[Ars] Call of Duty: Elite to split Modern Warfare 3 gamers into haves and have-nots - Page 15 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[Ars] Call of Duty: Elite to split Modern Warfare 3 gamers into haves and have-nots

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post #141 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-07-2011, 11:49 PM
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Hey, at least call of duty's going green! unlike battlefield 3

Modern warfare 3=made out of 100% recycled materials

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post #142 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-08-2011, 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by guyladouche View Post
Care to elaborate?

There are two populations of people--those who want the features sooner and will pay, and those who do not want the features sooner, at least not enough to pay for them, so they won't pay.

But in reality, there are two populations: those who want the features sooner and will pay, and those who want the features sooner but don't want to pay, and will whine about it, yet still pay.

People are soft, and game developers (specifically game developers of blockbuster titles) know that. Everyone whined about paid-DLC from similar games, yet they still bought the games and then went out and bought the DLC as well--practically couldn't get rid of their money fast enough. There's no real division of players, just a company seeing how far they can push the customers to fork over cash. People will whine about it, but they'll still go out and pay for it. Publishers are seeing at what point people will stop talking back with their voices, and start talking back with their wallets--which is what really matters.

edit--
I don't think you people were understanding what I was saying--I'm not equating hats to advance-access to DLC. I'm saying that there is no real division of populations, and people will still not hesitate to volunteer their money, and dev's know that.
What are u talking about, you people?

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post #143 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-08-2011, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guyladouche View Post
edit--
I don't think you people were understanding what I was saying--I'm not equating hats to advance-access to DLC. I'm saying that there is no real division of populations, and people will still not hesitate to volunteer their money, and dev's know that.
If my friend has a map I don't, I can't play with him on that map. If another friend has the same map pack I have but another one on top of that, I can't play with him consistently. If another friend has only second map pack but not the first, he can only play with certain of us in certain conditions. And so on.

Dusted.

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post #144 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-08-2011, 06:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RayvinAzn;14862664 
If my friend has a map I don't, I can't play with him on that map. If another friend has the same map pack I have but another one on top of that, I can't play with him consistently. If another friend has only second map pack but not the first, he can only play with certain of us in certain conditions. And so on.

You can already make that argument with current games that have paid DLC/expansions. But that's not the main point about the elite service vs. non-elite service. Elite subscribers will get (among other non-play content) the maps/packs earlier than non-elite subscribers--but in paying for the service, they're still paying for the DLC. The "problem" people have is giving them the advantage of extra time to learn the map before everyone else, making it a waaaaaambulance unfair situation. You still need to buy the DLC though, either way you look at it. But eventually everyone will have equal access to the maps/packs (if they want to buy them). The advantage is having extra time to learn the map before everyone else. But they're still paying for the content.

I mean, if you want to take it one step further, the community is already divided--by people that can afford to have a gaming system/console, and by those that cannot.

I honestly don't mean to sound like I'm advocating for this--I really have no interest in the game or buying an elite (or any other such) subscription, and it's just another example of a company trying to squeeze more money from consumers--but if consumers will volunteer their money, we only have ourselves to blame. And while the term "elite" obviously implies a certain connotation, keep in mind that as of now, the reported price is $4/month ($50 for a year). If that honestly breaks anyone's bank and divides the gaming community between the "haves and the have-nots" then there are much bigger problems to worry about...

Originally Posted by arbalest go_quote.gif
...not needed unless you actually need it for something.
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post #145 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-08-2011, 06:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guyladouche;14864540 
You can already make that argument with current games that have paid DLC/expansions. But that's not the main point about the elite service vs. non-elite service. Elite subscribers will get (among other non-play content) the maps/packs earlier than non-elite subscribers--but in paying for the service, they're still paying for the DLC. The "problem" people have is giving them the advantage of extra time to learn the map before everyone else, making it a waaaaaambulance unfair situation. You still need to buy the DLC though, either way you look at it. But eventually everyone will have equal access to the maps/packs (if they want to buy them). The advantage is having extra time to learn the map before everyone else. But they're still paying for the content.

I mean, if you want to take it one step further, the community is already divided--by people that can afford to have a gaming system/console, and by those that cannot.

I honestly don't mean to sound like I'm advocating for this--I really have no interest in the game or buying an elite (or any other such) subscription, and it's just another example of a company trying to squeeze more money from consumers--but if consumers will volunteer their money, we only have ourselves to blame. And while the term "elite" obviously implies a certain connotation, keep in mind that as of now, the reported price is $4/month ($50 for a year). If that honestly breaks anyone's bank and divides the gaming community between the "haves and the have-nots" then there are much bigger problems to worry about...
Are you not understand basic concepts on purpose?

I said: TF2 hats dont split the community, but Elite and map pack upon map pack does.

You said: Yes they (TF2 hats) do split the community.

He said: No they dont and explained how elite and numerous map packs split up the community.


Also, how can a gaming community be split between people who can afford consoles and those who cant, when those who cant were never part of the console gaming community they are supposedly being split from?

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post #146 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-08-2011, 06:41 AM
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Originally Posted by GrizzleBoy;14864623 
Are you not understand basic concepts on purpose?

I said: TF2 hats dont split the community, but Elite and map pack upon map pack does.

You said: Yes they (TF2 hats) do split the community.

He said: No they dont and explained how elite and numerous map packs split up the community.
As I said previously, Elite service does not split up the gaming community any more or less than other publishers that sell DLC--either way you slice it, people still pay for the content. That's my point--not that TF2 hats magically divide the gaming community--I was never talking about the specific case of content affecting gameplay, I was only ever referring to those who will pay for content, and those who will not--both of those populations already exist, and introducing a new "service" will not change that. Paid DLC is nothing new, and Elite doesn't do anything drastic to divide the community further into "haves" and "have nots."

In the analogy to TF2 hats and weapons, the argument made is that it is split between people who choose to pay for content, and people who don't. The fact that you can get the content via crafting is beside the point--there is still one theoretical segment of the population that will pay for content, and one theoretical segment that does not want to pay for content. THAT was my point--I never said otherwise, and for some reason people kept reading it literally that hats were splitting the gaming community, which was never my point. Go and read over my responses--I only ever talked about people who will pay for content, and people who will not, and that those two populations already exist, since paid DLC already exists.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzleBoy;14864623 
Also, how can a gaming community be split between people who can afford consoles and those who cant, when those who cant were never part of the console gaming community they are supposedly being split from?

I said "the community," not "the gaming community." That's an important difference. wink.gifI guess carefully reading and comprehending statements isn't a strength for everyone.

Originally Posted by arbalest go_quote.gif
...not needed unless you actually need it for something.
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post #147 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-08-2011, 07:07 AM
 
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Originally Posted by RayvinAzn;14862664 
If my friend has a map I don't, I can't play with him on that map. If another friend has the same map pack I have but another one on top of that, I can't play with him consistently. If another friend has only second map pack but not the first, he can only play with certain of us in certain conditions. And so on.

It will only choose maps that everyone in the party has in common, so you could play with your friend all day, he just wouldn't get to play in the maps that you don't have. This isn't any different than the last 5 CoDs that had DLC map packs. I don't see why all the sudden that this has become a bigger deal than usual.


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post #148 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-08-2011, 07:37 AM
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Originally Posted by lordikon;14865019 
It will only choose maps that everyone in the party has in common, so you could play with your friend all day, he just wouldn't get to play in the maps that you don't have. This isn't any different than the last 5 CoDs that had DLC map packs. I don't see why all the sudden that this has become a bigger deal than usual.

I absolutely abhor peer to peer style gameplay if that's what you're referring to. The only two Call of Duty games I own are Modern Warfare and Black Ops. Since all the maps in Call of Duty 4 were thrown in for PC users for free, there was obviously no problem there. If you're talking about Black Ops...well hell yes there was a problem. Join a server with a few friends, then half of us get dropped for not having the next map in the rotation. They did finally update the game so you could search servers by what content they had running, but now it's a pretty pathetic list since the community has been divided into what could theoretically be 25 completely separate groups (though I suspect the number is closer to three - those who just play vanilla, those who got the first pack and then decided it wasn't worth it, and those that get them all). Trying to find a decent >100 ping Hardcore server that isn't 24/7 Nuketown or tactical crouch S&D is nigh on impossible, and it wouldn't surprise me at all to find out it's because of all the DLC.

Dusted.

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post #149 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-08-2011, 07:46 AM
 
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Originally Posted by RayvinAzn;14865268 
I absolutely abhor peer to peer style gameplay if that's what you're referring to. The only two Call of Duty games I own are Modern Warfare and Black Ops. Since all the maps in Call of Duty 4 were thrown in for PC users for free, there was obviously no problem there. If you're talking about Black Ops...well hell yes there was a problem. Join a server with a few friends, then half of us get dropped for not having the next map in the rotation. They did finally update the game so you could search servers by what content they had running, but now it's a pretty pathetic list since the community has been divided into what could theoretically be 25 completely separate groups (though I suspect the number is closer to three - those who just play vanilla, those who got the first pack and then decided it wasn't worth it, and those that get them all). Trying to find a decent >100 ping Hardcore server that isn't 24/7 Nuketown or tactical crouch S&D is nigh on impossible, and it wouldn't surprise me at all to find out it's because of all the DLC.

I agree with your sentiments. I get the feeling that because 90% of their profits will be from consoles that they don't care much about this because it's all handled by them when you're on Xbox Live or PSN, so it doesn't affect console players much. IMO if the PC version allows dedicated servers then the DLC should be free (or at least very cheap, $1-2), to prevent the above situation you mentioned. Sure Activision loses a bit of money from DLC on PCs, but they end up with happier customers that are more likely to buy their next $50-60 title.


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post #150 of 152 (permalink) Old 09-08-2011, 08:00 AM
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This is just to get more players to buy the elite package so that all the non-elite gamers will be like, "how do I get that?"

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