[PCGamesN] AMD’s second-gen RDNA GPUs will feature hardware accelerated ray tracing in 2020 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[PCGamesN] AMD’s second-gen RDNA GPUs will feature hardware accelerated ray tracing in 2020

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post #1 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 12:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Source: https://www.pcgamesn.com/amd/ray-tra...dna-2-gpu-2020


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AMD’s next-gen, 7nm+ RDNA 2 architecture will arrive in graphics cards in 2020, and bring hardware accelerated ray tracing to AMD’s GPUs for the first time. And just in time to feature on the PC platform as well as the new AMD Navi-powered Sony PS5 and Xbox Scarlett consoles… or whatever they end up being called.
Told you AMD would follow nVidia to create dedicated hardware to accelerate BVH.
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post #2 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 12:42 AM
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strictly for the editorial content:
E: ~6:20 mark
belay that try 11:00 mark



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post #3 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 12:51 AM
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What do you think about Full Scene Ray tracing in Cloud?
When Nvidia could make a GPU that can offer 4K Full Scene Ray tracing?
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post #4 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 01:19 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Hwgeek View Post
What do you think about Full Scene Ray tracing in Cloud?
A joke. "Cloud" compute for interactive media is pointless... you might as well just stream the entire game.

2nd gen RDNA clearly won't have all the ray tracing acceleration the RTX line had last year. Quake II RTX is already "full scene" ray traced.

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post #5 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 01:57 AM
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I know that "Quake II RTX is already "full scene" ray traced" but it's 22 year old game that runs ~95FPS on RTX 2080TI at 1080P, so if you jump back to 2019~2020 Games with full scene ray tracing- how fast the new RTX GPU should be to run at 4K? is it even possible with 1 GPU?
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post #6 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 02:45 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Hwgeek View Post
What do you think about Full Scene Ray tracing in Cloud?
When Nvidia could make a GPU that can offer 4K Full Scene Ray tracing?
RT on its own cost a hell of a lot of compute. Nvidia had to resort to hybrid RT for now even with 544 dedicated tensor cores for compute, which are the current bottleneck for RT.
To get decent fps at 4K, they will need twice if not more dedicated cores to do it. Going to 7nm, it will still make the core pretty big. So I don't know if they will be able to pull full RT in 4K without hybrid.
This is why I think AMD won't be able to offer a similar solution, and the reason they hadn't even talked about it now, is because they are still working on their own hybrid solution similar to nvidia, until the compute power arrives.

Full scene RT in cloud will introduce a lot of lag if done in real time remotely. Considering we want 4K/144hz monitors and leverage performance for it, I think it is a nice dream but not very realistic for fast moving games.
Would you like your offline game to force you to be 100% online at a minimum lag as possible in order to really view the game as you like? I think hardware solution is a better solution. Maybe not for consoles, but for PC games, definitely.

Quote: Originally Posted by umeng2002 View Post
A joke. "Cloud" compute for interactive media is pointless... you might as well just stream the entire game.

2nd gen RDNA clearly won't have all the ray tracing acceleration the RTX line had last year. Quake II RTX is already "full scene" ray traced.
Well if you look at AMD, what might benefit them, is their ability to use their cores for both high level compute and graphics. So if they make their next gen have twice the cores, they can turn half the cores into compute cores through their hardware async compute system.
That means they can run at a 2070-ish 4K performance for general purposes and texture rendering, with a high capacity of compute that could match or surface tensor cores for lighting.
This could potentially give them an edge. But, I don't think they will go to such big cores, so they might move to a similar hybrid solution for now, or accept the huge FPS drop from fully supporting the RT API.



Last edited by Defoler; 06-12-2019 at 02:50 AM.
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post #7 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 03:10 AM
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I interpret this as: Limited RTX style RT rendering capable local hardware and full RT that you can't do at home via cloud.

RTX in its current form doesn't even come close to full RT.

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post #8 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 04:27 AM
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^Exactly... Which is why I will still argue that...

At this point, ray tracing for consoles to me sounds like when Microsoft was talking about the power of the cloud for effects when they were gonna launch the Xbox One. A gimmick.

Why would ray tracing be used if you can get very close with the traditional way of rendering. You get a 50% performance drop from it for at best a 10% visual fidelity increase. It's either that, or AMD found a way to do it significantly faster than nVidia with their next RDNA architecture, in which case your nVidia RTX card will be useless anyway... I do think it's the former though.

As for Quake II, remember that that game has zero modern effects. So obviously it's going to look miles better with ray tracing compared to its vanilla counterpart, because there are no modern rasterization lighting effects to compare it to. The real reference are the games that support RTX, and it's quite obvious that the difference in visual quality does not justify the performance cost.
Maybe, the Scarlett will enable ray tracing only for 1080p 60fps games. So the question then becomes, would you rather play at 4K traditional rendering, or 1080p with ray tracing?
Or, they will be using voxel cone/beam tracing, similar to the Vega 56 demo. Even then, the question remains whether the performance drop is really worth it.
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post #9 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 04:36 AM
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Definitely will be the mix of GPU compute + dedicated hardware cores + x86.

I see no way AMD letting everything be done on GPU. Selling Ryzen in gaming industry is way too good to pass up, Those CPU cores need to get use, otherwise not many gamers will buy CPU beyond 8 cores.

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post #10 of 26 (permalink) Old 06-12-2019, 04:46 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Clocknut View Post
Definitely will be the mix of GPU compute + dedicated hardware cores + x86.

I see no way AMD letting everything be done on GPU. Selling Ryzen in gaming industry is way too good to pass up, Those CPU cores need to get use, otherwise not many gamers will buy CPU beyond 8 cores.
While I definitely agree with the sentiment, I must point that ray tracing is something that a CPU really just cannot do. It would take a lot more cores than what Ryzen is offering. Ray Tracing is a highly parallel task that requires many many simple cores, which is what a GPU is. You would need 200+ CPU cores to even begin to render RT in real time on a CPU.

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