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[Anandtech]Microsoft brings DX12 to Windows 7

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post #21 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-12-2019, 11:49 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post
Regarding XP vs 7, it's very difficult to compare both because the former only has a 32-bit version for consumers, the scheduler wasn't optimized for more than two cores, with Vista and later thus performing better on quad cores and beyond, and XP also lacks support for TRIM and AVX.
Actually, there is a 64-bit version of XP, I have a copy of it. I'm sure many of your complaints about XP and Vista hold true regardless. It wasn't a terrible OS, but it was another testing ground of sorts. The main issue with it was driver support, which it didn't get because attention was directed at Vista instead.

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post #22 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 01:43 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Firehawk View Post
Actually, there is a 64-bit version of XP, I have a copy of it. I'm sure many of your complaints about XP and Vista hold true regardless. It wasn't a terrible OS, but it was another testing ground of sorts. The main issue with it was driver support, which it didn't get because attention was directed at Vista instead.

Sure, but it's not the "Home Edition" consumer version as I mentioned, it's the Professional version (or the even rarer and more limited version made for Itanium systems), which never got much traction because of its limited market scope and for being very late in the OS cycle (XP Home and Professional 32-bit were launched in Oct of 2001, whereas Windows XP Professional x64 Edition was only launched in April of 2005, even after SP2).

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post #23 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 01:54 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by white owl View Post
See what I mean?
Here on a PC enthusiast forum it blows my mind just how easily most people accept defeat from MS (who makes the most commonly hacked OS
I like 10 simply because after making it behave like 7 you're left with a much faster OS that's easier on resources, plus the search bar is on point and you don't have to bother with 99% of your drivers.
I've tried and the problem is that you simply cannot ever win permanently with Win 10. Every hack or work around is routinely worked back in through an update, the OS ignores user commands for certain things, mostly privacy/data leak related, coincidence right... I have win 10 enterprise and the OS will ignore settings set through the group policy unless I trick it into thinking it's actually part of an "enterprise" by running my own corporate active directory/update server.

You cannot stop the data leakage out of it, it's futile; there's too many leaks and just when you thought you plugged them all more leaks emerge. The OS will ignore certain hosts entries if you try and block it access to MS servers. The only thing you can do to truly gain control is setting it behind a default deny out firewall at the router level and work it in whitelist mode, but then the OS thinks it's perma offline and behaves all gimped and even then if you whitelist something it will spew out encrypted data of nobody knows what from you PC. You can't inspect it, you don't know what it is or what it isn't.

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post #24 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 02:54 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by xJumper View Post
I've tried and the problem is that you simply cannot ever win permanently with Win 10. Every hack or work around is routinely worked back in through an update, the OS ignores user commands for certain things, mostly privacy/data leak related, coincidence right... I have win 10 enterprise and the OS will ignore settings set through the group policy unless I trick it into thinking it's actually part of an "enterprise" by running my own corporate active directory/update server.

You cannot stop the data leakage out of it, it's futile; there's too many leaks and just when you thought you plugged them all more leaks emerge. The OS will ignore certain hosts entries if you try and block it access to MS servers. The only thing you can do to truly gain control is setting it behind a default deny out firewall at the router level and work it in whitelist mode, but then the OS thinks it's perma offline and behaves all gimped and even then if you whitelist something it will spew out encrypted data of nobody knows what from you PC. You can't inspect it, you don't know what it is or what it isn't.
Well one main point is to no longer have updates forced upon you. Save O&O in it's own folder anywhere, when you choose to update on your own terms simply tell O&O to apply the tweaks again, ezpz. Updating is the only thing that will revert changes made, I actually never brother updating at all unless there's something I want or there's a new build. Pretty sure I ran the same build for almost a year not long ago and my changes never reverted.

O&O disables much of the network chatter as well and AFAIK it's doing the same things that 7 was after I'd tweaked it, unless I'm using firefox my network usage is 0% all the time from what I've seen but that's already less data than 7 will sent by default which makes it a moot point on the whole 7 vs 7 thing.
You and I share a similar mindset about a lot of things, I wouldn't be using 10 if I couldn't tame it as easily as it was to apply my own tweaks to 7.

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post #25 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 05:22 AM
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This is a good news.

Personally I'm on windows 7 and I don't feel the need to change. Everything is running good and I know the interface and functionality very well.

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post #26 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 05:57 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by nvidiaftw12 View Post
I care. GTX 970 and W7.


So I rate your statement as false.
Steam Survey shows lots of people will likely care.

Also, the WoW thing makes perfect sense. We @ OCN tend to forget the casual gamer, playing on an ancient machine caked in cigarette smoke, still leveling their Mohawk NightElf.
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post #27 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 07:01 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by J7SC View Post
Whaaaaat ?! I finally relented a few months back & upgraded one of my machines from Win7 Pro to Win10, solely to get DX12 for 2080 TIs ...all that frustration for ?
Unless you only play world or warcraft then it doesn't even matter.
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post #28 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 08:47 AM
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Hi,
Suppose I should of said nobody would probably notice any difference in dx12 or 11 used in a game or vulkan for that matter meaning this is not a big deal worth even thinking of

I'm sure MS has it's reasons and it's all money based you can be sure of

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post #29 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 09:27 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by xJumper View Post
I've tried and the problem is that you simply cannot ever win permanently with Win 10. Every hack or work around is routinely worked back in through an update, the OS ignores user commands for certain things, mostly privacy/data leak related, coincidence right... I have win 10 enterprise and the OS will ignore settings set through the group policy unless I trick it into thinking it's actually part of an "enterprise" by running my own corporate active directory/update server.

You cannot stop the data leakage out of it, it's futile; there's too many leaks and just when you thought you plugged them all more leaks emerge. The OS will ignore certain hosts entries if you try and block it access to MS servers. The only thing you can do to truly gain control is setting it behind a default deny out firewall at the router level and work it in whitelist mode, but then the OS thinks it's perma offline and behaves all gimped and even then if you whitelist something it will spew out encrypted data of nobody knows what from you PC. You can't inspect it, you don't know what it is or what it isn't.
My question is whether you use NTLite or something similar to cut the bloat out of the ISO (often created from an ESD file)? I find I have to cut PRETTY deep to actually get out a lot of the spyware. Been doing this for years in Win 10. Unfortunately, some programs, due to this, actually run less efficient than had I left the spyware in.

As to it fixing itself, if you leave server initiated self-healing module intact, it will compare the cache stores of the components to the server list and correct that and feature settings to match that of Microsoft's servers. Instead, you need to cut deep enough that you get rid of the update module, neuter the Asimov telemetry and other telemetry monitoring and logging elements, and even this won't get rid of everything, but will destroy the bulk of the Win 10 spyware. Then, you can rely on WSUS applications to choose which updates to download and install after thoroughly disabling the windows update, cortana, etc. Unfortunately, until next month's update, gutting Cortana destroys the search bar functionality entirely (supposedly they will be allowing the removal of Cortana again with the next update like the first version of Win 10 until the Anniversary update baked that sh**cake in so deep that you couldn't remove it without messing with certain search functions). Also, some updates won't apply with your mods, requiring creating an ISO with the newest updates added to the ISO, then cutting out the components you don't want again, which then becomes a monthly endeavor to stay recent on security fixes, etc. Headache after headache.

I've seen some try to do the firewall thing, resulting in the OS constantly polling to try to report the data back, thereby tying up resources and actually doing a significant slowdown to the system. You may want to go the route of removing modules, etc. DISM is good, but has limitations, unfortunately, which is why I choose NTLite, but there are other similar freeware/shareware/paid programs that can accomplish the same goals (which are harder unless you have a working knowledge of DISM and Powershell and go through extensive editing there, reg editing, and gpedit, which is important to learn and understand what is happening and being done, but is a PITA, if being honest).

Quote: Originally Posted by white owl View Post
Well one main point is to no longer have updates forced upon you. Save O&O in it's own folder anywhere, when you choose to update on your own terms simply tell O&O to apply the tweaks again, ezpz. Updating is the only thing that will revert changes made, I actually never brother updating at all unless there's something I want or there's a new build. Pretty sure I ran the same build for almost a year not long ago and my changes never reverted.

O&O disables much of the network chatter as well and AFAIK it's doing the same things that 7 was after I'd tweaked it, unless I'm using firefox my network usage is 0% all the time from what I've seen but that's already less data than 7 will sent by default which makes it a moot point on the whole 7 vs 7 thing.
You and I share a similar mindset about a lot of things, I wouldn't be using 10 if I couldn't tame it as easily as it was to apply my own tweaks to 7.

Matter of fact:
O&O, although good, is not the be all and end all of fixing Win 10. There is a LOT more that is needed (see above). Makes me wonder how much you tweaked on Win 7 and which utilities you used to do so. Either way, I would recommend, for simplicity sake, that O&O or other similar software be used in conjunction with other efforts, especially if people are not familiar with some of the more advanced methods to accomplish the same goal, or just as a time saver. But I really feel people need more awareness of exactly how spyware-y windows has become. It is BAD!

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post #30 of 93 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 09:27 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by JackCY View Post
Probably pressure from developers willing to move to Vulkan, so M$ throws them a bone to keep them on their API.

What on earth people love about Win7 I don't understand since even 8.1 was better than 7. And 7 was slower than XP.
It's more about GUI changes and not actual performance why people stick with something they are visually familiar with.
8.1 was terrible. The only reason to use it was for a touchscreen. Let's have Apps (formerly known as applications, aka programs), that aren't programs and have their own menu. Don't even think about uninstalling them as a program, they don't show up in the add/remove program section. They are apps, and must be accessed through the app menu.

Windows 8 was an attempt to grab phone users, which failed bad enough to put Nokia out of business.
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