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Recommend upgrade from Dell 2412M (mostly programming)

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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-17-2019, 10:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Recommend upgrade from Dell 2412M (mostly programming)

Introduction

Hi!

I've geeked out over keyboards/switches, headsets, DAC/AMP, and other general PC hardware for decades, and now it's finally time to dive head first into monitors. I've been reading bestmonitorsbyncx, this forum, r/Monitors, and a few of the linked review sites, and man there is a lot of stuff to read up on.

I currently use 2x Dell 2412M monitors at 1920x1200. Frankly I have no idea if it's even worth replacing them. They are from 2011 I believe, and still sell for $210 here. Before I got these, I had a Viewsonic LCD of some sort from roughly 2002, and before that, CRT.

Usage scenario

I mostly do programming on one screen while I have youtube, TV series, or Discord, and all my terminals running on the other. I do some light gaming, except when DOOM 2016 came out when I instantly installed Windows (I run Linux) and plowed through the game. God damn that's a fun game. I can't wait for the sequel! Especially now that I can run it on Linux thanks to Valve/DXVK.

Games are not really a consideration, and especially not multiplayer FPS games. I only played the DOOM single player campaign once, then removed it and Windows again. I never play competitively, or online at all frankly.

I could mention Fallout 4, XCOM 2, Cities: Skylines, Pathfinder: Kingmaker, SC2, but the time I spend in these games week-over-week is close to zero. Perhaps 1-2 hours per week total.

So the primary focus is displaying text for programming and terminals, and secondary is displaying video.

I do not work/play in the dark, I always have the ceiling light on. There are no relevant exceptions to this.

Random things

- I feel like the Dell 2412M is doing a great job of displaying text, but frankly it's hard for me to know because the only thing I can compare to are ancient monitors from ~2002 and earlier
- I irrationally hate 1920x1080, and how it has essentially pushed 1920x1200 out of the market because of marketing and sales people drooling when they could say "Full HD". I will never buy a 1920x1080 monitor
- I feel like people are recommending higher refresh rate displays even if you don't play games. I'm not sure what I "need" - I've only ever seen a 100hz+ monitor once, at a party, and I was not sober, and the only thing I got to see was the UFO animation thing. So I don't know what difference it makes for normal use
- I feel like I "should" get some kind of sync (G-SYNC/Freesync/2), because tearing does annoy me when it happens
- I think I want a HDR display, but I'm not sure why, and I'm aware that software support at the moment is horrendous
- I don't know if I should focus on brightness or contrast ratio, and I don't understand how to read the dynamic contrast numbers - it seems to me they're both bogus and useless for direct feature comparison
- I don't have access to Amazon in my country
- I don't think I want a 4k display, mostly because I'm terrified that I'll need to spend buttloads of cash on a 2080 or better to drive it
- I think I want a 4k display because surely the more pixels, the crisper the image?
- Also, 4k would allow me more terminals and code displayed on the screen at the same time

Please note that there are very few absolute statements in those bullet points, and most of it is based on what I imagine/think/feel at the moment. I frankly have no experience or knowledge when it comes to monitors.

Which is why I was hoping someone here could help me out :-)

Things I know I don't care about

- USB, neither HUB nor video functionality
- Speakers or anything audio related
- DVI, VGA, Thunderbolt
- Number of DP/HDMI connections (I only need 1)
- PiP, 3D-ready, touch
- Viewing angles
- Physical design / bezel / colors / LED (or "RGB", as the kids call it)
- The stand itself (I use a desktop arm anyway) - note that all the monitors I list below support VESA 100x100
- Built in camera, memory card reader, power consumption
- Bundled software (I run Linux)

Things I'm not sure if I should care about or not

- HDCP
- GSYNC/Freesync/2
- Update frequency above 60hz
- Resolution above QHD
- HDR
- Older DP pre-1.4 / HDMI pre-2.0
- IPS vs VA vs TN - I _imagine_ I prefer IPS, but I have no idea
- Flicker free, low input delay

Things I know I care about

- Obviously it can't have a built in fan, it needs to cool itself passively
- VESA 100x100
- Displaying crisp text and nice video

Budget

I don't want to spend more than $700 per monitor, and I'm not sure I want to replace both of them. Maybe I should replace one initially and then experience any difference before I buy a 2nd replacement.

I _can_ spend more than $700, if someone has a really excellent recommendation, but I've stayed below that for the monitors I've considered thus far.

I'll need recommendations on what kind of graphics card I need to power the new setup. The priciest card I'll consider right now is a single 2080 Super. I don't mind scaling game resolutions down to less than native if need be, as long as the GPU can comfortably display my desktop use. I'd rather not spend that much on a GPU, though - I'd rather get a used 1060 or something along those lines, if that's enough.

3840x2160 ("4k UHD")

A list of 4k monitors I've considered thus far.

Dell UltraSharp U2718Q ($635)

Pros: 1300:1 contrast, recommended by RTINGS as the best office monitor

Cons: No sync, poor HDR, visible blacklight bleed, DP 1.2, 60hz, no local dimming, not flicker free, 2017 model?

LG 27UK650-W ($452)

Pros: flicker free, Freesync 1, RTINGS best monitor for content editing,

Cons: DP 1.2, 1196:1 contrast, 60hz, mediocre HDR, no local dimming

LG 27UK850-W ($600)

Pros: Flicker free, freesync 1, TomsHW says "can be viewed as a gaming monitor for professionals"

Cons: DP 1.2, 1000:1 contrast, 60hz, poor HDR

Philips 328P6VUBREB ($660)

Pros: flicker free, DP 1.4, 400-600 nits, 3246:1 contrast, decent HDR, VA panel

Cons: No sync, 60hz, VA panel, ~29ms input lag (according to pcmonitors.info), no local dimming in SDR mode

Benq EW3270U ($550)

Pros: flicker free, DP1.4, HDMI 2.0, 3000:1 contrast, freesync 1

Cons: 300 nit, 60hz, bad HDR

2560x1440 ("QHD")

A list of QHD monitors I've considered thus far.

LG UltraGear 27GL850 ($620)

Pros: DP1.4, HDMI 2.0, 144hz, low input delay, flicker free, freesync 1

Cons: bad HDR, 1000:1 contrast

Acer Nitro XV272UP bmiiprzx ($495)

Pros: freesync 1, HDR 400, flicker free, 144hz, HDMI 2.0

Cons: 1000:1 contrast, DP 1.2a

Samsung C27HG70 ($550)

Pros: HDMI 2.0, 3000:1 contrast, 144hz, flicker free, low input delay, Freesync 2

Cons: bad HDR, DP 1.2, VA panel

Samsung C32HG70 ($550)

Pros: DP1.4, HDR 600, Freesync 2, low input delay, 3000:1 contrast, 144hz

Cons: 22ms B2W, HDMI 1.4, VA panel

Aorus AD27QD ($640)

Pros: HDMI 2.0, 144hz, flicker free, HDR 400, freesync 1

Cons: DP 1.2, 1000:1 contrast, 4ms G2G



I need help narrowing it down, or removing entries one by one until I'm left with 1-2 choices. Also feel free to recommend additions to the lineup!

Also, I'm obviously going to wait for the upcoming sale, so that might influence it.

Thank you!

Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.

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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-17-2019, 10:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Hah, my profile says both "New to Overclock.net" and "Join Date: Sep 2010". I understand why, I just found it funny.

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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-17-2019, 10:34 AM
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If you are not playing games there is no need to buy a display with more than 60 hz
Also be aware that 4K on a 27 inch will give you a PPI of 163,18 where your old displays where 94,34 compared so if you want 4K i would suggest larger than a 27 inch

4K on a 32 inch would give you a PPI of 137,68

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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-17-2019, 12:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by shilka View Post
If you are not playing games there is no need to buy a display with more than 60 hz
I went looking for cheaper 2560x1440 models now with lower refresh rates, but I can't find any, haha. Anyway, okay, so then the 4k models I've found being 60hz is not a disadvantage for me, then.

Quote: Originally Posted by shilka View Post
Also be aware that 4K on a 27 inch will give you a PPI of 163,18 where your old displays where 94,34 compared so if you want 4K i would suggest larger than a 27 inch

4K on a 32 inch would give you a PPI of 137,68
I understand the mathematics of what you're saying, but why should I be aware of this?

I thought more PPI means a sharper image?

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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-17-2019, 01:05 PM
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The Asus PB278QR is and older but also cheaper 2560x1440 monitor
I had the PB278Q myself a few years ago and i later gave to my dad and then i bought two of the PB278QR for my mother since she wanted the same size and resolution

You can find that one for around $275 on Amazon
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01EN3Z7QQ...07N84VFQD?th=1

As for PPI when it get that high you will need to use scaling in Windows otherwise you cant see a damm thing because everything is so tiny more pixels = smaller image
Windows scaling is not perfect so sometimes the picture looks a little bit off or strange

A 32 inch 4K display has a lower PPI than a 27 inch 4K display therefore you wont need to use as much scaling if any at all

Edit: just watch this video


I know its an old video and Windows has gotten better but its not perfect so if you can avoid using scaling you should do so

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Last edited by shilka; 11-17-2019 at 01:15 PM.
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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-18-2019, 10:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Oh, gosh, that video is like half my spare time after work, haha. Alright, I'll see if I can plow through it on x1.5 speed or something.

Thank you

EDIT: No, you've changed it since you posted it initially (which I had opened in a tab). The old video was ~3 hours, this Linus video is 5 minutes. I'll obviously watch it today, and if I knew it was changed, I'd have watched it before replying at all.

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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-18-2019, 10:23 AM
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Have you considered an ultrawide to replace your two screens? Or do you need to rotate one or both between portrait and landscape?

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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-18-2019, 10:24 AM
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Whatever you do, get an IPS.

Maybe it's subjective but i find focusing on text a lot easier on IPS than other screen types. I don't know why, this technology has a kind of "e-ink" quality compared to the other two.
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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-18-2019, 10:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by briank View Post
Have you considered an ultrawide to replace your two screens? Or do you need to rotate one or both between portrait and landscape?
I have considered it, but frankly I am unable to judge its merits. I do not rotate my displays at the moment.

Primarily, what I feel right now is that having two physically seperate monitors makes it easier for me to "context switch" in my head between them. So monitor 1 is all work and no play, and monitor 2 is mostly play and some work.

Again, that's what I feel.

And second, I imagine I'll have to immediately replace my GPU as well to drive a display of that size - I was hoping I could replace 1-2 screens now and the GPU with the next paycheck.

Third, I'm not even sure it's worth upgrading from the screens I have now. The Dell 2412M, like I said in my first post. They're IPS panels and they've served me well.

I have no idea if a new monitor will feel better or be objectively better.

I've gone to the local stores that have monitors on display, hooked up to running computers, but they only have very cheap monitors on display.

Should I replace the Dell 2412Ms? Should I just try to buy 1? Should I replace both with an ultrawide? I have no idea.

plz help! :-)


Quote: Originally Posted by Opus131 View Post
Whatever you do, get an IPS.

Maybe it's subjective but i find focusing on text a lot easier on IPS than other screen types. I don't know why, this technology has a kind of "e-ink" quality compared to the other two.
That's my experience as well, thank you.

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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 11-18-2019, 10:49 AM
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I never changed the video or the link must have been a bug at your end or something

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