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post #31 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 11:19 AM - Thread Starter
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I notice that some people still have the mindset that "New" is the best or only way to do things and that, for the most part, anything old is irrelevant. Back when I got my first 212 I did research, watched videos and such and this cooler was praised for it's ability to handle overclocked CPU's and the price was pretty good in my opinion. Over time as other options became available the same people who reviewed the 212 would start praising the newer stuff and would scoff at the 212. The 212 didn't suddenly stop being able to cool a CPU or perform well, it still does the exact same thing it was designed for and was once praised for. Some people have to have the newest things to feel like they are relevant or to impress. Take myself though... I have 3 of these 212's laying around. I could have just bought another "NEW" cooler like the bquiet! Pure Rock and I did research it "I like how it looks" and I saw that its TDP is 20w less than the Hyper 212 EVO's I already have. I looked at a few other coolers in the similar style of the 212 and any increase or decrease in thermal conductivity was marginal... so, I saved my money and I am using this "old and irrelevant" cooler that is a little worse, as good or a little better than current air coolers.

For those that had a bad experience using the 212 or poor performance from it can probably chalk it up to operator error. Given that it fits in their build and or is not defective. Either improper installation or unrealistic expectations of the cooler i.e. asking it to do more than it is designed for or a combination of both. I know it's limitations and I installed it correctly. I have cool air being directed to it in a fairly large chamber in this somewhat large case. My ambient room temps do not go above 75*f on hot days (currently 68*f as of this post), I have no pets to put fur in the case and I don't smoke and all intakes have filters. It cools an overclocked AMD 8350 @ 4.5 as it did an old OC'd Intel E8400. The only thing it's missing is.... RGB :O lol
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post #32 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 12:16 PM
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No one's judging the 212 for no being cool enough anymore...unles you mean thermally. It's an enthusiast forum, most of us care about function and quality.
Even without overclocking where the difference between coolers is minimal, the Pure Rock is better. Obviously you can't trust the TDP on a cooler made by Cooler master, look up the actual performance with actual load testing.
No one even said the 212 is a flat out horrible cooler, you can just get better ones for the money. This isn't hard to figure out. Literally no one said that the 212 isn't great becasue it's not new or cool enough. FWIW the Pure Rock and H7 have been out since 2015 if that's considered "new" or "hip" to you.
The thermal difference between a 212 and a PureRock or H7 or 140 Direct is noticeable enough on stock CPUs of the era, overclocking them makes it more drastic and using something like an 8700k or even a 9700k could be 10c or so. I guess from that perspective the 212 is indeed not cool enough anymore.
But yeah, blame the user when many of us not only used the 212 but also several other coolers without issue. It's takes a special kind of idiot to mess up installing an air cooler and if it were possible to do so doesn't that speak volumes on how poor the quality is on the 212? Every air cooler I have operates within 1c no matter how many times I've moved them around.

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post #33 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 01:35 PM - Thread Starter
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There has to be other factors involved if people think it isn't up to the task of cooling today. It is cooling my mild overclock better than my H115i did my stock clock when the H115i was working fine... and the EVO 212 is quieter. Now if someone is trying to cool an extreme overclock with it that even custom water cooling loops barely keep in check then yes... it's not up to the task. Your last sentence... "Every air cooler I have operates within 1c no matter how many times I've moved them around" would pretty much make all of your air coolers the same... at that point only the price is different. Price is only going to make something a better or worse bargain, not better performer. I think $23 was the most I paid for one of my 212's. When I get my 2700X I will grab the AM4 bracket to see how it does on that just for kicks, if it fits the Lian Li, before I custom loop it. I'm not bashing anyone on here, just saying that if it wasn't cooling a cpu then unless it is a defective cooler, it's operator error or unrealistic expectations of the cooler or both. That's just common sense.

When I said "New" I meant newer than the original 212 Evo. Most internet forums are for enthusiast. I have been an enthusiast on this forum for 6 years... of computers for over 15. I keep up to date on computers and related items as well as prices. I shop smart and use common sense and have realistic expectations of what my computer will be used for and set it up accordingly. I plan ahead for upgrades as needed. The only reason for my next build is because I am gifting this computer to my daughter.... that and I want to use an M.2 SSD. The next build beginning draft is as follows and some parts have already been ordered:

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post #34 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 01:46 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by evilthx View Post
There has to be other factors involved if people think it isn't up to the task of cooling today. It is cooling my mild overclock better than my H115i did my stock clock when the H115i was working fine... and the EVO 212 is quieter. Now if someone is trying to cool an extreme overclock with it that even custom water cooling loops barely keep in check then yes... it's not up to the task. Your last sentence... "Every air cooler I have operates within 1c no matter how many times I've moved them around" would pretty much make all of your air coolers the same... at that point only the price is different. Price is only going to make something a better or worse bargain, not better performer. I think $23 was the most I paid for one of my 212's. When I get my 2700X I will grab the AM4 bracket to see how it does on that just for kicks, if it fits the Lian Li, before I custom loop it. I'm not bashing anyone on here, just saying that if it wasn't cooling a cpu then unless it is a defective cooler, it's operator error or unrealistic expectations of the cooler or both. That's just common sense.

When I said "New" I meant newer than the original 212 Evo. Most internet forums are for enthusiast. I have been an enthusiast on this forum for 6 years... of computers for over 15. I keep up to date on computers and related items as well as prices. I shop smart and use common sense and have realistic expectations of what my computer will be used for and set it up accordingly. I plan ahead for upgrades as needed. The only reason for my next build is because I am gifting this computer to my daughter.... that and I want to use an M.2 SSD. The next build beginning draft is as follows and some parts have already been ordered:

1. Case – Lian Li PC-011 Dynamic
2. Motherboard – ASRock X470 Taichi Ultimate
3. CPU – AMD Ryzen 2700X
4. OS Drive – Samsung M.2 NVMe 500GB 970 EVO Plus
5. Storage Drives – Western Digital Blue SSD 2TB
6. Graphics Card(s) – Vega 64
7. Memory – G.Skill TridentZ RGB DDR4 3200 32GB 4x8GB
8. CPU Water Block – EK Velocity D-RGB Nickle
9. GPU Water Block – EK FC Radeon Vega RGB

If your 212 is outperforming your H115i then your H115i was not "fine." My H115i is on par with my Le Grand Macho RT which was substantially better than the H7 it replaced which is better than the 212.

If a mid-high range AIO performed worse than a $20 cooler from 2008, no one would run an AIO.

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post #35 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 02:36 PM
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lol

I love my evo, they're great for testing new gear but... 99% of clc should outperform it.

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post #36 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 02:38 PM
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I have a Hyper 212+, I bought it in 2011. It still runs and cools my 8700k, with the same fan!!! This fan has outlived it's presumable 50,000hr lifespan.

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post #37 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 03:38 PM
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Apologies in advance of the wall of text guys.

Quote: Originally Posted by Gilles3000 View Post
I'm not sure where you live, but over here:
  • The Raijintek Themis Evo is cheaper and performs about the same.
  • The Arctic Freezer 34 is cheaper and performas about the same
  • The be quiet! Pure Rock, is cheaper, quieter, performs similarly and is way better looking.

And you can get way better coolers if you're willing to spend just a few bucks more.
How about we just stick to MSRP comparison? Sales come and go and when you start throwing around prices, well let's just agree that msrp:msrp is the ideal comparison as far as expense. You can still have your cake and eat it to if you're convinced that the other coolers are indeed better. Personally I think aluminum heat sinks are just begging for trouble. I have lost count how many Liquid Metal posts I have seen in the last year. Now I won't try talking people out of using Liquid Metal. I use it on my delids. No push out and it keeps good contact between the die and the IHS when applied correctly. However that stuff will lock an Aluminum base cooler to an IHS in a New York minute. So run what you want but I wish people would consider this as a possible want for anyone asking about "cheap solid performing coolers". If not considering, at least ASK if that may be a possibility and explain this fact.

Quote: Originally Posted by evilthx View Post
I notice that some people still have the mindset that "New" is the best or only way to do things and that, for the most part, anything old is irrelevant. Back when I got my first 212 I did research, watched videos and such and this cooler was praised for it's ability to handle overclocked CPU's and the price was pretty good in my opinion. Over time as other options became available the same people who reviewed the 212 would start praising the newer stuff and would scoff at the 212. The 212 didn't suddenly stop being able to cool a CPU or perform well, it still does the exact same thing it was designed for and was once praised for. Some people have to have the newest things to feel like they are relevant or to impress. Take myself though... I have 3 of these 212's laying around. I could have just bought another "NEW" cooler like the bquiet! Pure Rock and I did research it "I like how it looks" and I saw that its TDP is 20w less than the Hyper 212 EVO's I already have. I looked at a few other coolers in the similar style of the 212 and any increase or decrease in thermal conductivity was marginal... so, I saved my money and I am using this "old and irrelevant" cooler that is a little worse, as good or a little better than current air coolers.

For those that had a bad experience using the 212 or poor performance from it can probably chalk it up to operator error. Given that it fits in their build and or is not defective. Either improper installation or unrealistic expectations of the cooler i.e. asking it to do more than it is designed for or a combination of both. I know it's limitations and I installed it correctly. I have cool air being directed to it in a fairly large chamber in this somewhat large case. My ambient room temps do not go above 75*f on hot days (currently 68*f as of this post), I have no pets to put fur in the case and I don't smoke and all intakes have filters. It cools an overclocked AMD 8350 @ 4.5 as it did an old OC'd Intel E8400. The only thing it's missing is.... RGB :O lol
I have a Pitt Bull and I smoke. My Dog isn't in the area of my system and I somewhat smoke outside.

But yeah I have smelled PC components from a smoker's system. Absolutely foul experience.

Quote: Originally Posted by evilthx View Post
There has to be other factors involved if people think it isn't up to the task of cooling today. It is cooling my mild overclock better than my H115i did my stock clock when the H115i was working fine... and the EVO 212 is quieter. Now if someone is trying to cool an extreme overclock with it that even custom water cooling loops barely keep in check then yes... it's not up to the task. Your last sentence... "Every air cooler I have operates within 1c no matter how many times I've moved them around" would pretty much make all of your air coolers the same... at that point only the price is different. Price is only going to make something a better or worse bargain, not better performer. I think $23 was the most I paid for one of my 212's. When I get my 2700X I will grab the AM4 bracket to see how it does on that just for kicks, if it fits the Lian Li, before I custom loop it. I'm not bashing anyone on here, just saying that if it wasn't cooling a cpu then unless it is a defective cooler, it's operator error or unrealistic expectations of the cooler or both. That's just common sense.

When I said "New" I meant newer than the original 212 Evo. Most internet forums are for enthusiast. I have been an enthusiast on this forum for 6 years... of computers for over 15. I keep up to date on computers and related items as well as prices. I shop smart and use common sense and have realistic expectations of what my computer will be used for and set it up accordingly. I plan ahead for upgrades as needed. The only reason for my next build is because I am gifting this computer to my daughter.... that and I want to use an M.2 SSD. The next build beginning draft is as follows and some parts have already been ordered:

Spoiler!
Excellent case but you won't be running the 212 in there is my guess? The air flow design of a 011 Dynamic isn't very cood for that and if you wanted to you could get a 011 Air for around the same price.

Quote: Originally Posted by The Pook View Post
If your 212 is outperforming your H115i then your H115i was not "fine." My H115i is on par with my Le Grand Macho RT which was substantially better than the H7 it replaced which is better than the 212.

If a mid-high range AIO performed worse than a $20 cooler from 2008, no one would run an AIO.
Agreed. But I will say that I ran an H50 and while it was pretty solid, you simply couldn't run a 24/7 clock worthy of an enthusiast board and CPU. Which is all I use and I had that before I had the 212. The 212 performed better in that regard(on a lapped 955BE) than the H50. H50 has it's uses still, but it's a like for like. 120mm : 120mm cooling surface. Most AIO severely outclass a 120mm Air cooler. It's a matter of Case. If you can mount a 240, 280 or 360 and have the budget to get one, an AIO is a solid expense. I only used the H50 to figure out if I wanted to watercool. I did and the rest is as they say, history.

Quote: Originally Posted by skupples View Post
lol

I love my evo, they're great for testing new gear but... 99% of clc should outperform it.
Agreed.

Quote: Originally Posted by farmdve View Post
I have a Hyper 212+, I bought it in 2011. It still runs and cools my 8700k, with the same fan!!! This fan has outlived it's presumable 50,000hr lifespan.
Indeed!

I gave the fan to my bro and ran Yate Loons on it. Now it's running something else in a client build.

~Ceadder

I am really starting to feel my Oats as a long time member of OCN. Why did we go back to this system again?

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post #38 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 03:39 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by evilthx View Post
There has to be other factors involved if people think it isn't up to the task of cooling today. It is cooling my mild overclock better than my H115i did my stock clock when the H115i was working fine... and the EVO 212 is quieter. Now if someone is trying to cool an extreme overclock with it that even custom water cooling loops barely keep in check then yes... it's not up to the task. Your last sentence... "Every air cooler I have operates within 1c no matter how many times I've moved them around" would pretty much make all of your air coolers the same... at that point only the price is different. Price is only going to make something a better or worse bargain, not better performer. I think $23 was the most I paid for one of my 212's. When I get my 2700X I will grab the AM4 bracket to see how it does on that just for kicks, if it fits the Lian Li, before I custom loop it. I'm not bashing anyone on here, just saying that if it wasn't cooling a cpu then unless it is a defective cooler, it's operator error or unrealistic expectations of the cooler or both. That's just common sense.

When I said "New" I meant newer than the original 212 Evo. Most internet forums are for enthusiast. I have been an enthusiast on this forum for 6 years... of computers for over 15. I keep up to date on computers and related items as well as prices. I shop smart and use common sense and have realistic expectations of what my computer will be used for and set it up accordingly. I plan ahead for upgrades as needed. The only reason for my next build is because I am gifting this computer to my daughter.... that and I want to use an M.2 SSD. The next build beginning draft is as follows and some parts have already been ordered:

1. Case – Lian Li PC-011 Dynamic
2. Motherboard – ASRock X470 Taichi Ultimate
3. CPU – AMD Ryzen 2700X
4. OS Drive – Samsung M.2 NVMe 500GB 970 EVO Plus
5. Storage Drives – Western Digital Blue SSD 2TB
6. Graphics Card(s) – Vega 64
7. Memory – G.Skill TridentZ RGB DDR4 3200 32GB 4x8GB
8. CPU Water Block – EK Velocity D-RGB Nickle
9. GPU Water Block – EK FC Radeon Vega RGB
Within 1c of what it did before. I had really hoped you'd be able to pick up on the fact that I was talking about the user error part...since you brought it up.

If a 212 is cooling as good as your 115, the 115 was broken, likely the typical dying pump.
It's been said several times now that for the original $20-25 price, the 212 is a good deal. At $30-35 there are better options or cheaper ones.


As for "extreme" overclocking...if you'd consider safe voltage extreme then no, the 212 is not cut out for that either. My 4790k when stock was running up in the 90s on one core with only 1.25v, after I delidded it 80c was pretty easy to hit running 1.35v. That's not horrible I guess but for the thousandth time there are coolers in that price range that would have been much better. I'm not sure what the argument even is at this point...do people deny that they exist?
We all know the 212 can do alright on most CPUs, there are still better options.
Literally no one said it's not able to cool modern CPUs.

Quote: Originally Posted by SpeedyVT
If you're not doing extreme things to parts for the sake of extreme things regardless of the part you're not a real overclocker.
Quote: Originally Posted by doyll View Post
The key is generally not which brands are good but which specific products are. Motherboards and GPUs are perfect examples of companies having everything from golden to garbage function/quality.
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post #39 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 04:15 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Ceadderman View Post
Apologies in advance of the wall of text guys.



How about we just stick to MSRP comparison? Sales come and go and when you start throwing around prices, well let's just agree that msrp:msrp is the ideal comparison as far as expense. You can still have your cake and eat it to if you're convinced that the other coolers are indeed better. Personally I think aluminum heat sinks are just begging for trouble. I have lost count how many Liquid Metal posts I have seen in the last year. Now I won't try talking people out of using Liquid Metal. I use it on my delids. No push out and it keeps good contact between the die and the IHS when applied correctly. However that stuff will lock an Aluminum base cooler to an IHS in a New York minute. So run what you want but I wish people would consider this as a possible want for anyone asking about "cheap solid performing coolers". If not considering, at least ASK if that may be a possibility and explain this fact.
Not sure what you're getting at?

The superior be quiet! Pure Rock has the same MSRP as the 212 EVO, and has a copper base, so liquid metal doesn't affect it.

Besides that, from what I've seen, liquid metal tim's come with waring labels not to use it on aluminium. You'd have to be a special kind of careless to actually use it on an aluminium base, and at that point you deserve the consequences.
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post #40 of 83 (permalink) Old 04-21-2019, 08:58 PM - Thread Starter
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I will be liquid cooling the Lian Li.

@ white owl... i'm with ya.
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