[Youtube] JoergSpave: Youtube: The Clock is Ticking - Page 3 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[Youtube] JoergSpave: Youtube: The Clock is Ticking

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post #21 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 03:55 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by ToTheSun! View Post
Whether or not Youtube is in the black is not relevant to how they should treat their partners, which, in the end, are what grew the platform and made them money. If Google doesn't give content creators a fighting chance, soon we'll be left with nothing but beauty gurus and corporate mouth pieces, and the owners of the channels you and I like to watch will eventually go back to their jobs if they have the chance.
The most subscribed and viewed are already dominate by corporations from entertainment etc.
PDP is one of the only comedians on YouTube making any dent into that. Again with entertainment.

So people will stop wasting time on YT and move somewhere else, that's more of a problem for YT though that they will lose creators and viewers.

Quote: Originally Posted by LancerVI View Post
Again, I know it's not 1:1, but there is some precedent for this already. If youtube is deemed to be a public forum, then they have a serious problem on their hands, even in the US.

I think of YouTube as a global, digital public square where thoughts, ideas, etc are exchanged. If the courts see it in a similar way, there could be similar consequences for Google.
It's hardly a public venue and what not where free speech needs to be protected, it has been a censored platform from day 1, there is no free speech on YT. And they still have country restrictions based on IP (as if IP ever was indication of a country... never was never will be) and other nonsense.
It's as censored as it gets in some ways, the only things that do slip are those that are not in English because Google doesn't bother to hunt those down with their algorithms, so while you won't find stolen western movies in English on YT you will in most other languages from other regions, etc.

If they start imposing rules upon YT (and so all other video sharing platforms based in that country) by law then well that's not great either, all it will do is make it government censored what is allowed and what is not on there.


A lot of old channels that complained about losing viewers? It's completely normal as has been scientifically explained. Those channels also often decrease in releasing videos and their quality too. So why would people go back. Their reliance on random viewers given to them by YT's ever changing algorithm... that's not a good idea for a business is it.

IGM can try all they want, if they have any success it's likely going to end up limited to a region, such as Germany or EU only after it's forced by some law. YT is changing all the time, sometimes those changes are good sometimes not, like any other platform and forum.
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post #22 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 04:28 PM - Thread Starter
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I didn't say I supported or didn't support the idea that it's a public forum. I said that courts could see it that way. Don't confuse what I said as "I believe it's a public forum." Because I didn't. I'm saying that we're clearly in new territory and I could see a court looking at it that way. The same way a mall can't preclude people from gathering signatures for an initiative in the common areas of a mall, I can see a court saying the same thing about common "areas" of the Internet. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the idea, especially when YouTube is basically THE video sharing spot on the internet.
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post #23 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 05:17 PM
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@jacky CY:

They really are not demanding much. They pretty much just want transparency about how Youtube works, and they want Youtube to behave predictably.

Right now when they upload a video, there's a chance that the video gets demonetized. This happens seemingly randomly. They have to guess why certain videos are bad and why other videos are fine. They just want be able to predict themselves if a certain video will be fine before uploading it.

That "employee" thing is just an idea from their lawyers to put some pressure onto Google. No one wants to actually fall under the laws for employees.
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post #24 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-05-2019, 07:24 PM
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ohh i'm sure a group of people will show up supporting said idea soon, specially in the US where they'd then get employer group policy insurance, which is better than, and 25% the cost of an exchange platinum plan.

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post #25 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-06-2019, 03:21 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by JackCY View Post
It's hardly a public venue and what not where free speech needs to be protected
The SCOTUS already deemed Twitter a public venue as soon as politicians started treating it as one. It's not a very outlandish concept, to expect youtubers, who are entertainers as much as anyone on TV is, have the right to some job security. And that entails transparency and accountability - on both parts.

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post #26 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-07-2019, 11:23 AM
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They can try, in the end Alphabet/Google will do what ever they want anyway. They might get so annoyed that they will cancel the whole partnered thing and leave those to truly fend for themselves instead of relying on adds provided to them by the platform. Google has had it long time coming and while there are plenty annoyed users/uploaders there are even more to replace them aren't there. If they want it to be brand advertisement platform then it will be just that, You in name will no longer refer to common people but to companies and corporations, it already does anyway.

The search, monetization, etc. it's all biased and always will be.

Uploading to YouTube for profit? Expect this: your video may appear in searches but not in recommendations on other videos, you won't get a cent from ads if any ads are shown on your video and you've actually enabled monetization on your videos if not then your video will definitely not appear on recommendations.

The recommendations can indeed blow up views high and that has changed in recent years and upset uploaders when their content stopped being recommended, when notifications got less intrusive and you don't get notified automatically for every single upload. This tanked views of many regular uploaders from day to day because they relied on the random viewers from recommendations etc.

Transparency from any company is an illusion, same goes for governments. Predictability in information technology business... that's a first, it changes fast, what other predictability is there, one service is awesome one year and completely dead the next. YouTube has lasted long enough, supported a crap ton to survive while similar to Amazon it's killing off competition or buying it.

They need leverage to be able to push against YT anywhere, such as being able and willing to leave and go do their business elsewhere. YT would be singing a different tune (if allowed to be shown by Google in their search etc.) when a lot of the creators and major popular uploaders would quit within a year to a different platform or altogether.
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post #27 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-12-2019, 12:58 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by JackCY View Post
It's hardly a public venue and what not where free speech needs to be protected,
What makes you said that?
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post #28 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-13-2019, 11:50 AM
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form the union make their own website and get the guys to avertize the new site
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post #29 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-15-2019, 07:21 AM
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Youtube, moreover Google/Alphabet need to be broken up. There is too much inter-dependency and focus on marketing and creating psychological profiles on consumers, especially when a significant percentage of the population is using and being observed by google's various platforms on a regular basis.

Because of this profiling across the board, they have a lot of leverage in dictating what the consumer sees and pinpointing how to draw them in for more viewtime, ad clicks, and even going so far as to altering political leanings (who needs campaign spending limits on ads when your whole platform is an ad machine you can run for 'free').

What we need, however, is a new approach to video hosting and monetization. One that is not developed in such a way as to manipulate interests, and run circles around trending topics (a sort of advanced echo chamber that encourages you to stay) paid for by Alphabet's clients. Hopefully, we could see a system that is less reliant on software to deliver ultimatums to creators about which types of content to upload and what thumbnails to chose in favor of encouraging thoughtful independent work.

In my mind, a system where uploading is easy and simple as the current youtube model, but which has some increased barriers to monetization to help alleviate the issues of spam, hyper political, stolen content, etc focused accounts. This could be something like retaining the first $XX.XX of a monetized video in order to ensure a human is paid to watch and make determinations about the content. Is it legal? Is it stolen? Is it original? Is it fair use? Obviously higher profile uploaders would likely have more freedoms to submit monetized videos, but making sure that new creators are submitting in good faith and not allowing the DMCA system to be weaponized due to a few bad apples forcing the platform's hand would obviously be ideal.

Obviously this is not very likely to happen because it hurts the bottom line. No amount is too much for megacorps, and power must be consolidated until it extinguishes us from this marble in space. But I would argue that there is more value in a world that is worth living in, with responsibly managed services and freedoms that allow people to chase their aspirations and be rewarded/seen by those who would enjoy their work. Not just manipulation and money money money.

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post #30 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-16-2019, 12:27 PM
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I've said this before, change needs to start with the people. Trying to wrangle Google or GAFAM (Google Apple, Facebook & Amazon + Microsoft) into what YOU want it to be isn't going to work.

I've successfully de-GAFAM'ed my entire life, email, social, phone, desktop, etc. They don't hold jack over me.

With the technology available nowadays it's entirely possible to move to completely open source, blockchain decentralized platforms. The only thing that needs to change is the consumer, the consumer needs to make the leap instead of staying in the safety blanket of GAFAM.

There's LBRY, some open source distributed social media platforms, LBC currency as a form of patreon, there's even old things like usenet discussion groups which are a lot more free and de-centralized yet identical to things like reddit.

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