[PCGamesN] Nvidia says it has offered anti-lag settings like AMD’s for “more than a decade” - Page 7 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[PCGamesN] Nvidia says it has offered anti-lag settings like AMD’s for “more than a decade”

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post #61 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-03-2019, 06:30 AM
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interesting...

the biggest obstacle to paintball is the cost, second is location. though most folks that're interested typically live near woods, etc to play in.

A case of good paint was $100 last time I played, a decade ago. N most these noobs run around in flame thrower mode. <3 my tippmann A5 cuz it never chopped paint, & never wasted it either. Those angel and autococker kids though... You can literally track the stream of paint back to the person throwing it, whereas with the A5 its just a quick volley, n done. You also never have to field strip the damn thing due to stuff getting in your laser eye, etc etc.

best simple marker of all time - A5.

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post #62 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-03-2019, 12:56 PM
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ok ok, now I'm confuse, is the Antilag gaming implemented in Radeon video cards or Ryzen CPU? what video cards series and what cpu series?

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post #63 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-03-2019, 01:04 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by christoph View Post
ok ok, now I'm confuse, is the Antilag gaming implemented in Radeon video cards or Ryzen CPU? what video cards series and what cpu series?
GPU drivers.

Most cards made from GCN, and Navi.

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post #64 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-03-2019, 03:04 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post
GPU drivers.

Most cards made from GCN, and Navi.

ok thanks

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post #65 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-03-2019, 10:34 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by ToTheSun! View Post
Speak for yourself. I'll be topping the leaderboard!
All the way to the sun, that's pretty high.


@skupples : yeah paintball ain't cheap compared to airsoft that's for sure, it does have that added cost, no that most airsofters spend little... but you can if you know the market which is near impossible for new to the "sport" or if you don't care and just buy something cheap.
Plus PB is quite hated by public in general due to the endless mess people playing it make. Sure AS leaves plastic around but it's hard to see, you can get biodegradable or clean up after yourself once in a while. With PB... good luck cleaning up all that paint
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post #66 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-07-2019, 02:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by Omega X View Post
For a company that its leadership claims that its on top, they sure are very insecure.
They aren't lying, they've had an option called "Maximum pre-rendered frames" under Manage 3D Settings for years that reduces the input lag. Might not be the same way as Anti-Lag but both end up reducing input lag.

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post #67 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-07-2019, 06:27 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
They aren't lying, they've had an option called "Maximum pre-rendered frames" under Manage 3D Settings for years that reduces the input lag. Might not be the same way as Anti-Lag but both end up reducing input lag.
It's set by most modern games to 1. And you can't go below 1 in NVCP either.

As speculated it's like pre rendered frames setting.

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/a...5700-xt/2.html

There used to be setting of 0 but that's not available and maybe not even possible for NV cards anymore. Where as AMD has hardware scheduler still and may do a 0.

I couldn't find it tested anywhere and with the again broken AMD drivers I don't blame anyone for not testing it, there are 2060S, 2070S, 5700, 5700XT, 3000 series CPUs to review all in 1-2 weeks because AMD and NV are nuts and have price fix launch at same time at same prices with near identical value.

---

Again being explained as pre rendered frames:


DX11 only. Lowering the driver delay, aka how much CPU "pre renders" frames for GPU. I bet they set it to 0 and "synced CPU and GPU" instead of having 1-3 frames buffer/pre render, 1 is common but for say CF/SLI one would use even more.

Last edited by JackCY; 07-08-2019 at 01:29 PM.
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post #68 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-08-2019, 10:04 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by UltraMega View Post
I don't see anything in the article to back up the claim in the headline. Is it weird that I knew who the OP was gonna be before I even opened this thread?

There are lots of ways to reduce image quality and in turn reduce input lag/increase FPS. AMD's claim is that if FPS is ~even, they will have lower input times and they backed this up with demos. I'm sure Nvidia will scramble to counter this somehow, but this isn't it.


Stop spreading propaganda for Nvidia.
Quote: Originally Posted by VeritronX View Post
The setting they're reffering to pretty much has to be the max pre-rendered frames one as it's the only one I can think of that's been in there that long and directly effects input lag. Pretty sure the default for most things is 3 frames (or at least I remember it being that for gta5) and you can turn it down to 1 frame these days. If you are running at 60fps locked then setting it to 1 frame would reduce your input lag by ~33.4ms.

The key difference here is AMD can reduce it to 0 frames because they still use a hardware scheduler in their gpu designs, while nvidia is stuck with a minimum of 1 frame delay because they do it in the driver on your cpu.
Quote: Originally Posted by JackCY View Post
The default on most games is 1 pre-rendered frame, if not do yourself a favor and force it to 1 in NVCP but who still uses 3 frames in their game engines?

I suppose Navi still has a HW scheduler and that's good I think. Nvidia moved this kind of load to CPU with Kepler hence their performance is more CPU tied and CPU limited and also loves to cause higher DPC latency as the driver takes long time sometimes/every new launch lol.

Where is that magic setting in NVCP to reduce latency? Please Nvidia do tell us, because pre-rendered frames isn't it, that's something that's supposed to be and is set by the application/game and should only be force changed in NVCP when the change works and doesn't cause issues.
Even Polaris 10 has almost 10ms advantage vs GP106, 3rd party measurements with a high speed camera. https://youtu.be/L42nx6ubpfg?t=850

RX580 vs GTX1060
16.87ms vs 25.33ms, no sync
Best cases: 16.87ms vs 18.87ms

There is latency to be cut down in drivers of both corporations. They bloat them endlessly year over year. 500MB NV driver is freakin' unreal. Not that AMD's 352MB is any better. That's some damn lot of code that one can fit into so many MBs.
The timestamp is in the comments but I found out the way NVidia reduces input lag is by reducing image quality on a hardware level. I have a slight suspicion this is where the nvidia driver DPC lag comes from.

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post #69 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-09-2019, 01:40 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by RamenRider View Post
The timestamp is in the comments but I found out the way NVidia reduces input lag is by reducing image quality on a hardware level. I have a slight suspicion this is where the nvidia driver DPC lag comes from. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OY8qvK5XRgA
Watch out! That DPC latency will definitely break everything in all ways possible! AFAIK, nVidia employ a software scheduler, as opposed to AMD's hardware scheduler, the former of which being the main culprit. In any case, sub-milisecond DPC latency spikes in no way influence the kind of latency one WOULD FEEL.

Now, if you could explain exactly what you mean by decreasing latency by reducing image quality "on a hardware level", I'm all ears.

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post #70 of 75 (permalink) Old 07-10-2019, 09:33 AM
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I will watch the PCW.

"This is our start of a new naming system. To avoid confusion." LOL that's each launch haha.

7970, old system
280x, new system same product
290, 390, 280, old system
Fury, new system
480, 580, 590 old system
Vega, new system
Radeon VII, new system
Navi, new system

They are only changing the naming to be able to charge higher price, confuse non technical customers, etc.
Now they start at 5700 so that by the time they get to 8000 they will change it again.

"Windows 1903 update scheduler improvement"
So far seems like a joke for most part when 3rd party tested. Best bet is still to have something like process lasso that will force lock programs to CCX and CCD only expanding when necessary.

NV does reduce image quality, so does AMD very likely, it was the old war when they were competitive, they tried to find any way to boost performance especially at the time by reducing texture filtering quality. Even today the defaults on NV cards are Quality = with optimizations but you can select High Quality which supposedly disables optimizations, while it also has performance and high performance for boosting those benchmark scores. There is also LOD clamping and other settings.

None of this has anything to do with DPC latency issues of Nvidia which are more likely caused by a bit of carelessness when launching new series with new driver.

I do like AMD architectures often more but it can't be denied that their focus on performance/clocks was minimal until RDNA and they pushed for parallelism instead. HW scheduler is good to have. Even with RDNA it doesn't seem that they figured out the difference between NV's arch. and theirs and as such some game engines are again dropping performance on RDNA a lot when they are optimized for Maxwell/Paxwell/Tuxwell. There are more features in Tuxwell too at the moment and that has not always been the case and I don't mean ray tracing etc. I mean the pure graphics capabilities support. H264 encoder on AMD is again an afterthought = broken and unusable quality, meanwhile I think they changed their HEVC entirely not sure but didn't they move it to shaders or something, there was video or article explaining this longer time ago, so that HEVC is now fairly beastly and they don't have a session limit as NV GeForce does. This is likely because RDNA is going into more modern streaming platforms be it XBOX, PS5 or Stadia, etc. these want to move to HEVC finally although I wonder why not AV1 at this point.


RIS is a driver toggle but CAS (Fidelity FX) the good sharpening is developer only aka devs need to use it for users to see it.
Anti lag supposedly isn't number of back buffers and we will see on July 7th what it is (well we still haven't, show us the source code then, I want to see), pre rendered frames are something else than back buffers, not recommended for AAA games (varying results) only for eSports games. I bet it's that pre rendered frames = 0 thanks to hardware scheduler, aka CPU and GPU in sync but for graphics heavy games you really need pre rendered frames 1 for smoother frametimes and performance.

If you want you can still inject ReShade and code or get your own CAS or other sharpening you like. I use fine sharp in games that need sharpening after having AA and one can tune that very well to minimize the sharpening effect. Can't stand the halo artifacts of sharpening but the finesharp in ReShade can be tuned fairly well.
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