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[PGGamesN] AMD has “no software ecosystem that’s meaningful” without Intel

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post #21 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 12:11 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
I'm actually shocked at all these comments. Intel announces they are releasing a single API for developers to utilize across all their hardware and everyone thinks it's because they are threatened by AMD? No, they are trying to take on the giant CUDA ecosystem.

To be honest I'd rather AMD and Intel ditch their compute stacks since they're both vendor specific even though they're open source. Curious if Red Hat is actually going to take on this project but I doubt it since nVidia and IBM have such a close relationship.

https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pa...-Compute-Stack

This is pure fabrication.AMD BOUGHT an inter-connect/network company a few years ago in planning their strategy. AMD has been pushing open-source universal API's for more than a decade. Just because Nvidia and Intel refused to co-operate they could not do it alone. Now AMD has finally carved out a favourable software ecosystem with developers, by taking over the console market and pushing OpenCL and ROCM/HIP,free-sync etc. Now Intel wants to make a universal API? GREAT but they are not getting a lick of credit from me. They are being FORCED to do this to stay relevant. And even possibly saboutage AMD hardware with hidden compiler code, like they have done in the past.

Quote: Originally Posted by AlphaC View Post
@ Redwoodz , To be fair Intel is building the Aurora supercomputer while AMD is building Frontier (via Cray)
Yes but the Intel Aurora is using the same Cray Slingshot interconnects as Frontier. https://www.forbes.com/sites/moorins.../#d8367927e815
"It must have rankled Cray that Intel acted as the prime contractor for the ARGON National Labs Aurora (which Intel hopes will be the 1st Exascale Supercomputer built in the USA). Although that system was designed by Cray, it features the same processor-agnostic Shasta system, and uses the Cray Slingshot interconnect. It is unusual for a chip supplier to bid a top-500 supercomputer, but the DOE likes to spread the wealth and risk across multiple vendors.

An IBM/Nvidia supercomputer is in the wings for the next D.O.E award.


In summary these investor slide presentations as posted here are CLEARLY evidence for fraud. Rhaja clearly and blatantley misleading Intel's investors.
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post #22 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 12:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by Redwoodz View Post
This is pure fabrication.AMD BOUGHT an inter-connect/network company a few years ago in planning their strategy. AMD has been pushing open-source universal API's for more than a decade. Just because Nvidia and Intel refused to co-operate they could not do it alone. Now AMD has finally carved out a favourable software ecosystem with developers, by taking over the console market and pushing OpenCL and ROCM/HIP,free-sync etc. Now Intel wants to make a universal API? GREAT but they are not getting a lick of credit from me. They are being FORCED to do this to stay relevant. And even possibly saboutage AMD hardware with hidden compiler code, like they have done in the past
Seems like you keep pointing out gaming and not focusing on AI which is the reason this exist. If you noticed nVidia just keeps getting the AI contracts. Amazon, Google, Red Hat and Microsoft Azure.

Intel released their compute stack Neo, formerly known as Beignet in 2015 before AMD's ROCm. They're being forced by nVidia not AMD. Which is why they dropped their Xeon Phi and began working on a datacenter GPU. It's also the reason why AMD was forced into releasing ROCm and their data center GPUs, Instinct. AMD cards still aren't supported by the largest deep learning frameworks instead they had to create forks that they maintain themselves.

While nVidia's been pushing this since 2007 followed by AI in 2012.

The DOE is testing both AMD and Intel platforms since IBM and nVidia is getting expensive. We'll see what they decide on but a single API that can run across all their hardware seems very appealing.

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post #23 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 01:23 PM
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If anything, Nvidia keeps losing contracts in favor of in-house chips. Specially the largest customers.

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post #24 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 01:38 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Alex132 View Post
ITT: people think they are smarter than Raja Koduri.
So what?

Donald Trump is likely smarter than you or I as well. Using your logic, we should just take everything he says as altruistic truth.


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post #25 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 01:58 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Redwoodz View Post
This is pure fabrication.AMD BOUGHT an inter-connect/network company a few years ago in planning their strategy. AMD has been pushing open-source universal API's for more than a decade. Just because Nvidia and Intel refused to co-operate they could not do it alone. Now AMD has finally carved out a favourable software ecosystem with developers, by taking over the console market and pushing OpenCL and ROCM/HIP,free-sync etc. Now Intel wants to make a universal API? GREAT but they are not getting a lick of credit from me. They are being FORCED to do this to stay relevant. And even possibly saboutage AMD hardware with hidden compiler code, like they have done in the past.



Yes but the Intel Aurora is using the same Cray Slingshot interconnects as Frontier. https://www.forbes.com/sites/moorins.../#d8367927e815
"It must have rankled Cray that Intel acted as the prime contractor for the ARGON National Labs Aurora (which Intel hopes will be the 1st Exascale Supercomputer built in the USA). Although that system was designed by Cray, it features the same processor-agnostic Shasta system, and uses the Cray Slingshot interconnect. It is unusual for a chip supplier to bid a top-500 supercomputer, but the DOE likes to spread the wealth and risk across multiple vendors.

An IBM/Nvidia supercomputer is in the wings for the next D.O.E award.


In summary these investor slide presentations as posted here are CLEARLY evidence for fraud. Rhaja clearly and blatantley misleading Intel's investors.
AMD killed seamicro ages ago, just a few years after buying them.
https://www.datacenterdynamics.com/n...rver-business/

Intel's been one of the biggest or the biggest single entity contributor to FOSS for years, like they said in the conference itself they're the biggest contributor to Linux (as a single entity). AMD's OSS efforts have been relatively recent developments, ironically after Raja took over the graphics group (he started rocm and their unified open source Linux drivers), and most of their work is just around their proprietary hardware and still pales in comparison to what Intel does every year. And openCL was an APPLE - a company OCN loves to hate - initiative and GPGPU was an Nvidia initiative in the first place, openCL was a lazy response to it. Intel, Nvidia, AMD, and other major tech companies all contributed to openCL. AMD did nothing special. The best thing they did was open source their Linux drivers but their openGL implementation on Windows has been broken for as long as PCSX2 has been a thing and devs were calling out their broken openCL compiler for nearly a decade. More over openCL isn't "open source", it's a standard gate kept by a consortium. Not sure why so many people have difficulty understanding it, by open standard they just mean it's a consortium open for companies to join and make proposals, as opposed to a single company having full authority like CUDA, but the big dogs still call the shots. Almost all of these "open standard" setting consortiums have levels of membership. Calling it "open-source" is a straight up lie to make corporations look good.

Just a whole lot of nonsense.

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post #26 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 02:49 PM
Are you sure about that?
 
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That's funny coming from the company that can't even get 10nm to work, while its competitors are already on <10nm processes.

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post #27 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 03:26 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by TwilightRavens View Post
That's funny coming from the company that can't even get 10nm to work, while its competitors are already on <10nm processes.
Intel is huge.

Intel has 107K
AMD 10.1K
TSMC 47K
Nvidia 11.1K
IBM 350K

It's crazy how big the difference is. AMD and Nvidia and TSMC together are still less than Intel.

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post #28 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 03:53 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by ZealotKi11er View Post
Intel is huge.

Intel has 107K
AMD 10.1K
TSMC 47K
Nvidia 11.1K
IBM 350K

It's crazy how big the difference is. AMD and Nvidia and TSMC together are still less than Intel.
What about Samsung?

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post #29 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 06:10 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Imouto View Post
What about Samsung?
Samsung is in too many sectors. For example, Apple and Amazon have a lot of people but a lot are in sales and warehouses.

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post #30 of 64 (permalink) Old 05-11-2019, 09:25 PM
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He's right on the software front. Intel does a lot in the open source space. The problem is that they can't force those OSS entities to only work better with Intel products so AMD benefits by proxy.



But isn't that the point? Keep one competitor on so that you are not considered a Monopoly and broken up.
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