMD bandwagon and I'm happy to see competition.

I'll be looking to upgrade my Nvidia SLI 980s for something that will run the next generation for games that will be coming out for PlayStation and Xbox.
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post #37 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-05-2019, 08:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by Zam15 View Post
Didn't miss them, I said RECENT. As in Computex and CES, not last year. Most of the articles you linked talked about product being offered, not actually in use and are for development Key words; "positioning" "In the works" "preview" "available" I'm not saying they haven't made sales but I don't see the same commitments that were made to AMD. It's obvious from AMD announcements that millions of units that will be shipping. Yes I know these are low margin compared to enterprise parts these will be huge volumes for each deal.

Anyways you think auto manufactures are going stick to Nvidia for self driving tech? Tesla already developed their on in house solution. I expect the rest to eventually follow their lead. So that big future market Nvidia was pursuing? Gone

My main thing is seeing more developers of applications I use (Gaming, VR) will be developing for use on AMD hardware as that's what the majority of the market will be going forward. Major company's are jumping on the AMD bandwagon and I'm happy to see competition.

I'll be looking to upgrade my Nvidia SLI 980s for something that will run the next generation for games that will be coming out for PlayStation and Xbox.
Microsoft Azure, Google Cloud and Amazon AWS announced use of nVidia's T4 GPUs after the Google Stadia announcement.

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post #38 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-05-2019, 11:22 AM
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This was smart on AMD's part. Don't need to worry about mindshare if you get into consoles and Apple products. Nobody really asks what GPU is in their console or Mac unless it's an option.

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post #39 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-06-2019, 05:31 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by AlphaC View Post
This was smart on AMD's part. Don't need to worry about mindshare if you get into consoles and Apple products. Nobody really asks what GPU is in their console or Mac unless it's an option.
Ecosphere. AMD could nearly always make a competitive hardware product...only to see it lag behind because software was not being optimised for it. You can't get devs to optimize for your hardware unless you have sales...you can't get enough sales without devs optimising for your hardware......was a never ending dilemna.

Zen would not be where it is without the console market.

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post #40 of 40 (permalink) Old 06-06-2019, 08:15 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Redwoodz View Post
Ecosphere. AMD could nearly always make a competitive hardware product...only to see it lag behind because software was not being optimised for it. You can't get devs to optimize for your hardware unless you have sales...you can't get enough sales without devs optimising for your hardware......was a never ending dilemna.

Zen would not be where it is without the console market.
If what you mean is that the consoles helped pay for creating Zen, I agree.

It took a minute before software started to get optimized for Ryzen and it's still in that process, but accelerating. The sales numbers are the reason for the push towards being optimized and the trend seems like it is going to continue growing with Zen 2. The pc market should have software pretty well optimized by the time they launch the new consoles with Zen inside.

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