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Memory controller sucks on new i9 9900K!

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post #21 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 09:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by tostitobandito View Post
You should never have those on auto when overclocking RAM. Auto typically runs them way too hot, often 1.3v or more for 3200MHz RAM when 1.15v or so is usually stable. At your frequency VCCIO and VCCSA could be much higher. You should set them manually to the lowest stable voltage as one of the last steps in your memory overclocking process.

As for your main issue, you changed the CPU. A 9900K isn't "just an 8700K with 2 extra cores", it's a totally new chip with other incremental changes and enhancements over 8xxx chips in addition to other fundamental differences like more cache. You're going to have to start over as far as RAM overclocking is concerned, at the frequencies you're trying to achieve. That isn't unexpected. If you had a DDR4 3200 kit or something I doubt you'd have any issues, but with 4000+ it often takes some doing to get it stable and happy. I'll also point out that with that if you had already been using a 9900K and you switched to a different 9900K, you also may have had to redo your RAM overclock. Every piece of silicon is different and your margins are pretty slim with the overclock you're trying to achieve. Also, as others have said you're using a Z370 board (albeit a really good one) with a CPU that's happiest with Z390. A lot of the high end Z390 boards have optimizations to allow for higher RAM frequencies than Z370 which in theory means you'll have an easier time getting 4000+ DDR4 stable and possibly have a higher ceiling.
No, this is my first i9. As I said before, this motherboard is the best Z370 motherboard for overclocking, point-blank. It is advertised to support XMP profiles up to 4500+. Makes no logical since how I can't even successfully POST with 4133MHz XMP. I tried both VCCIO/System Agent voltages between 1.1v through 1.25 yet my system will not successfully pass the POST. It always gets stuck on the stupid debug code "61"!
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post #22 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 09:32 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by lumbeechief View Post
Yes I meant Z370. And testing different motherboards is very unreasonable because the IMC is built in the CPU not on the motherboard. I already told you my current setup worked completely fine with the i7 8700K, I was able to run my ram @ 4133MHz with it's XMP profile, and I sure as hell didn't need to touch the VCCIO and System Agent voltages to get my system to successfully post.
I'm not saying you should test a bunch of boards, I'm saying you'd need to do that to pinpoint the IMC as a problem.
You don't seem to understand what anyone is telling you and you seem like you just want to complain about your CPU instead of configuring things manually so I'm not going to explain that there are other factors involved here than a just a bad IMC.
You're one of hundreds of people who've posted here about 4000mhz problems, plus you invalidate all the testing they did making the QVL by using a CPU from a different generation so obviously you were going to have to utilize your board and tweak it. It's actually pretty funny that you have all this hardware yet fail to grasp how there are other possibilities than the IMC.

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post #23 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 10:36 PM
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What motherboard bios version are you using?

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post #24 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 11:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by TahoeDust View Post
What motherboard bios version are you using?
The latest one "Version 1801". So yeah, looks like i'm going to need to swap my i9 if I'm going to get good use out of the new Gskill Royal RGB 4600MHz I just purchased and be here in a week. Only way I can get this i9 to boot with my current memory F4-4133C19D-16GTZR, is to turn the frequency down to 4000MHz, which I didn't have to do at all with my i7 8700K.
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post #25 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-13-2019, 11:53 PM
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I don't understand why anyone would buy $450-500 worth of crazy overclocked memory only to use it on a last-gen MB which won't get as much out of it as newer Z390 boards and probably won't even be able to run it at its advertised speed. If you want to play with the bleeding edge of RAM speeds for whatever reason, either shell out the cash for a new top-end Z390 MB or stop complaining about marginally lower speeds or other difficulties on your old Z370 board. I mean, we're only talking about another $300 here after you've already dropped over $1000 on your CPU and RAM alone, and I'm sure your Apex X is still worth more than half that on the used market.

This isn't a "bad" memory controller in your CPU. If your RAM speed is the most important thing to you, return your 9900K and put your 8700K back in and go to town with that extra 100 MHz or whatever on your RAM.

Last edited by tostitobandito; 03-14-2019 at 12:00 AM.
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post #26 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-14-2019, 12:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by tostitobandito View Post
I don't understand why anyone would buy $450-500 worth of crazy overclocked memory only to use it on a last-gen MB which won't get as much out of it as newer Z390 boards and probably won't even be able to run it at its advertised speed. If you want to play with the bleeding edge of RAM speeds for whatever reason, either shell out the cash for a new top-end Z390 MB or stop complaining about marginally lower speeds or other difficulties on your old Z370 board. I mean, we're only talking about another $300 here after you've already dropped over $1000 on your CPU and RAM alone, and I'm sure your Apex X is still worth more than half that on the used market.

This isn't a "bad" memory controller in your CPU. If your RAM speed is the most important thing to you, return your 9900K and put your 8700K back in and go to town with that extra 100 MHz or whatever on your RAM.
Yeah? And so what if I buy the Z390 board, preferably ASUS MAXIMUS XI APEX, and it turns that there is no difference at all with ram overclocking? Both boards are very much similar when it comes too the power delivery and traces from the CPU and DIMM slots. The i9 is just an i7 with 2 extra cores and 4 extra threads. Why do you think it is compatible on the Z370 in the first place? It's still coffee lake with just a few extra features, nothing drastic for the need to have a Z390 board. ASUS MAXIMUS X APEX is overkill even for i9. Don't talk like i'm limiting my system because i'm not on Z390. I already talked to a few people who upgraded their CPU too the i9 on the Z370 boards, they had very high end boards as well, yet they had better luck with their ram.

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post #27 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-14-2019, 01:41 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by lumbeechief View Post
Yeah? And so what if I buy the Z390 board, preferably ASUS MAXIMUS XI APEX, and it turns that there is no difference at all with ram overclocking? Both boards are very much similar when it comes too the power delivery and traces from the CPU and DIMM slots. The i9 is just an i7 with 2 extra cores and 4 extra threads. Why do you think it is compatible on the Z370 in the first place? It's still coffee lake with just a few extra features, nothing drastic for the need to have a Z390 board. ASUS MAXIMUS X APEX is overkill even for i9. Don't talk like i'm limiting my system because i'm not on Z390. I already talked to a few people who upgraded their CPU too the i9 on the Z370 boards, they had very high end boards as well, yet they had better luck with their ram.
Z370 IS not the same with Z390 - they have different BIOSes, different sub-timings and other optimizations BETTER suited for the 9900K
9990K IS not a 8700K with 2 extra cores

-------------------------------------------

As long as you can not grasp this good luck swapping CPUs.....because you think it is the memory controller at fault...

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post #28 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-14-2019, 03:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by Abaidor View Post
Z370 IS not the same with Z390 - they have different BIOSes, different sub-timings and other optimizations BETTER suited for the 9900K
9990K IS not a 8700K with 2 extra cores

-------------------------------------------

As long as you can not grasp this good luck swapping CPUs.....because you think it is the memory controller at fault...
Well according to these sources there is no big difference between the Z370 and Z390.
https://www.msi.com/blog/intel-z370-...erent-they-are
https://appuals.com/z370-vs-z390-which-should-you-buy/

What you don't understand is how highend the ASUS MAXIMUS X APEX is. It's the best motherboard one could choose for the core i9 9900K and 9700K when sticking to Z370. The APEX X has better VRMs and power delivery than a very high percentage of Z390 and Z370 boards. The APEX X has an 8+2 Phase mode and is very much sufficient for the i9 9900K. My motherboard is rated to support up too +4500 MHz. It has only 2 DIMM slots which is logical for Dual Channel memory overclocking. Every highend overlocking board has 2 DIMM per channel. Just look at the EVGA DARK.
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post #29 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-14-2019, 04:42 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by lumbeechief View Post
Yeah? And so what if I buy the Z390 board, preferably ASUS MAXIMUS XI APEX, and it turns that there is no difference at all with ram overclocking? Both boards are very much similar when it comes too the power delivery and traces from the CPU and DIMM slots. The i9 is just an i7 with 2 extra cores and 4 extra threads. Why do you think it is compatible on the Z370 in the first place? It's still coffee lake with just a few extra features, nothing drastic for the need to have a Z390 board. ASUS MAXIMUS X APEX is overkill even for i9. Don't talk like i'm limiting my system because i'm not on Z390. I already talked to a few people who upgraded their CPU too the i9 on the Z370 boards, they had very high end boards as well, yet they had better luck with their ram.
Quote: Originally Posted by lumbeechief View Post
Well according to these sources there is no big difference between the Z370 and Z390.
https://www.msi.com/blog/intel-z370-...erent-they-are
https://appuals.com/z370-vs-z390-which-should-you-buy/

What you don't understand is how highend the ASUS MAXIMUS X APEX is. It's the best motherboard one could choose for the core i9 9900K and 9700K when sticking to Z370. The APEX X has better VRMs and power delivery than a very high percentage of Z390 and Z370 boards. The APEX X has an 8+2 Phase mode and is very much sufficient for the i9 9900K. My motherboard is rated to support up too +4500 MHz. It has only 2 DIMM slots which is logical for Dual Channel memory overclocking. Every highend overlocking board has 2 DIMM per channel. Just look at the EVGA DARK.

According to your sources

"If you're using an 8th Generation Intel Processor and do plan to upgrade to the 9th Gen
Grab a Z390 motherboard. Even if you’re on a budget, value options like the MSI MAG Z390 TOMAHAWK are an excellent choice. You can enjoy better overclocking and thermals on your current processor, while being ready to equip your rig with a 9th Generation Intel processor as soon as it arrives at your doorstep."


"In short, if you are thinking of buying either the Core i7 9700K or the beastly Core i9 9900K, then definitely go with a Z390 motherboard. We’ve also made a list of the best Z390 Motherboards as well if you’re looking to buy one."



However, neither source explains what could be the reason you want a Z390 motherboard vs a Z370 for memory overclocking....

It is not the VRMs - its the different QVL list and different memory optimizations / sub-timmings that you DO NOT know neither can you fix by hand...not you...a memory engineer maybe, unless you are one. This and other BIOS optimizations targeted on the NEW CPUs.

In any case, do not complain that XMP is not working on Auto - no such thing is guarranteed for the Z370 APEX NOT made for 9900K CPUs and not with a QVL memory kit. Max supported speed is irrelevant since there is much more to RAM than frequency.

And I am fully aware of the APEX as well as the others that replied to this thread....look at system signatures before assuming things since you are on overclock.net not www.averagejoe.net.

Now, at least make an effort to fine tune your memory kit before exchanging the CPU...or go for it if you are sure this is the problem. Not much else can be suggested to you at this point.

I would get a Z390 before changing the CPU though and this would be after testing how good an overclocker it is.

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post #30 of 88 (permalink) Old 03-14-2019, 05:15 AM
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It has 4 pages already? Wow.

OP try to disable turbo, and if it boots, well at least it would prove something.
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