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[ARS] Apple: Beginning February 2015, App Store submissions need to be 64-bit

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post #31 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-21-2014, 09:24 PM
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this is about andriod. They're aiming to keep all the good apps away from andriod.

Basically andriod isn't close to supporting 64bit across the whole environment. this will make many apps apple exclusive. That's all this is about... this is also about forcing people on old ipads to upgrade and old iphones to upgrade.

though i suspect the ipad upgrade is the biggest issue on their list.

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post #32 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-21-2014, 09:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azanimefan View Post

this is about andriod. They're aiming to keep all the good apps away from andriod.

Basically andriod isn't close to supporting 64bit across the whole environment. this will make many apps apple exclusive. That's all this is about... this is also about forcing people on old ipads to upgrade and old iphones to upgrade.

though i suspect the ipad upgrade is the biggest issue on their list.
But if developers stopped supporting 32-bit they'd ostracise a large portion of iOS devices so that's unlikely to happen for a while.

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post #33 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-21-2014, 09:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azanimefan View Post

this is about andriod. They're aiming to keep all the good apps away from andriod.

Basically andriod isn't close to supporting 64bit across the whole environment. this will make many apps apple exclusive. That's all this is about... this is also about forcing people on old ipads to upgrade and old iphones to upgrade.

though i suspect the ipad upgrade is the biggest issue on their list.

As much as I despise Apple to it's core, I just don't see this.

They are not forbidding 32bit apps and any company wanting to distribute an app to the masses on any system right now is going to submit a 32bit version regardless of also having to submit a 64bit.

It looks like a slow push to eventually get all apps 64bit which is a good thing.
Then once 99% of apps are 64bit we can do away with 32bit CPUs.

Once 32bit CPUs are done way with - which would also require all OS's to be 64bit - then everything will be 64bit.

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post #34 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-21-2014, 11:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azanimefan View Post

this is about andriod. They're aiming to keep all the good apps away from andriod.

Basically andriod isn't close to supporting 64bit across the whole environment. this will make many apps apple exclusive. That's all this is about... this is also about forcing people on old ipads to upgrade and old iphones to upgrade.

though i suspect the ipad upgrade is the biggest issue on their list.

Well I love Android but this is a good move by Apple. And btw, the applications submitted to the App Store should include x64 support, not just be explicitly x64. Also, it's about time chip makers started to make x64 chips (Qualcomm, Samsung, Nvidia...etc).
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post #35 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-22-2014, 07:27 AM
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I updated the OP about "include".

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Actually no. If you want to make an application for iPhones, it must go trough the Apple Store. As for 32 vs 64, the vast majority of applications do not require nor gain anything from the extra 32 bits. More so, its actually less efficient in those applications. I agree in a sense that legacy applications makes things harder on the OS people, but that's because the developers typically come up with hacky solutions to some things... kinda like why Windows 10 is not Windows 9.

But, if you can explain to me why or how most applications take advantage of 64 bits, I would appreciate it.
In addition to the certain workloads that benefit from 64-bit (which isn't actually many in smartphone applications).... the real benefit in performance would come from ARMv8 ISA itself. During the move to the 64-bit instruction set, ARM did some work to remove some legacy designs which simplified the registers.

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Memory usage should actually go down a bit tongue.gif

64bit memory usage is higher then 32bit yes, but right now you have both 64bit and 32bit being loaded simultaneously. Once you cut out all traces of 32bit libraries, overall memory usage should be lower.
Why would memory go down in a 64-bit vs 32-bit compare (ignoring multiple libraries having to be loaded)?

A 64-bit pointer takes up more space than a 32-bit pointer?

I took what he was saying as right now with fat binarys you have to load 2 sets of libraries when you cut out the 32bit libs you use less RAM because you're 64 only.

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post #36 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-22-2014, 10:13 AM - Thread Starter
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I took what he was saying as right now with fat binarys you have to load 2 sets of libraries when you cut out the 32bit libs you use less RAM because you're 64 only.

Yes, but most applications are still 32-bit only and that wouldn't be an issue.

In 32-bit vs 64-bit..... 64-bit should take a bit more more memory (something like 1-10%).

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post #37 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-22-2014, 10:18 AM
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I really loathe Apple but I agree with this move. If you dont make the devs do this they never will.

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post #38 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-22-2014, 10:19 AM
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I took what he was saying as right now with fat binarys you have to load 2 sets of libraries when you cut out the 32bit libs you use less RAM because you're 64 only.

Yes, but most applications are still 32-bit only and that wouldn't be an issue.

In 32-bit vs 64-bit..... 64-bit should take a bit more more memory (something like 1-10%).

I agree but I don't think that was his point but I'm sure he'll be along to correct me if I'm wrong

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post #39 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-22-2014, 10:20 AM
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Yes, but most applications are still 32-bit only and that wouldn't be an issue.

In 32-bit vs 64-bit..... 64-bit should take a bit more more memory (something like 1-10%).

32 bit = less memory than 64 bit
64 bit = more memory than 32 bit
32 bit and 64 bit = more memory than a single of the two.

Ignoring the fact that both both 32 bit libs and 64 bit libs are loaded simultaneously as is, is like ignoring to put lemon in a lemon cake. Switching the whole system to purely 64 bit ( their goal ), will yield less memory usage overall.
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post #40 of 81 (permalink) Old 10-22-2014, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

Yes, but most applications are still 32-bit only and that wouldn't be an issue.

In 32-bit vs 64-bit..... 64-bit should take a bit more more memory (something like 1-10%).

32 bit = less memory than 64 bit
64 bit = more memory than 32 bit
32 bit and 64 bit = more memory than a single of the two.

Ignoring the fact that both both 32 bit libs and 64 bit libs are loaded simultaneously as is, is like ignoring to put lemon in a lemon cake. Switching the whole system to purely 64 bit ( their goal ), will yield less memory usage overall.

and that makes me correct..

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