[WCCF] Intel 10nm Sunny Cove ’10th Gen Ice Lake’ ES CPU Single-Core Performance Leaks Out - Page 2 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[WCCF] Intel 10nm Sunny Cove ’10th Gen Ice Lake’ ES CPU Single-Core Performance Leaks Out

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post #11 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 01:53 PM
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That difference in clocks vs IPC is most probably showing Sunny Cove's best case scenario, where it performs 40% better than Skylake / Kaby Lake / Coffee Lake / Whiskey Lake.

The problem is that on average, per Intel's own official statements, the average IPC gain is 18%.

The other problem is that per Intel's own official statements, 10nm+, which is the node being used to make mobile Ice Lake, can't clock as high as 14nm++. And we can see that, as they announced a max of 4.1 Ghz Boost, whereas just this year they launched a Whiskey Lake based 15w mobile CPU with a 4.8 Ghz boost, the i7-8665U. And from what I recall, the fastest SKU that they've announced so far only turbos to 3.9 Ghz, not even 4.1 Ghz.

And finally, the other problem is that not only is it mobile up to 28w, it only goes to 4C/8T. None of this allows them to have competitive desktop SKUs and when it comes to mobile, it will be a draw in some cases, and a slight win in others, but nothing outstanding.

They have been talking a lot about decoupling the process from the architecture, so who knows maybe if 10nm++ or 7nm isn't doable in time, maybe they can put Ice Lake on 14nm++ for desktop parts to buy some time. The TDP will be higher most probably, though.

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post #12 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 01:54 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
GeekBench shows Ice Lake-U has a 17% increase from the laptops compared to Skylake based mobile chips.

Edit: Here's the result: https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/13476044
If true then great (well prices remain to be seen). This is the kind of innovation I expect to see from Intel on a regular basis going forward. None of this 3-5% IPC increase for the otherwise same old crap year after year.

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post #13 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 02:04 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by dantoddd View Post
I wonder why the clock speeds are so low?
Early ES are low ghz usually. They aren't binned and tested to higher speeds, just to make sure they work, so intel can ship them to other manufacturers to make supporting hardware and test motherboards, test memory compatibility etc.


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post #14 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 02:37 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by magnek View Post
If true then great (well prices remain to be seen). This is the kind of innovation I expect to see from Intel on a regular basis going forward. None of this 3-5% IPC increase for the otherwise same old crap year after year.
Well, there was nothing Intel could do since their architecture was tied to the node and they were stuck with 14nm for a long time. It is more like they were forced into that position.

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post #15 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 02:51 PM
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Competition forces innovation.

More like Intel didn't want to innovate since there was no competition.

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post #16 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 03:02 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by magnek View Post
Competition forces innovation.

More like Intel didn't want to innovate since there was no competition.
ARM is far bigger threat than anything Intel has faced in last 20 years.
Well, innovation was still there, just wasn't accessible and affordable for consumers lol. I don't think Intel intentionally put 10nm on backburner for 5 years. Sunny Cove would have been 2018 product if they didn't have 10nm troubles.

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post #17 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 03:18 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Kpjoslee View Post
ARM is far bigger threat than anything Intel has faced in last 20 years.
Well, innovation was still there, just wasn't accessible and affordable for consumers lol. I don't think Intel intentionally put 10nm on backburner for 5 years. Sunny Cove would have been 2018 product if they didn't have 10nm troubles.
Kinda defeats the whole point then LOL.

Yes I'm aware their innovation was mostly in the mobile space and related to power efficiency. But you gotta admit advances on the desktop side has been sorely lacking since Sandy Bridge, mainly because they didn't have to do anything after AMD fell so far behind with their Bulldozer epic fail.

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post #18 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 05:35 PM
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post #19 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 05:51 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
Most likely the reason we won't be seeing Ice Lake desktop skus any time soon. We've saw the same low clock speeds when Intel's first 14nm chips were out(Broadwell)
14nm wasn't much slower. The atoms were slightly faster and the desktop Broadwell was analogous to Crystalwell, not Haswell. Crystalwell has the extra memory controller and L3 layout and edram like Broadwell-c and also clocked slower than Haswell: http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Core_i...processor.html

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post #20 of 29 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 06:19 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post
They have been talking a lot about decoupling the process from the architecture, so who knows maybe if 10nm++ or 7nm isn't doable in time, maybe they can put Ice Lake on 14nm++ for desktop parts to buy some time. The TDP will be higher most probably, though.
I'm not sure if they can. One reason they were having issues going to 10nm but TSMC didn't was because TSMC kept using a gold substrate or path-trace layer (some sort of layer) while Intel was moving to cobalt which is much harder to make a good electrical connection or bond to. Why? Intel obviously sees enough pros to outweigh the cons...one con being the hold up of months of new CPU sales all around the board and giving up the leader position for a while.

Sure Intel stuck with 14nm, why on earth would you attempt full production on 10nm and a new arch when you can still sell millions of chips to the masses without doing that? They actually had to retrofit 10nm production back to 14nm because they were making less than demand and you're always better off getting paid for something that's paid for vs something that's not. AMD will likely have Intel for a year or so while Intel is perfecting the process but once they do I imagine we'll see a 20-50% bump in performance over Coffee Lake and Intel will be back on it's 5-10% yearly tick tock scale unless AMD is always stepping over the top.

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