[G3D] American senator proposes bill against loot boxes in games - Page 4 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

Forum Jump: 

[G3D] American senator proposes bill against loot boxes in games

Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #31 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 08:20 AM
professional curmudgeon
 
looniam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,177
Rep: 767 (Unique: 444)
Quote: Originally Posted by DNMock View Post
Did the actual bill itself get put out yet or is it still the cliff notes, rough draft?

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/116/s748

Quote:
Introduced:
Mar 12, 2019

Status:
Introduced on Mar 12, 2019

This bill is in the first stage of the legislative process. It was introduced into Congress on March 12, 2019. It will typically be considered by committee next before it is possibly sent on to the House or Senate as a whole.
however:
Quote:
Prognosis Details
This bill has a 5% chance of being enacted.

Factors considered:

The overall text of the bill does little to affect its chances of being enacted. The bill is assigned to the Senate Commerce, Science, and Transportation committee. The bill's primary subject is Commerce.

(Factors are based on correlations which may not indicate causation.)

Predictions are by Skopos Labs.

"Name as many uses for a brick as you can in one minute." - interview at graphics-chip maker Nvidia for a campaign-manager job
Fermi: it's better to burn out than fade away.
Remember the golden rule of statistics: A personal sample size of one is a sufficient basis upon which to draw universal conclusions.
"The more you buy, the more you save." - Jensen Huang GTC 2018
loon 3.2
(18 items)
CPU
i7-3770K
Motherboard
Asus P8Z77-V Pro
GPU
EVGA 980TI SC+
RAM
16Gb PNY ddr3 1866
Hard Drive
PNY 1311 240Gb
Hard Drive
1 TB Seagate
Hard Drive
3 TB WD Blue
Optical Drive
DVD DVDRW+/-
Power Supply
EVGA SuperNova 750 G2
Cooling
EKWB P280 kit
Cooling
EK-VGA supremacy
Case
Stryker M [hammered and drilled]
Operating System
Win X
Monitor
LG 24MC57HQ-P
Keyboard
Ducky Zero [blues]
Mouse
corsair M65
Audio
SB Recon3D
Audio
Klipsch ProMedia 2.1
▲ hide details ▲


looniam is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #32 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 08:28 AM
New to Overclock.net
 
azanimefan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 1,875
Rep: 142 (Unique: 101)
Quote: Originally Posted by skupples View Post
I agree, ESRB was better than a govt. solution.
The ESRB was the industry's panic'd responce to regulation attempts against violence in video games in the 90's, the problem with a self regulatory body, is it needs to be self regulatory and proactive to avoid government oversight. The ESRB has been in the pocket of the industry since it's creation, and legislation will probably be the ultimate response. This is the industry's own fault

Furthermore, this is a solid ban on these activities, meaning the ESRB will probably be ditched if this law passes. Simply slapping a mature sticker on the box won't allow the industry from escaping liability under this law (as currently proposed)

[URL="https://www.overclock.net/t/1490324/the-intel-devils-canyon-owners-club/0_40"]Intel Devil's Canyon Owners Club
Deep-6
(14 items)
CPU
Ryzen+ 7 2700
Motherboard
ASUS ROG STRIX B450-I GAMING
GPU
GTX 970
RAM
GSkill Ripjaw V DDR4 3600
Hard Drive
Samsung Pro 970 M.2
Hard Drive
Samsung Evo 850
Hard Drive
Samsung Evo 850
Power Supply
Thermaltake Toughpower Grand RGB Smart Zero
Cooling
NZXT Kracken M22
Case
Fractal Design Nano S
Operating System
Windows 10 Pro
CPU
Core I5-4690K
Motherboard
Asus Maximus VI Gene
GPU
MSI GAMING 4G GTX 970
RAM
gskill sniper
Hard Drive
Samsung 850 evo
Hard Drive
Samsung 850 evo
Power Supply
Seasonic X-650
Cooling
Thermalright HR-02 Macho Rev.B
Case
Fractal Design Arc Mini R2
Operating System
Windows 10 Pro
Monitor
Acer K242hl
Keyboard
Corsair Raptor K30
Mouse
Logitech MX518
Audio
Sennheiser - MOMENTUM Over-the-Ear Headphones
CPU
FX 8320
Motherboard
Asus Sabertooth 990FX R2.0
GPU
MSI r9-280x gaming
RAM
Crucial Ballistix Tactical 16GB (2 x 8GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1866 (PC3 14900) BLT2KIT8G3D1869DT1TX0
Hard Drive
Samsung 840 Evo
Hard Drive
Seagate Barracuda 1TB SATA
Optical Drive
ASUS DVD/RW
Power Supply
XFX 750W Pro
Cooling
Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP15
Cooling
Scythe Gentle Typhoon AP15
Cooling
Fractal Design Silent Series R2 FD-FAN-SSR2-140
Cooling
Fractal Design Silent Series R2 FD-FAN-SSR2-140
Cooling
Fractal Design Silent Series R2 FD-FAN-SSR2-140
Cooling
Fractal Design Silent Series R2 FD-FAN-SSR2-140
Cooling
Corsair h100
Case
Fractile Design R4
Operating System
Windows 7 Home Premium (64 bit) SP1
Monitor
Asus VH226 22" HD LED
Keyboard
Corsair K30
Mouse
Logitec MX518 Gaming Mouse
Other
APC BACK-UPS 1300G
Other
Rosewill RNX-N600PCE, Dual Band Wireless N600 Wi-Fi Adapter
▲ hide details ▲
azanimefan is offline  
post #33 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 09:44 AM
curmudgeon
 
miklkit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 5,669
Rep: 304 (Unique: 175)
This bill was introduced by a Democrat. McTurtle has not been letting anything from Democrats even get voted on. This bill will die in the committee.

#YouMightThinkItsOk
Junkyard Dog
(18 items)
Blackie
(17 items)
CPU
AMD Ryzen 1700
Motherboard
Biostar X370 GT7
GPU
Sapphire Nitro+ Radeon Vega 64
RAM
G. Skill Ripjaws ddr4 3200 16 GB 4x4
Hard Drive
Samsung 850 EVO 500gb SSD
Hard Drive
Western Digital 500gb
Hard Drive
Samsung 860 evo 1tb ssd
Optical Drive
Memorex Lightscribe dvd
Power Supply
Seasonic 850 watt
Cooling
Thermalright Silver Arrow IB-E Extreme
Case
Silverstone Redline RL05
Operating System
Win 10 64bit
Monitor
Pixio 27" 1440P
Keyboard
yes
Mouse
Evoluent vertical mouse
Mouse
yes
Audio
Creative X-FI
Other
Sennheiser headphones HD 599
CPU
AMD FX8370 @ 5 ghz
Motherboard
ASUS Sabertooth
GPU
Sapphire Fury
RAM
G Skill F3-14900CL9Q-16GBXL
Hard Drive
Western Digital
Hard Drive
Samsung 850 EVO
Optical Drive
Memorex Lightscribe dvd
Power Supply
Seasonic SS-850KM Active PFC F3
Cooling
Thermalright Silver Arrow IB-E Extreme
Case
Silverstone Redline RL02b
Operating System
Win X 64 bit
Monitor
Pixio 27" 1440P
Keyboard
yes
Mouse
Evoluent VM4
Mouse
yes
Audio
Creative Soundblaster Z
Audio
Sennheiser 428 headphones
▲ hide details ▲
miklkit is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #34 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 10:53 AM
professional curmudgeon
 
looniam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,177
Rep: 767 (Unique: 444)
Quote: Originally Posted by miklkit View Post
This bill was introduced by a Democrat. McTurtle has not been letting anything from Democrats even get voted on. This bill will die in the committee.


Quote:
Cosponsor Date Cosponsored
Sen. Hawley, Josh [R-MO]* 03/12/2019
it is a bi-partisan bill. its the republican who is making the biggest noise . .

Sen. Josh Hawley proposes ban of Candy Crush, other so-called ‘loot box’ apps that he says target kids

"Name as many uses for a brick as you can in one minute." - interview at graphics-chip maker Nvidia for a campaign-manager job
Fermi: it's better to burn out than fade away.
Remember the golden rule of statistics: A personal sample size of one is a sufficient basis upon which to draw universal conclusions.
"The more you buy, the more you save." - Jensen Huang GTC 2018
loon 3.2
(18 items)
CPU
i7-3770K
Motherboard
Asus P8Z77-V Pro
GPU
EVGA 980TI SC+
RAM
16Gb PNY ddr3 1866
Hard Drive
PNY 1311 240Gb
Hard Drive
1 TB Seagate
Hard Drive
3 TB WD Blue
Optical Drive
DVD DVDRW+/-
Power Supply
EVGA SuperNova 750 G2
Cooling
EKWB P280 kit
Cooling
EK-VGA supremacy
Case
Stryker M [hammered and drilled]
Operating System
Win X
Monitor
LG 24MC57HQ-P
Keyboard
Ducky Zero [blues]
Mouse
corsair M65
Audio
SB Recon3D
Audio
Klipsch ProMedia 2.1
▲ hide details ▲


looniam is offline  
post #35 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 02:22 PM
I <3 narcissists
 
bigjdubb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 5,051
Rep: 208 (Unique: 132)
This would be enraging if it wasn't so incredibly ironic to see an American politician lashing out at a "pay-to-win" system. Makes it hard not to crack a smile when you're thinking about the situation. They never seem to run out of ways to waste tax dollars but trying to pass laws to protect people from their own stupidity is one of the more popular ways of doing it. If you need to sell a pile of poop to the american public, all you need to do is...



Gets them every time.


I'm curious as to what the rider is that they are trying to sneak through with this bill.

El Computer
(15 items)
CPU
AMD Ryzen 7 2700X
Motherboard
Asrock X470 Taichi Ultimate
GPU
Radeon VII
GPU
EVGA 2080ti FTW3 Ultra
RAM
G.SKILL TridentZ RGB
Hard Drive
Samsung 970 EVO
Hard Drive
CRUCIAL 1TB MX500 M.2
Power Supply
EVGA G3
Cooling
CORSAIR H150I PRO
Case
LianLi PC-O11 Dynamic
Operating System
Windows 10 Pro
Monitor
LG 32GK850G
Monitor
50" Vizio 4k TV
Keyboard
Logitech G110
Mouse
G.SKILL RIPJAWS MX780 USB
▲ hide details ▲


bigjdubb is offline  
post #36 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 03:03 PM
New to Overclock.net
 
skupples's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Fort Lauderdale
Posts: 17,302
Rep: 525 (Unique: 296)
Quote: Originally Posted by DNMock View Post
But there already is specifically worded legislation in place. Slot machines are every bit as much of a game as Battlefield is and they are governed by pre-existing legislation, so I don't see why more is needed.



Just because I despise something doesn't mean that I think the government needs to step in and outlaw it. Lots of people hate violence and nudity in games. If it's ok for lootboxes to be banned because I hate those, it's ok for violence and nudity to get banned because someone else hates that.

Whenever the govt gets involved, there is always a very real chance the baby gets thrown out with the bath water...
Quote: Originally Posted by looniam View Post
so they're mostly discussing mobile games, based on the way i read that, though they don't specifically state.

Also, I agree. I think that they should at most amend the existing gambling laws to include a subset for micro-transaction systems.

You should have to be 18 & go down to the casino to play a game that uses slot machine RNG in its P2W store

also... as a slight aside - It's a HUUUUUGE market, the govt will guaranteed find a way to tax micro-transactions. That was confirmed as soon as they saw the FortNite numbers went live.

They should levy the taxes levied against sports gambling sites for legal 18 and over loot box participation.


don't read this as me wanting a tax. Read this as predicting a tax coming into existence.

Last edited by skupples; 05-15-2019 at 03:07 PM.
skupples is offline  
post #37 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 04:21 PM
BOINC Cruncher
 
Diffident's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Bawlmer, MD
Posts: 1,468
Rep: 96 (Unique: 64)
I have a simple solution. If you don't like loot boxes, don't buy any, also don't give your kid your credit card. Problem solved.

Team Boinc! - Forum Folding War Team
Gentoo Linux - Telemetry Free Since 1999!
Washington Capitals 2018 Stanley Cup Champions
Boinc Desktop
(15 items)
CrunchAholic
(10 items)
NAS
(7 items)
CPU
AMD Ryzen 7 1700X
Motherboard
ASRock X370 Taichi
GPU
AMD Radeon VII
RAM
HyperX Predator
Hard Drive
Hyper Predator M.2
Power Supply
EVGA 850 G2
Cooling
Watercool Heatkiller IV PRO AM4 CPU Block
Cooling
EKWB Coolstream XE 240 Radiator
Cooling
EKWB Coolstream PE 360 Radiator
Cooling
Watercool Heatkiller 150mm Tube Res
Case
Thermaltake View 31 Tempered Glass RGB Edition
Operating System
Gentoo Linux
Monitor
Alienware AW3418DW
Keyboard
Coolermaster Masterkeys Pro S
Mouse
Roccat Kone EMP
CPU
Intel Xeon E5-2670
CPU
Intel Xeon E5-2670
Motherboard
Asrock Rack EP2C602
GPU
EVGA 1070ti FTW
GPU
EVGA 1070ti FTW
RAM
64 GBs Samsung M939B1K70CHD-CH9 PC3-10600R
Hard Drive
Samsung HD322HJ
Power Supply
Corsair AX1200
Case
Rosewill RSV-L4000
Operating System
Gentoo Linux
CPU
i3-4130T
Motherboard
GIGABYTE GA-H97N-WIFI
RAM
CORSAIR CMX16GX3M2A1600C11
Hard Drive
Western Digital Red 10 TB x3
Hard Drive
Western Digital Red 8 TB
Case
Fractal Design Node 804
Operating System
Gentoo Linux
▲ hide details ▲


Diffident is offline  
post #38 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 04:36 PM
New to Overclock.net
 
tubers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,436
Rep: 50 (Unique: 46)
Quote: Originally Posted by skupples View Post
its deeper than that. They're using Casino cash grab tactics, while advertising to children. Tobacco & booze get in big trouble for doing the same. This should follow suit, just like sports gambling sites advertising towards kids.

I agree, ESRB was better than a govt. solution, but I don't think there's a private sector response to this as the private sector goes where the money goes, which is loot boxes. I have this sinking suspicion that we'll all be playing 10-20 year old games, over and over, within 10 years from now... Minus a few VR outliers, just to avoid the one armed bandit centric titles.
Yes. It's basically a more direct form of casino tactics aimed at all demographics including children.

Lobbyist will probably win.

I'd assume casinos give huge taxes.

As kids are now weened on phones and get them into microtransaction asap, it'll be normal to nickel and dime everyone in a few decades as casinos become too boring when the young people of today become seniors.

There are so many seniors inside casinos.

MT based gaming rules the industry and will be the future casino of children today.

At the end of the day, it seems we are wired to LOVE certain implementations of RNG since we still have base animal components in our heads.

Putting labels on games won't be enough. We might need mandatory education about skinner boxes, marketing, advertisement, MTs lures to children ASAP.

Teaching people has never really been enough so we may actually need the help of bigger forces like the govt. on this one unless there are a mass of lawyers drooling at suing these MT companies and somehow peddling we have scientifically less free will than what even learned people think they have.
tubers is offline  
post #39 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 11:20 PM
professional curmudgeon
 
looniam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,177
Rep: 767 (Unique: 444)
Quote: Originally Posted by skupples View Post
so they're mostly discussing mobile games, based on the way i read that, though they don't specifically state.

Also, I agree. I think that they should at most amend the existing gambling laws to include a subset for micro-transaction systems.

You should have to be 18 & go down to the casino to play a game that uses slot machine RNG in its P2W store

Spoiler!
maybe a copy pasta from the bill:

Quote:
B) in subparagraph (B)—
(i) by inserting ‘‘or minor’’ after ‘‘child’’ each place the term appears;
(ii) by inserting ‘‘or minors’’ after ‘‘children’’; and
(iii) by striking ‘‘website or online service’’ and inserting ‘‘website, online service, online application, or mobile application’’;
i'll spare the definitions listed at the beginning of the bill since they look rather obvious. but if interested here is a download link for a copy that was submitted
but i will point out the table of contents to show this doesn't have to do with gambling or really even loot boxes:
Spoiler!

btw, i quoted a part of section 3. nor do i suggest anyone using a hand held looks at the PDF file - because legalese is hard to read small.

i'll try to put it in a nut shell, COPPA (which a lot of people doesn't know exists) states (generally) that online services that knowing deal with a minor (under 13) must inform their parents they posses and get consent to do anything with the minor's personal information.

as far as i see, there is nothing directly related to gambling, risk, reward, chance or random. to does look to deal with what that article on the hill summarized; extends the age to 15 (under 16) and gives the states' attorney general the authority to enforce the regulations along with the FTC.

(edit; also the "new" Youth Privacy and Marketing Division. - yay another do nothing gov. job!)

now i can see loot boxes and more in the line of micro-transactions being involved as any credit card information would need the parent informed and consent given to use it, as a third party is involved.

ya know a few will criticize parents and some times rightfully so, but since i don't think most parents can sit w/their child every minute while they're online, this does give them a tool to monitor (some of ) that activity.

"Name as many uses for a brick as you can in one minute." - interview at graphics-chip maker Nvidia for a campaign-manager job
Fermi: it's better to burn out than fade away.
Remember the golden rule of statistics: A personal sample size of one is a sufficient basis upon which to draw universal conclusions.
"The more you buy, the more you save." - Jensen Huang GTC 2018
loon 3.2
(18 items)
CPU
i7-3770K
Motherboard
Asus P8Z77-V Pro
GPU
EVGA 980TI SC+
RAM
16Gb PNY ddr3 1866
Hard Drive
PNY 1311 240Gb
Hard Drive
1 TB Seagate
Hard Drive
3 TB WD Blue
Optical Drive
DVD DVDRW+/-
Power Supply
EVGA SuperNova 750 G2
Cooling
EKWB P280 kit
Cooling
EK-VGA supremacy
Case
Stryker M [hammered and drilled]
Operating System
Win X
Monitor
LG 24MC57HQ-P
Keyboard
Ducky Zero [blues]
Mouse
corsair M65
Audio
SB Recon3D
Audio
Klipsch ProMedia 2.1
▲ hide details ▲



Last edited by looniam; 05-15-2019 at 11:24 PM.
looniam is offline  
post #40 of 48 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 03:29 PM
New to Overclock.net
 
skupples's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Fort Lauderdale
Posts: 17,302
Rep: 525 (Unique: 296)
Quote: Originally Posted by tubers View Post
Yes. It's basically a more direct form of casino tactics aimed at all demographics including children.

Lobbyist will probably win.

I'd assume casinos give huge taxes.

As kids are now weened on phones and get them into microtransaction asap, it'll be normal to nickel and dime everyone in a few decades as casinos become too boring when the young people of today become seniors.

There are so many seniors inside casinos.

MT based gaming rules the industry and will be the future casino of children today.

At the end of the day, it seems we are wired to LOVE certain implementations of RNG since we still have base animal components in our heads.

Putting labels on games won't be enough. We might need mandatory education about skinner boxes, marketing, advertisement, MTs lures to children ASAP.

Teaching people has never really been enough so we may actually need the help of bigger forces like the govt. on this one unless there are a mass of lawyers drooling at suing these MT companies and somehow peddling we have scientifically less free will than what even learned people think they have.
sounds like a great task for a non-profit.


going from school to school, educating the youngin'...

I'm 30, and have a clear memory of all the warnings I got about tech as a kid, and they all still 100% apply to this day. I never wanted pics of myself posted on our custom hotmail sites, or then myspace when I younger. I was known for breaking a flip phone or two when folks wouldn't delete something upon request.

my folks also wouldn't let me just sit on my game boy 24/7 when in public. I was forced to be a human, instead of an npc on /follow, & beating Zelda on NES was a family activity. Growing up, gaming was a group activity. I miss 4 way split all nighters, or even just having a guild in general.

Last edited by skupples; 05-16-2019 at 03:35 PM.
skupples is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 2 (0 members and 2 guests)
 


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off