[TR]It looks like AMD Big Navi may not be able to take on the RTX 3080 Ti after all - Page 2 - Overclock.net - An Overclocking Community

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[TR]It looks like AMD Big Navi may not be able to take on the RTX 3080 Ti after all

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post #11 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 02:14 PM
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Ever since Lisa Su fired the marketing team for leaking specs everything has been tight lipped lately.

It's the 96CU variant and some other AMD sku that has nvidia allegedly worried. In which the rumored 3090 is suppose to come from. Rumored is that both AMD and nvidia are suppose to have some XX90 skus as halo gpus.

From what I recall, the Max CU for CDNA 2 is 128CU. Which is for their data center, etc. I've only come across one rumor about a 100?CU RDNA card that AMD was cooking up to take the high end from nvidia. But I've not read any more about it other then it's a 400W+ card.

What nvidia will do to counter this (as they appear to know what skus AMD has and vise versa for AMD) is that they will force reviewers to use specific games that have been updated to use TAA so that DLSS 3.0 can work directly from the drivers. This will boost performance but the IQ will be questionable on some of those titles. Also, some of these reviewers will need to lable their charts to indicate that DLSS 3.0 is used as this feature will still need developers to implement it in game.

Another funny thing I ran across is how Nvidia wasn't able to get Dice to budge on DLSS. To this day DLSS is disabled on 2080ti up to 4k when it kicks in (if I recall correctly) which was the original designation of DLSS for the 2080ti. IE: Wasn't intended for the 2080ti but for lower spec'd cards.

Last edited by EastCoast; 08-01-2020 at 02:23 PM.
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post #12 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 02:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by WannaBeOCer View Post
"Report claims" "will reportedly" "Coreteks report also suggests"

Where is the hardware news? Just more rumors from Coreteks. Seems like people just read titles now adays instead of reading the article before posting.
Whats wrong with you? This is good news for Nvidia i thought you of all would be thrilled about this.

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post #13 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 02:25 PM
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If I recall correctly in order for RDNA 2 to beat a 3080 it would need to be 90% better then a 5700 xt. Yet, it's rumored that the gains are well over 200%!!!! That's not from a 80CU card.
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post #14 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 02:32 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by EastCoast View Post
Ever since Lisa Su fired the marketing team for leaking specs everything has been tight lipped lately.

It's the 96CU variant and some other AMD sku that has nvidia allegedly worried. In which the rumored 3090 is suppose to come from. Rumored is that both AMD and nvidia are suppose to have some XX90 skus as halo gpus.

From what I recall, the Max CU for CDNA 2 is 128CU. Which is for their data center, etc. I've only come across one rumor about a 100?CU RDNA card that AMD was cooking up to take the high end from nvidia. But I've not read any more about it other then it's a 400W+ card.

What nvidia will do to counter this (as they appear to know what skus AMD has and vise versa for AMD) is that they will force reviewers to use specific games that have been updated to use TAA so that DLSS 3.0 can work directly from the drivers. This will boost performance but the IQ will be questionable on some of those titles. Also, some of these reviewers will need to lable their charts to indicate that DLSS 3.0 is used as this feature will still need developers to implement it in game.

Another funny thing I ran across is how Nvidia wasn't able to get Dice to budge on DLSS. To this day DLSS is disabled on 2080ti up to 4k when it kicks in (if I recall correctly) which was the original designation of DLSS for the 2080ti. IE: Wasn't intended for the 2080ti but for lower spec'd cards.
Yep, but it seems that Nvidia will get to market first, probably with a paper launch, that way people who can't afford to replace their cards in quick succession (as in get the 3090 then change to a 6900) would splurge on them and they get to keep the mind share, granted that wouldn't matter if AMD's flagship performance is lackluster.

Quote: Originally Posted by EastCoast View Post
If I recall correctly in order for RDNA 2 to beat a 3080 it would need to be 90% better then a 5700 xt. Yet, it's rumored that the gains are well over 200%!!!! That's not from a 80CU card.
195% to 225%

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post #15 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 02:39 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by dagget3450 View Post
Whats wrong with you? This is good news for Nvidia i thought you of all would be thrilled about this.
When it's rumors about Intel getting massive IPC and clock speed increases on processes it can't even sell to consumers it's gospel and anybody who doubts it doesn't know what they're talking about, but this particular thing is ridiculous speculation unfit for discussion.

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post #16 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 02:41 PM
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^^
Yeah that 195-225% is not coming from a 80CU card even it it scaled 100%. That's the rumored halo sku.

Here is how some of these leaks work. Certain AIBs are given gpus but don't know where they fall in the sku stack. So some of those leaks that are legit (Coreteks) comes from not knowing the ID the gpu to know were it falls in the stack. BTW, that 15% rumor coreteks claims is allegedly coming from MSI who is well known to down play AMD GPUs. So, I took that leak with a pinch of salt. It could be true but not from a 80CU card, More like at 72CU card. But we will see in the next 90 or so days....


Edit:
Another example are those rumors saying big navi will be 12GB, 16GB, HBM2e. All of it may be true. None of it maybe true or somewhere inbetween. The problem with these rumors is the lack of GPU ID that is not provided. They may actually have the GPU but can't id it or publicly id it to know where it falls in the sku stack.

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post #17 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 02:53 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by EastCoast View Post
If I recall correctly in order for RDNA 2 to beat a 3080 it would need to be 90% better then a 5700 xt. Yet, it's rumored that the gains are well over 200%!!!! That's not from a 80CU card.
A standard RX 5700XT scaled to 1.5X performance (AMD's targets for RDNA2) would beat a 2080ti by around 10% on paper. That part is rumored to be a 6600XT or 6700XT. More CUs will require somewhat lower clocks due to power consumption, so higher parts will scale, but not linearly. AMD absolutely will take NVIDIA to school this time around. Rumors be damned. You can look at AMD's existing products (specifically the APUs) and get a good idea of how much work is being put into improving performance per watt. You can also look at current consoles (which have had middle of the road graphics historically) to get an idea of the specs for RDNA2. The important thing with the consoles is that they have much lower TDP than a GPU would.

EDIT: NVIDIA's top end card is widely rumored to perform 30-40% faster than the 2080ti, but with a large RT performance uplift compared to previous gen. AMD will also have decent RT performance, though on smaller cards it may lag behind certain NVIDIA current-gen products.

EDIT #2: You will absolutely be able to get 2080ti performance on launch day for $400 or possibly even less (depending on where the cards are positioned).

EDIT #3: AMD's next-gen scales very well with more CUs. The XBox One Series X GPU is nearly 30% faster than the RX 5700XT, while having slightly lower max clocks. The PS5 GPU has 10% fewer CUs, 17% higher max clocks, and performs around 10% faster. BOTH GPUs are TDP and power constrained.

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post #18 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 02:58 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by betam4x View Post
A standard RX 5700XT scaled to 1.5X performance (AMD's targets for RDNA2) would beat a 2080ti by around 10% on paper. That part is rumored to be a 6600XT or 6700XT. More CUs will require somewhat lower clocks due to power consumption, so higher parts will scale, but not linearly. AMD absolutely will take NVIDIA to school this time around. Rumors be damned. You can look at AMD's existing products (specifically the APUs) and get a good idea of how much work is being put into improving performance per watt. You can also look at current consoles (which have had middle of the road graphics historically) to get an idea of the specs for RDNA2. The important thing with the consoles is that they have much lower TDP than a GPU would.

EDIT: NVIDIA's top end card is widely rumored to perform 30-40% faster than the 2080ti, but with a large RT performance uplift compared to previous gen. AMD will also have decent RT performance, though on smaller cards it may lag behind certain NVIDIA current-gen products.
This goes to what I just posted. That some of these "leaks" be it true or otherwise seem to be coming from different skus.
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post #19 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 03:04 PM
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This should be in rumours section.

I have heard so much back and forth, im a just wait and see.


If AMD can keep doing what they do with there 5700xt ill keep shoving them in builds I do.

For my own personal PC I will probably go Nvidia unless AMD can get there encoder up too snuff.

With 50% perf per watt and rumored clocks I see due to consoles im excepting alot more out of AMD this time
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post #20 of 76 (permalink) Old 08-01-2020, 03:10 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by dagget3450 View Post
Whats wrong with you? This is good news for Nvidia i thought you of all would be thrilled about this.
It's in the wrong section with a click bait title that's aimed at causing a flame war.

Why would I be thrilled Nvidia may still have better gaming performance? I'd rather AMD sell their gaming cards with less functionality than Nvidia's Turing/Ampere at proper pricing. I'm more excited to see their CDNA card because it's rumored to have 42TFlops of FP32 performance.

Quote: Originally Posted by m4fox90 View Post
When it's rumors about Intel getting massive IPC and clock speed increases on processes it can't even sell to consumers it's gospel and anybody who doubts it doesn't know what they're talking about, but this particular thing is ridiculous speculation unfit for discussion.
AMD was able to get a 52% IPC increase from going from their old Excavator but somehow a 25% increase over Willow Cove is some how a "massive IPC increase." Skylake is going to be 6 years old when Alder Lake is released.

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