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post #1491 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 03:34 AM
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Off Topic: 9900k price alert

Hi Guys,

Just checked the latest Newegg special and the 9900k is on sale for $474!

Unbelievable considering when I got mine around Xmas it was $200 more!

That hurts..

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post #1492 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 04:28 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by davidm71 View Post
Hi Guys,

Just checked the latest Newegg special and the 9900k is on sale for $474!

Unbelievable considering when I got mine around Xmas it was $200 more!

That hurts..
New r0 stepping for 9900k is out soon. They are clearing stock for it 🙂

CPU24/7) 7980xe - 7900xMOBO: ASUS Rampage Apex x299 / Asrock Taichi x299RAM: 4x 3600c15 / 4x4266c19/ 4x4000 c17 GPU: 2x MSI tri X 2080ti / 1060tiSTORAGE: Areca 1883i HDD R6 + Samsung 850PROs R0 - 3x SM961 nvme 1TB - 3x Intel Optane 900p 480GBCASE: LD cooling V8 R/B / ld cooling reverse R/BMonitor: Acer x34 /Asus 27 AQ 4k g-sync
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post #1493 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 07:59 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Falkentyne View Post
Your vcore is 1.213v not 1.250v at load.
You need to look at VR VOUT.
.
This is my last set of config.

Basically I completely disabled manual IA VR AC/DC setting. Then:
CPU Internal AC/DC Load line: Turbo (to my knowledge I suppose this sets the intel defaults)
CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration: Normal (I understand that this way is disabled Edit: if I set it higher, together with proper DVID settings so the CPU voltage shown in bios is lower than 1.350, I either get complete shutdown during or after finishing running Cinebench either freezes, so only Normal works)

With DVID 0 I get CPU Voltage in BIOS 1.4xx V so I quickly went to a negative offset of -0.090 volts.

Right now, during stress tests (clock at 5 GHz, temps under 90 Celsius), the VR VOUT stays under 1.3 volts BUT the Vcore spikes close to 1.4 (1.39) and the Core VID values are through the roof (1.45 volts).

Are these settings still safe? Compared to my other (previous) configuration the system behaves pretty much the same, I just want to apply the simplest set of settings that would allow for safe overclock and dynamic behavior (variable voltages and clocks).

Also, under macOS (it's a hackintosh) the Core voltage shows up to 1.5 volts, sometimes at idle (I have no idea what value is reading, I have no reasons to believe that macOS is somehow rising the voltages) - is this something is safe to disregard?



Last edited by StevenToast; 04-18-2019 at 09:23 AM.
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post #1494 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 11:43 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by StevenToast View Post
This is my last set of config.

Basically I completely disabled manual IA VR AC/DC setting. Then:
CPU Internal AC/DC Load line: Turbo (to my knowledge I suppose this sets the intel defaults)
CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration: Normal (I understand that this way is disabled Edit: if I set it higher, together with proper DVID settings so the CPU voltage shown in bios is lower than 1.350, I either get complete shutdown during or after finishing running Cinebench either freezes, so only Normal works)

With DVID 0 I get CPU Voltage in BIOS 1.4xx V so I quickly went to a negative offset of -0.090 volts.

Right now, during stress tests (clock at 5 GHz, temps under 90 Celsius), the VR VOUT stays under 1.3 volts BUT the Vcore spikes close to 1.4 (1.39) and the Core VID values are through the roof (1.45 volts).

Are these settings still safe? Compared to my other (previous) configuration the system behaves pretty much the same, I just want to apply the simplest set of settings that would allow for safe overclock and dynamic behavior (variable voltages and clocks).

Also, under macOS (it's a hackintosh) the Core voltage shows up to 1.5 volts, sometimes at idle (I have no idea what value is reading, I have no reasons to believe that macOS is somehow rising the voltages) - is this something is safe to disregard?


MacOS is probably reading the Super I/O sensor. This will always be significantly higher than the true voltage, although at idle, they should be very close. You can see that here. (ITE 8688E).
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thre...#post-10876493

Bios voltage showing 1.404v at pure defaults with 5 ghz core and 4.7 ghz cache is safe, as long as Loadline Calibration is left on standard (based on IA AC/IA DC loadline at 1.6 mOhms (value=160). This is still within Intel's stock design, but at the maximum upper limits, although this was intended for 1 core load (8 cores @ 4.7 ghz). At that 1.404v in the bios, there is no load on the processor so barely any current.

Not sure why your desktop would shut off in cinebench. Probably need to increase voltage /vcore current protection. Shutting off (no BSOD) is some sort of overcurrent trip.

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post #1495 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 11:49 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Falkentyne View Post
MacOS is probably reading the Super I/O sensor. This will always be significantly higher than the true voltage, although at idle, they should be very close. You can see that here. (ITE 8688E).
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thre...#post-10876493

Bios voltage showing 1.404v at pure defaults with 5 ghz core and 4.7 ghz cache is safe, as long as Loadline Calibration is left on standard (based on IA AC/IA DC loadline at 1.6 mOhms (value=160). This is still within Intel's stock design, but at the maximum upper limits, although this was intended for 1 core load (8 cores @ 4.7 ghz). At that 1.404v in the bios, there is no load on the processor so barely any current.

Not sure why your desktop would shut off in cinebench. Probably need to increase voltage /vcore current protection. Shutting off (no BSOD) is some sort of overcurrent trip.
Loadline Calibration is left on standard = That is the Turbo setting? (I recall that one corresponding with the 160/160)

So with the VR VOUT at fairly decent levels should I stop being freaked out by high Core # VID and Vcore values?

And yes, it shuts off as soon as I change teh Vcore load line calibration setting. Should I experiment with smaller DVID (closer to zero I mean) as long as under benchmark tests the VR VOUT stays under 1.350 volts? Although the system is stable under a range of voltages I can see bigger/smaller scores according to the voltage used...
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post #1496 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 12:46 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by StevenToast View Post
Loadline Calibration is left on standard = That is the Turbo setting? (I recall that one corresponding with the 160/160)

So with the VR VOUT at fairly decent levels should I stop being freaked out by high Core # VID and Vcore values?

And yes, it shuts off as soon as I change teh Vcore load line calibration setting. Should I experiment with smaller DVID (closer to zero I mean) as long as under benchmark tests the VR VOUT stays under 1.350 volts? Although the system is stable under a range of voltages I can see bigger/smaller scores according to the voltage used...
No, you need to increase CPU Vcore current protection, which you have on auto.

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post #1497 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 03:27 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Falkentyne View Post
No, you need to increase CPU Vcore current protection, which you have on auto.
Regarding macOS reading... I can't find any similar reading in any parameter under windows. Indeed Vcore under IT8688E is higher but still no closer to 1.5, rather slightly towards 1.4

On the other hand, I did increase the CPU Vcore protection to Turbo setting. But something I don't get (maybe I did not understand all things correctly): these loadline settings should ensure a smaller voltage variation between idle cpu and 100% used cpu. But the higher I go with the CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration (Turbo is maximum choice on my motherboard) the Voltage variation becomes bigger and bigger.

For instance:
CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration = Normal, DVID offset is -0.090 V and I get VR VOUT between 1.150 and 1.320
CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration = Turbo, DVID offset is -1.090 V (because otherwise the idle voltage shoots way up) and I get VR VOUT between 1.050 and 1.360

So until I will find more explanations on this topic I am reverting to CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration = Normal (and subsequent settings).
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post #1498 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 03:39 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by StevenToast View Post
Regarding macOS reading... I can't find any similar reading in any parameter under windows. Indeed Vcore under IT8688E is higher but still no closer to 1.5, rather slightly towards 1.4

On the other hand, I did increase the CPU Vcore protection to Turbo setting. But something I don't get (maybe I did not understand all things correctly): these loadline settings should ensure a smaller voltage variation between idle cpu and 100% used cpu. But the higher I go with the CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration (Turbo is maximum choice on my motherboard) the Voltage variation becomes bigger and bigger.

For instance:
CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration = Normal, DVID offset is -0.090 V and I get VR VOUT between 1.150 and 1.320
CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration = Turbo, DVID offset is -1.090 V (because otherwise the idle voltage shoots way up) and I get VR VOUT between 1.050 and 1.360

So until I will find more explanations on this topic I am reverting to CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration = Normal (and subsequent settings).
If you are using C-states this is normal.
You also must not combine auto (normal/dvid) voltages with loadline calibration! LLC=Low is safe to combine with auto voltages as LLC low is 1.3 mOhms of voltage droop, which equals most of the presets that the "DC Loadline" value reflects (DC Loadline has no effect on CPU voltages, it only affects the VID reported by the CPU).

The AC loadline value of 1.6 mOhms (default) is supposed to take the "Place" of loadline calibration (that's how Intel designed it to be). Combining a 1.3+ mohms AC loadline (Internal VR setting of 130 for AC, or Internal AC/DC preset value of Balanced or Turbo (Extreme=2.1 mOhms) with loadline calibration higher than "low" simply overboosts the voltage and should not be done.

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post #1499 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 03:48 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Falkentyne View Post
If you are using C-states this is normal.
You also must not combine auto (normal/dvid) voltages with loadline calibration! LLC=Low is safe to combine with auto voltages as LLC low is 1.3 mOhms of voltage droop, which equals most of the presets that the "DC Loadline" value reflects (DC Loadline has no effect on CPU voltages, it only affects the VID reported by the CPU).

The AC loadline value of 1.6 mOhms (default) is supposed to take the "Place" of loadline calibration (that's how Intel designed it to be). Combining a 1.3+ mohms AC loadline (Internal VR setting of 130 for AC, or Internal AC/DC preset value of Balanced or Turbo (Extreme=2.1 mOhms) with loadline calibration higher than "low" simply overboosts the voltage and should not be done.
OK, now we're (and by we I mean I) getting somewhere...

So this would be a set of correct settings for my specific case?

C-states = enabled
CPU Internal AC/DC Loadline = Turbo (That would correspond to 160/160 values - or is better to manually set it AC/DC to 1 and adjust the DVID to suit?)
CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration = Normal (To my understanding this is the setting for the LLC to do nothing)
CPU Vcore Current Protection = Turbo
DVID = -0.090 V (or any other slightly modified value that keeps the system stable, good benchmark scores and the VR VOUT under 1.35V at high loads)
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post #1500 of 1655 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 04:05 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by StevenToast View Post
OK, now we're (and by we I mean I) getting somewhere...

So this would be a set of correct settings for my specific case?

C-states = enabled
CPU Internal AC/DC Loadline = Turbo (That would correspond to 160/160 values - or is better to manually set it AC/DC to 1 and adjust the DVID to suit?)
CPU Vcore Loadline Calibration = Normal (To my understanding this is the setting for the LLC to do nothing)
CPU Vcore Current Protection = Turbo
DVID = -0.090 V (or any other slightly modified value that keeps the system stable, good benchmark scores and the VR VOUT under 1.35V at high loads)
That looks accurate.
Setting AC/DC loadline to 0.01 mOhms will probably require you to use higher loadline calibration however (maybe medium), as the AC loadline value will no longer save you from excessive voltage droop anymore.
You have to test this yourself.
It's best if you disable all C-states when doing this so you can see the actual load and idle voltages without it downclocking.

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