What kind of heatpipes are usually used in air coolers? - Page 2 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community
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What kind of heatpipes are usually used in air coolers?

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post #11 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-08-2020, 03:23 PM
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Thank you for the explanation.
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post #12 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-09-2020, 06:18 AM
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Heatpipe orientation issues are not at all new. When Noctua released their NH-C12P they said to not position it with heatpipe bend above fins.



Whle sintered heatpipes will wick liquid up, it's not as much or as fans as in horizontal or down orientation. TheLab.gr used to do extensive cooler testing including all orientations, but not as in depth any more.

Temperaturre differences are minimal for most coolers. The wick is able to move liquid up for several inchs before it becomes a problem. Only problems I ever heard of were in cases with motherboard mounted with I/O panel up using really big, long 3x fan GPU coolers and liquid collecting in tip of heatpipes instead of wicking back to cooler base.

Different orientations:
* horizontal (οριζόντιος) orientation (side?), with fans arranged PUSH, at various airflow and thermal stresses.
* Lateral orientation with fans arranged PUSH, at various airflow and thermal stresses.
* Vertical orientation with fans arranged PUSH, at various airflow and thermal stresses.

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post #13 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-09-2020, 07:07 AM
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Position doesnt matter on low TDPs. But on high TDP s (300 , 400 W...) the difference is night and day. I showed that with Ashura on Vega 64. Vega can generate up to 400 W on 486 mm2 die size.

C-type coolers (like noctua NH-C14S) are much weaker than tower coolers. C-type coolers have heatpipes in C (they go from just one side of the base). Tower coolers have heatpipes from both sides of the base; they are double. For example TRUE has 6x6 heatpipes in U shape, each around 38 cm long. It s like 12x6 in L shape, each 19 cm long. Noctua NH-C14S has 6x6 in C over 20 cm long. Noctua cant cool more than around 220 W on GPU, while tower cooler on large enough die size (easier heat transfer) can even cool 500 W of TDP in vertical position.
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post #14 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-09-2020, 07:20 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by carmack View Post
Position doesnt matter on low TDPs. But on high TDP s (300 , 400 W...) the difference is night and day. I showed that with Ashura on Vega 64. Vega can generate up to 400 W on 486 mm2 die size.

C-type coolers (like noctua NH-C14S) are much weaker than tower coolers. C-type coolers have heatpipes in C (they go from just one side of the base). Tower coolers have heatpipes from both sides of the base; they are double. For example TRUE has 6x6 heatpipes in U shape, each around 38 cm long. It s like 12x6 in L shape, each 19 cm long. Noctua NH-C14S has 6x6 in C over 20 cm long. Noctua cant cool more than around 220 W on GPU, while tower cooler on large enough die size (easier heat transfer) can even cool 500 W of TDP in vertical position.
I agree with most of what you say. But just to clarify, while most do towers use 'U' shapped heatpipes, some tower coolers have 'L' shaped heatpipes. Also while one 'U' heatpipe can transfer more heat to fins than one 'L', I don't think it's twice as good as two 'L' shaped heatpipes.

Phanteks Owners Club Ways to Better Cooling
i7 980 @ 3.55GHz =PH-TC14PE w/2x TY-143 fans =Crucial Ballistix 3x4GB =GA-X58A-UD5 =ASUS GTX580 DirectCU II =Enermax Modu84+ =Define R2 w/3x TY-140 case intake fans; all PWM controlled by CPU fan socketPhanteks Enthoo Primo MoBo Rampage III Extreme CPUi7 980X
@ 4.0GHz =R1 Ultimate w/2x TY-143 fans =Dominator GT 6x2GB =Rampage III Extreme =ASUS GTX580 DirectCU II =TX850 =Enthoo Primo w/ custom castor base

Last edited by doyll; 05-09-2020 at 07:33 AM.
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post #15 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-09-2020, 08:15 AM
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Almost 10 years ago poparamiro from lab501 did an awesome GPU coolers review. Long story short he mounted thermalright spitfire (heatpipes in L), Noctua NH-c14 (heatpipes in C) and TRUE copper on gtx 480. He tested in furmark on higher voltages (up to 1.2 Vcore). All coolers were tested with 38 cm delta fan.

Well, spitfire couldn't stabilize the temp on 1.1 Vcore, noctua nh-c14 was even worse on 1.1 Vcore (Gpu went to throttle faster) and then the real deal, TRUE. TRUE cooled gtx 480 on 1.2 V no problem. It stabilized temperature very quickly.

This happens because gtx 480 can generate over 300 W of TDP in furmark on 520 mm2 die size (similar to Vega 64).

See, GPUs are infact much better cooler testing devices than CPUs. Noctua NH-C14 will cool i7 4770k (around 120 W when OCed) for example, but is powerless on power hogs GPUs like gtx 480 or Vega 64, VII and so on.

When U is split in the middle you get an L from both sides. So 1 HP in U (for example 40 cm) is like 2 in L (20 cm).
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post #16 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-09-2020, 08:56 AM
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Intersting data! Thanks!

But when a 'U' is split in the middle the phase change is still in same area of vapor chamber over heat source as in 'L' heatpipe so 1/2 of the vapor moves each way in 'U' shaped pipe or one way in 'L' shaped pipe. Mabye att max TDP heatpipe might be able to mow a little more vapor both ways in a 'U' than in a 'L', but not much .. assuming lengh of it is engineered properly.

Honestly the best way to test any cooler is on a heat source that can be controlled accurately, and neither CPUs or GPUs will do that. They do not run exactly the same each pass. That is why TheLab.gr developed their code name Japapeno test station and has used it for many years testing at 60w, 120w, 180w, 240w and 300w. This is same type of test station Anandtech uses (60w, 100w, 150w, 200w, 250w & 340w). GamerNexus did a good article about how inconsistant most testing is.

Phanteks Owners Club Ways to Better Cooling
i7 980 @ 3.55GHz =PH-TC14PE w/2x TY-143 fans =Crucial Ballistix 3x4GB =GA-X58A-UD5 =ASUS GTX580 DirectCU II =Enermax Modu84+ =Define R2 w/3x TY-140 case intake fans; all PWM controlled by CPU fan socketPhanteks Enthoo Primo MoBo Rampage III Extreme CPUi7 980X
@ 4.0GHz =R1 Ultimate w/2x TY-143 fans =Dominator GT 6x2GB =Rampage III Extreme =ASUS GTX580 DirectCU II =TX850 =Enthoo Primo w/ custom castor base

Last edited by doyll; 05-09-2020 at 09:17 AM.
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post #17 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-09-2020, 09:43 AM
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It can be proven that one in HP U can transfer twice as much heat than in C. I alredy have TRUE with only one heatpipe and it can transfer much more than 40 W of heat. I will purchase noctua NH-C14 and mount it on a GPU. I will test how much it can cool (until it couldn t stabilize the temperature) in original state (6x6 HP). Then I will cut 5 of them and than see how much heat it can transfer.
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post #18 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-09-2020, 01:16 PM
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TRUE cools over 100 W on i5 4590 with only one heatpipe. https://easyupload.io/36skim
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post #19 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-09-2020, 03:23 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by carmack View Post
TRUE cools over 100 W on i5 4590 with only one heatpipe. https://easyupload.io/36skim
How are you determining it's 100w of heat?

Phanteks Owners Club Ways to Better Cooling
i7 980 @ 3.55GHz =PH-TC14PE w/2x TY-143 fans =Crucial Ballistix 3x4GB =GA-X58A-UD5 =ASUS GTX580 DirectCU II =Enermax Modu84+ =Define R2 w/3x TY-140 case intake fans; all PWM controlled by CPU fan socketPhanteks Enthoo Primo MoBo Rampage III Extreme CPUi7 980X
@ 4.0GHz =R1 Ultimate w/2x TY-143 fans =Dominator GT 6x2GB =Rampage III Extreme =ASUS GTX580 DirectCU II =TX850 =Enthoo Primo w/ custom castor base
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post #20 of 26 (permalink) Old 05-09-2020, 03:59 PM
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Power consumption is around 104 W (hw monitor readings).
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