[ElChapuzasInformático][AMD] First AMD Ryzen 5 3600 (X470) Review (Spanish) - Page 7 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[ElChapuzasInformático][AMD] First AMD Ryzen 5 3600 (X470) Review (Spanish)

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post #61 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-25-2019, 06:30 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by tyvar View Post
With silicon chip design hitting hard physical limits in what can be done, we may be looking at much longer development times for improved processors.

Lots of efforts will now be spent in optimizing chip layouts (by hand even) and software, to give us those last bits of IPC increases without ballooning die sizes, while software cuts out the cruft to run more efficently. Thats the future of computing technology over the next decade or two.
Intel's Sunny Cove has 18% faster single core IPC. Geek Bench is already showing the results. The question is if Intel can release a desktop with Sunny Cove cores in 2020 or are we actually going to have to wait until 2022.

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post #62 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-25-2019, 07:37 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by aDyerSituation View Post
I want to see what the 3800x can clock to. 4.7 all core should match a ~5ghz 9900k hypothetically
If everything scaled then yeah that's about where I think it'll end up.

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post #63 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 12:37 AM
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I see many are complaining about high voltages for 7nm part, but as Lisa told us that going down to 7nm made moving electrons harder, so maybe they overcome this by increasing the voltage but the current decreased? [P=IV], after looking at 3600 leaks I saw that the max core voltage was 1.45V and max power was 10.5~11W, for contrary my 2700X at same voltage consumed 13~14W.
So who can test this?
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post #64 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 12:40 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
Intel's Sunny Cove has 18% faster single core IPC.
vs ATOM processors. this isn't even close to an apples to apples comparison, sunny cove is a LOW POWER ARM competing chip, it's not a core i chip. Furthermore Intel lost about 20% clock speed to go with that IPC boost on sunny cove, meaning the ipc gain was at best a wash at worse a downgrade in performance.

But keep smoking that ganja believing this means desktop CoreI chips are coming with that type of performance gains.

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post #65 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 01:07 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by zGunBLADEz View Post
idk but that 3600 is pretty close on those benchmarks against the 9900K which dont follow tdp to begin with and boost to 50x
mind you 42x $199 cpu is not even the x cpu

you going to show fps on 1080P and 720P show me as well gpu usage graphs as i want to see how far they are between both in that department..

dont see no point of seeing fps with 60-70% load on a gpu uncapped fps.. we need gpu load graphs on cpu bottlenecks

even a ram tweak match that

btw 42x on skylakeish cpu in cb15 is 180
amd have the ipc advantage big time this time..
You seem to be forgetting that for many people, the rules are a) Intel is better and b) we must adjust, caveat, explain, excuse, and deflect as necessary to achieve that end, should facts get in the way

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post #66 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 06:17 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
Intel's Sunny Cove has 18% faster single core IPC. Geek Bench is already showing the results. The question is if Intel can release a desktop with Sunny Cove cores in 2020 or are we actually going to have to wait until 2022.
And how long has/Will it taken them to get Sunny Cove out? Doesn't that just prove my point that the days of chips getting massively obsoleted in just a year or so are long gone?

Both Intel and AMD are getting more IPC by going wider, but that does eat up silicon area, which they are going to be running out of unless they start increasing die size, which will lower yields and raise costs. So they have to wait for a shrink, but we are almost out of shrinks.

And I don't think the 18% IPC uplift will be enough, Sunny Cove desktop isn't going to be facing Zen 2, but Zen 3 or perhaps even Zen 5! if its delayed on desktop that long. By that point AMD if it just improves IPC by 5% will probably have the IPC crown still.

Pushing Sunny Cove to mobile is the right call, there they will have a IPC lead (although probably only 10% or lower in most workloads) over the Zen 2 based mobile chips coming out this winter.

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post #67 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 06:30 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by m4fox90 View Post
You seem to be forgetting that for many people, the rules are a) Intel is better and b) we must adjust, caveat, explain, excuse, and deflect as necessary to achieve that end, should facts get in the way
when i got the 1700 my first ryzen cpu then it follow 1800x and 2700x ppl were claiming the 7700K was faster on 720P and 1080P resolutions and yada yada i dont use those resolutions to begin with they are old and dont reflect real gaming performance.. Nobody seems to remember anymore the 7700k cpu it didnt last too long XD then they release the 8700K which is a good cpu by itself dont get me wrong i have one XD then they release this thing called 9900K which doesnt offer anything an 8700K can offer you for $150 dllrs more...

Then i tweaked my ryzen with good kits of ram and thats when the gap closes even more against my intels cpus..

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post #68 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 11:57 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Hwgeek View Post
I see many are complaining about high voltages for 7nm part, but as Lisa told us that going down to 7nm made moving electrons harder, so maybe they overcome this by increasing the voltage but the current decreased? [P=IV], after looking at 3600 leaks I saw that the max core voltage was 1.45V and max power was 10.5~11W, for contrary my 2700X at same voltage consumed 13~14W.
So who can test this?
Use hwinfo64 : hwmonitor is woefully inaccurate much of the time.

The issue with voltage/power is at low power you can pump more voltage into the chip (i.e. remember power usually goes up with square of voltage) because it will be lower temperature and also lower current. The way Ryzen boosting works is thermal / temp, power, and max clock spec (by SKU aka model number).

At 4 core boost you'll often see the chips going nuts on voltage, 1.45-1.55V even but at all core boost it is usually <1.4V and <1.35V or so for AVX loads.


----

Also:
Quote: Originally Posted by https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/bzt50i/amd_robert_hallock_not_single_core_boost/eqyopus
If PBO off with 3800X: max clock 4.5GHz.
If PBO on with 3800X: you configure a new max boost clock up to 4.7GHz. You can do that in 25MHz jumps.
The exact clocks the part hits depends on all the usual factors: electrical capacity of the socket, motherboard, temps, etc.
This is the first time PBO has been officially supported on AM4 Ryzen chips. And the first time PBO has also allowed the user to override the boost clock.
PBO:


Quote: Originally Posted by https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/8j72sz/do_not_use_f22f23_with_ryzen_gen_1_on_gbt_gaming/dyxmc02
A well-cooled Ryzen will go to 1.5V or 1.55V on its own. It's designed to do this, because low temperatures offset higher voltages. And higher voltages are useful for more clockspeed and more performance.When I read these posts, I am reminded that people often forget that duration of applied voltage and temperature are important to silicon health. Here's my bone stock 1800X (work PC) after running for 24 hours, with the average voltage the CPU saw over 24H.
https://i.imgur.com/7RkZjQl.png
What we can see:
  1. XFR happened! We see 4099MHz and 1.55V peaks.
  2. The average over 24H was an incredibly mild sub-1.1V.
  3. (Not shown) CPU never got hotter than 61C.
tl;dr: Everything is fine. This post is unnecessarily alarmist about an intended behavior of the Ryzen processor.

More definitions from Robert Hallock:
https://www.reddit.com/comments/b8a5ft
Quote:
Precision Boost 2
This is the basic boost functionality of the Ryzen Processor. We call it "precise" because it can choose clockspeeds in 25MHz increments, rather than 100MHz increments as with older processors.

eXtended Frequency Range 2 (XFR2)
XFR2 (eXtended Frequency Range 2) allows the processor to sustain a higher average frequency as your cooling situation improves.
Stepping back, there are two ways to design a processor: assume every user will have the worst case scenario and stay inside those constraints, or assume that some users will have better thermal scenarios and design algorithms that can expand to fill that space. We uniquely chose the latter with Ryzen and XFR2.

Precision Boost Overdrive
By now you know the basic Precision Boost 2 formula looks at VRM current and socket power as metrics that can cause boost increase/decrease/duration. Digging a layer deeper:
  • The socket power is evaluated in watts with a metric called "PPT"
  • The mobo VRM current is evaluated in amps with a metric called "TDC" when VRMs are limited by temperature
  • The mobo VRM current is also and concurrently evaluated a metric called "EDC" when VRMs are limited by electrical capacity
TL;DR Official AMD-Supported Feature Matrix
  1. All Ryzen/Threadripper 2000 Series: Precision Boost 2, XFR2
  2. Threadripper 2000 Series: Above+PBO

► Recommended GPU Projects: [email protected] , [email protected] (FP64) (AMD moreso) ► Other notable GPU projects: [email protected] (Nvidia), GPUGrid (Nvidia) ► Project list



Last edited by AlphaC; 06-26-2019 at 12:07 PM.
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post #69 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 12:13 PM
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I hope there significant difference in regards to power consumption and temperature at 4.7-4.8ghz for the 3900x/3950x. One reason i was switching over to AMD, the hedt platform really requires an 480mm+ radiator dedicated to the CPU which I don't have case for and don't want to invest into. I already have one of the top thick 360mm radiator cooling the CPU.
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post #70 of 112 (permalink) Old 06-26-2019, 01:54 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
Intel's Sunny Cove has 18% faster single core IPC. Geek Bench is already showing the results. The question is if Intel can release a desktop with Sunny Cove cores in 2020 or are we actually going to have to wait until 2022.
Higher IPC yes, but its looking like clock speeds on 10nm are going to be ~10% lower than 14nm++ if the mobile parts are anything to go by. Plus, by the time Sunny Cove arrives on desktop, it'll be competing against Zen 3 or later which will be on the newer 7nm+ EUV process.

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