[Tom's/CB] Intel Comet Lake Packs Up to 10 Cores - Page 3 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[Tom's/CB] Intel Comet Lake Packs Up to 10 Cores

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post #21 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-14-2019, 07:59 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by mouacyk View Post
you're doing it wrong. HEDT owners go for the lanes, man
QFT

You can have your extra 300 mhz over my 7900X. Meanwhile I will be enjoying my 20+ extra PCIE lanes.

edit: to be honest, given that the 7900X will be 2 years old or so when this drops and still have the added pcie lanes to boot, I still think it was a reasonably good deal at twice the price on release. GPU's used to be the same way, wait 2 years and you can get comparable performance for half the price, but that seems to no longer be the case



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post #22 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-14-2019, 11:19 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
The 9900k is a 95w chip, some Ryzen boards allow the 2700x to go up to 130w with XFR2 when properly cooled.

Yes? And many Intel boards have the 9900K working outside of Intel's guidelines out of the box, exceeding the 95w TDP by a lot, hence what I said. Technically and unlike AMD (unless you use PBO, which clearly states is outside the warranty), that puts the CPUs working outside of the warranty, although I'm mostly sure at this point that by not enforcing those guidelines, Intel is ok with it because it paints the 9900K in a better light and will thus honour all such warranties.
PBO is different than XFR, XFR doesn't void the warranty and allows the processor to run at higher frequency with better cooling. Which reviews showed uses up to 130w with proper cooling.

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post #23 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-14-2019, 11:20 AM
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Another 14nm refresh... ouch. If AMD and TSMC really have 7nm down, then for the first time ever AMD will have a substantial processing node lead over intel, and with a very competitive architecture.
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post #24 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-14-2019, 12:10 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by 7850K View Post
they already did that back in 2017 though

2016
i7-6850K 3.6Ghz(3.8Ghz)
6 core hyperthreaded
$617
+ HEDT motherboard

2017
i7-8700K 3.7Ghz(4.7Ghz)
6 core hyperthreaded
$370
+ mainstream motherboard

i7-6800K and i7-5820K existed with 28 PCIE lanes


------


Also i9-9900k when limited to 95W TDP tanks to 3.6GHz after you reach 7 cores (https://www.anandtech.com/show/13591...-power-for-sff).

Quote:
When a single core is loaded, the CPU is in 5.0 GHz mode as we are well under the power limit. There’s a slight decrease of 200 MHz in the 95W at two cores, but this disappears when 3-6 cores are loaded, with both setups being equal. The major difference happens however when we are at 7-8 cores loaded: because of the power consumption, the Core i9-9900K in 95W mode drops down to 3.6 GHz, which happens to be its base frequency.

This is about the same speed as Ryzen 7 2700 (65W) , see https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/...7_2700/16.html.




With no HT, the i7-9700k requires ~ 140W: https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/..._9700K/18.html
Quote:
Throttling in this context means that the processor will not boost nearly as high. Instead of 4.7 GHz all-core (140 W), it was running at around 4.1 GHz when left at stock TDP.

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post #25 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-14-2019, 12:36 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by mothergoose729 View Post
Another 14nm refresh... ouch. If AMD and TSMC really have 7nm down, then for the first time ever AMD will have a substantial processing node lead over intel, and with a very competitive architecture.
Just like their current Radeon VII, I don't believe we'll see anything special from Zen on 7nm compared to Intel's next 14nm refresh.

Intel's 14nm process is surprisingly efficient. I don't see an issue with Intel's next 14nm generation competing with AMD's Zen at 7nm. The IPC increase doesn't look spectacular. Cascade Lake is expected to receive an IPC increase which I'm sure will trickle down to these new generations.

Actual stock without MCE enabled:
6700k @ 4.0Ghz uses 110w
9900k @ 4.2Ghz uses 98w

Zen 2 @ NoClue Ghz uses 130w that matches
Core i7 9900k @ 4.7Ghz out of the box uses around 150-190w depending on the board.

Manual overclocks:
6700k @ 4.7Ghz uses 180w
9900k @ 4.7Ghz uses 130w
2700x @ 4.2Ghz uses 130w

https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3...-duration-z390

Quote:
For reference, here’s what the frequency functionality looks like when operating under settings with MCE disabled via XMP II and the “No” prompt. This plot takes place over a 23-minute Blender render, so this is a real-world use case of the i9-9900K. Notice that there is a sharp fall-off after about 30 seconds, where average all-core frequency plummets from 4.7GHz to 4.2GHz. Notice that the power consumption remains at almost exactly 95W for the entire test, pegged to 94.9W and relatively flat. This corresponds to the right axis, with frequency on the left. This feels like an RTX flashback, where we’re completely power-limited. The difference is that this is under the specification, despite the CPU clearly being capable of more. You’ll see that the frequency picks up again when the workload ends, leaving us with unchallenged idle frequencies.
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post #26 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-14-2019, 12:48 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
PBO is different than XFR, XFR doesn't void the warranty and allows the processor to run at higher frequency with better cooling. Which reviews showed uses up to 130w with proper cooling.

Yes, exactly. XFR doesn't void the warranty, but what Intel motherboard makers are doing with the 9900K's out of the box settings technically does make the CPU run out of spec. As I said though, Intel probably doesn't care and will honour the warranties, otherwise they would have enforced the guidelines at this point.

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post #27 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-15-2019, 09:32 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
Just like their current Radeon VII, I don't believe we'll see anything special from Zen on 7nm compared to Intel's next 14nm refresh.

Intel's 14nm process is surprisingly efficient. I don't see an issue with Intel's next 14nm generation competing with AMD's Zen at 7nm. The IPC increase doesn't look spectacular. Cascade Lake is expected to receive an IPC increase which I'm sure will trickle down to these new generations.

Actual stock without MCE enabled:
6700k @ 4.0Ghz uses 110w
9900k @ 4.2Ghz uses 98w

Zen 2 @ NoClue Ghz uses 130w that matches
Core i7 9900k @ 4.7Ghz out of the box uses around 150-190w depending on the board.

Manual overclocks:
6700k @ 4.7Ghz uses 180w
9900k @ 4.7Ghz uses 130w
2700x @ 4.2Ghz uses 130w

https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3...-duration-z390
I am also skeptical of TSMC 7nm, although I do not think Radeon VII is the best judge of potential. AMD clearly phoned that one in, at least when it comes to gaming performance.

Ryzen 2 is competitive enough with coffee lake that even a modest 20%-30% increase in die area or efficiency would put them over the top in a number of important metrics. I don't think it will be like athlon 64 days. IPC will likely be similar with a slight lead for intel, but AMD is going to be significantly ahead when it comes to power efficiency and parallelism for servers; at least until intel can finally produce a mature node (whether that is 10nm or a 7nm of their own).
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post #28 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-15-2019, 11:28 AM
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Let's say it's the same increase as Vega 64 to Radeon VII , you'd still end up with a ~4.9GHz R7 2700X successor with ~ 4.6GHz all core clocks

Radeon VII = 1800MHz
Vega 64 = 1550MHz ; 13.4 TFLOPs vs 12.5 TFLOPs


For same power +16% clockspeed , which is less than the 7nm projection of +25% performance for same power and half the power for same performance

In practice the Radeon VII is around 20-30% faster than Vega 64.

Also take into account that there's $130 boards that can support this new CPU (i.e. B450 Pro Carbon , B450-E STRIX) that aren't utterly stripped down in feature-set and if you're staying under 130W just about any B450 board would suffice. If you want a board that can properly support a i9-9900K you'll need a Z390 board (the typical ones are Gigabyte Aorus Pro, Asrock Z390 Phantom Gaming 6 / Extreme 4 if you can deal with lack of debug features, Asus z390-A , MSI Z390 Edge).

MSI and ASUS already rolled out the new AGESA which is rumored to be for Ryzen 3000 series. That means a May/July launch is highly likely.


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Last edited by AlphaC; 03-16-2019 at 10:14 PM.
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post #29 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-16-2019, 09:04 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by AlphaC View Post
Let's say it's the same increase as Vega 64 to Radeon VII , you'd still end up with a ~4.9GHz R7 2700X successor with ~ 4.6GHz all core clocks

Radeon VII = 1800MHz
Vega 64 = 1550MHz ; 13.4 TFLOPs


For same power +16% clockspeed , which is less than the 7nm projection of +25% performance for same power and half the power for same performance

In practice the Radeon VII is around 20-30% faster than Vega 64.

Also take into account that there's $130 boards that can support this new CPU (i.e. B450 Pro Carbon , B450-E STRIX) that aren't utterly stripped down in feature-set and if you're staying under 130W just about any B450 board would suffice. If you want a board that can properly support a i9-9900K you'll need a Z390 board (the typical ones are Gigabyte Aorus Pro, Asrock Z390 Phantom Gaming 6 / Extreme 4 if you can deal with lack of debug features, Asus z390-A , MSI Z390 Edge).

MSI and ASUS already rolled out the new AGESA which is rumored to be for Ryzen 3000 series. That means a May/July launch is highly likely.
I can agree. It would be extremely foolish to underestimate AMD on the CPU side right now. Yes, Radeon VII is a let down, but it's using the same underlying architecture as Vega.

Ryzen's underlying architecture is powerful and efficient. I think worst case scenario is that Ryzen 3000 will simply match the IPC and Clockspeeds of the 9900K.

Comet Lake will likely be an all-out 14nm defense for team blue until they can get their 10nm settled.

It's entirely possible we'll clockspeeds in the mid 4's to low 5's on low-end parts. If intel can't find a way to get Sunny Cove out by this year, expect next gen. intel to look like the following:

i3: 4c/8t
i5: 6/12t
i7: 8c/16t
i9: 10c/20t

Very likely these desktop parts will run extremely hot.

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post #30 of 38 (permalink) Unread 03-18-2019, 01:50 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by mouacyk View Post
you're doing it wrong. HEDT owners go for the lanes, man
what? not the channels?

well the lanes are meaningless if just running single GPU and 3 nvme drives.... especially when my mobo is only ITX. do like having the 10 core and 64Gb ram though but not when pleb sockets gets to enjoy the same amount of cores for far less dosh.

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