Z170 VRM Discussion Thread

This is a thread for people to discuss the VRMs of Z170 motherboards.


How important is VRM?
Well, with the lower power consumption of Skylake, I haven noticed many of the motherboard vendors lowering the VRM specifications of their boards. That doesn't mean that the boards are not any good, but it does justify some scrutiny. They also got rid of the FIVR on Skylake, but this is offset by the lower power consumption somewhat.

VRM is only part of the equation though of course. Other things such as a stable BIOS,, what features you want, and so on, also will play a role.

Removing the voltage regulator from the die was a great move. It gives board makes the option of including whatever they'd like. Many of the high end Z170 boards have much better regulation thanks to this move, in addition to moving a real heat generator off the die.

Also, most high end boards seem to have at least 8 phases. Plenty adequate for these CPUs.

When the Intel engineers were asked on multiple occasions why the FIVR was removed their reasons was that they wanted to remove it as it added to the TDP of the platform and increased design complexity of the CPU. I also read a while back that the Intel Israeli team (same team that designed Skylake) was against the FIVR from the start of Haswell, it could just be that they didn't feel the technology was warranted, or they figured it has inherent flaws. Either way there are still some internal VR settings in the BIOS of more than just a few boards, but you don't need to mess with them. VRM quality is still important, but not as important as before.

This.

For those that do not know, the Intel has 2 teams (actually more, but these 2 are the ones that concern us) - one in Oregon in the US, and another in Haifa. They "leapfrog" each other. The Oregon team designed Nehalem and Haswell architectures, along with what is following Skylake. The Israeli team designed the Conroe, Sandy Bridge, and Skylake architectures. They will designed whatever follows the architecture after Skylake.

VRM design still does matter. The FIVR adds to the TDP of the CPU, rather than on the VRMs. For us enthusiasts that was always bad because that made a hot CPU even hotter, and one key purpose of a good motherboard is to have good VRMs for overclocking. Either way, I"m glad it's gone.

In terms of power efficiency, Intel has actually made some very impressive strides in performance per watt. I suppose the disappointing thing for us enthusiasts right now is the fact that raw performance has not gone up as much as we liked. I was pleasantly surprised back when Skylake was first released - I had feared that the Broadwell OCs were indicative of what we would get in SKylake. It turned out to be better. At this time we do not have a large enough sample size to draw a conclusion, but preliminary clocks seem to be 4.5 - 4.7 GHz, with golden chips at 4.8 is what we can expect on air. Considering 4.7 . 4.9 GHz (and a few 5.0 golden chips) is what people expect with Devil's Canyon, it's a slight downgrade, but not by much, and of course Haswell is about 10% slower clock for clock. We seem to be heading to the limits of silicon here. It remains to be seen whether we will go to III-V materials, or whether or not progress is slowing down for now (unless something in the far future like graphene saves the day for a bit).

I hear they took out the AVX 512 as there was not enough memory bandwidth (not sure if true). Purley will be coming with 6 channels of RAM, which should be very impressive indeed at least for the bandwidth.

Oh, and of course the PCH is quite a bit better.

I'm not sure if you were trying to make a motherboard VRM listing or something.

I found this the other day while pricing out a DDR4 skylake build.

Overviews

Ocaholic performance overview, the biggest difference is power consumption http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=1655
* MSI Z170A Gaming M5 uses 6 phase ISL hybrid VRM , but 12 phases http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/smartsection/item.php?page=3&itemid=1663
* MSI Z170A Gaming M7 uses ISL6388 (6 true phase) hybrid VRM http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=1658&page=3
* Asrock Extreme7+ uses 12 phase http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=1668&page=3
*ASUS Maximus VIII Hero http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=1662&page=3
* Maximus VIII Gene http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=1659&page=3
* ASUS z170-A VRM http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/extgallery/public-photo.php?photoId=17926

GiggleHD VRM overview (very few boards, basically copy-paste of Sin0822's stuff on Tweaktown): http://gigglehd.com/zbxe/13223437

Hardwareluxx VRM overview, largely blank: http://www.hardwareluxx.de/community/f12/hardwareluxx-z170-mainboard-vrm-liste-update-10-09-15-a-1083516.html


REVIEWS with VRM Info

ASUS Z170 deluxe with 22 phase VRM http://www.overclockers.com/asus-z170-deluxe-motherboard-review/

overclockers.ru review of MSI Z170A XPower Gaming Titanium Edition (IR35201 PWM, IR3555) http://www.overclockers.ru/lab/70611_3/obzor-i-testirovanie-materinskoj-platy-msi-z170a-xpower-gaming-titanium-edition-kogda-serebro-dorozhe-zolota.html
overclockers.ru review of MSI Z170A Gaming M7 (Intersil ISL95856 PWM) http://www.overclockers.ru/lab/70085_3/obzor-i-testirovanie-materinskoj-platy-msi-z170a-gaming-m7.html
overclockers.ru review of ASUS Z170A Deluxe (ASP1405I PWM, IR3598 doublers) http://www.overclockers.ru/lab/70109_2/obzor-i-testirovanie-materinskoj-platy-asus-z170-deluxe.html
overclocker.ru review of Asrock Extreme 7+ (IR 35201 , IR3598 doublers, TI CSD87350Q5D Nexfets) http://www.overclockers.ru/lab/70197_2/obzor-i-testirovanie-materinskoj-platy-asrock-z170-extreme7.html


Sin0822 's review of the Gigabyte Z170 Gaming G1 http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/7290/gigabyte-z170x-gaming-g1-intel-z170-motherboard-review/index3.html Sin 0822's review of Asrock OC Formula http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/7334/asrock-z170-oc-formula-intel-motherboard-review/index3.html Sin0822 's review of a MSI Gaming m9 http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/7332/msi-z170a-gaming-m9-ack-intel-z170-motherboard-review/index3.html
Sin0822's review of Asrock Extreme4 http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/7295/asrock-z170-extreme4-intel-motherboard-review/index3.html
Sin0822's review of Asrock Fatal1ty Z170 Gaming K6 http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/7279/asrock-fatal1ty-z170-gaming-k6-intel-motherboard-review/index3.html
Sin0822's review of Gigabyte Z170x-ud5 http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/7326/gigabyte-z170x-ud5-intel-z170-motherboard-review/index3.html
Sin0822's review of ASUS Maximus VIII Hero http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/7276/asus-rog-maximus-viii-hero-intel-z170-motherboard-review/index3.html

Modders-inc review of EVGA Z170 FTW http://www.modders-inc.com/evga-z170-ftw-motherboard-review-overclocking-gambit/2/
Modders-inc review of Gigabyte Z170X-Gaming 7 http://www.modders-inc.com/gigabyte-z170x-gaming-7-review-everything-and-then-some/2/

Overclockers ua review of MSI Z170A Gaming M7 (ISL95856) http://www.overclockers.ua/motherboard/msi-z170a-gaming-m7/
Overclockers ua review of ASUS Z170 Deluxe (ASP14051 VRM, 20 phase low RDS-on style mosfets) http://www.overclockers.ua/motherboard/asus-z170-deluxe/
Overclockers ua review of ASUS Maximus VIII Ranger (ASP1400B VRM, TI CSD87350 mosfets) http://www.overclockers.ua/motherboard/asus-maximus-VIII-ranger/
Overclockers ua review of ASUS Z170-A (ASP1400B VRM, NTMFS4C09N + NTMFS4C06N mosfets) http://www.overclockers.ua/motherboard/asus-z170-a/

Overclockers review of ASUS Z170-A http://www.overclockers.com/asus-z170-motherboard-review/
Overclockers review of ASUS Z170 deluxe http://www.overclockers.com/asus-z170-deluxe-motherboard-review/
Overclockers review of ASUS Maximus VIII Gene http://www.overclockers.com/asus-maximus-viii-gene-motherboard-review/
Overclockers review of EVGA Z170 Classified http://www.overclockers.com/evga-z170-classified-motherboard-review/

Pctekindia, ASUS Z170 Pro Gaming (ASP1400B VRM , 10-phase CPU Power VRM Section with ON Semiconductors NTMFS4C09N MOSFETs rated up to 40A each along with 60A Ferrite Chokes and 10K Black Capacitors.) http://www.pctekindia.com/Reviews/ASUSZ170PROGAMING.aspx
---> I believe this is the same review in English http://www.erodov.com/forums/asus-z170-pro-gaming-motherboard-review/80315.html

digit review of ASUS Maximus VIII Ranger (ASP 1400B VRM, Digital 10-phase CPU Power VRM Section with Texas Instruments 87350D MOSFETs rated up to 40A each along with 60A Ferrite Chokes and 10K Black Capacitors.) http://www.digit.in/forum/reviews/193401-56k-warning-asus-maximus-viii-ranger-motherboard-review-part-i.html

ixbt's review of Gigabyte Z170x gaming 7 (intersil PWM ISL95856) http://www.ixbt.com/mainboard/gigabyte/gigabyte-ga-z170x-gaming-7.shtml
ixbt's review of Asrock Extreme6 (intersil PWM ISL95856) http://www.ixbt.com/mainboard/asrock/asrock-z170-extreme6.shtml
ixbt's review of Asus Z170 Pro Gaming (ASP1400 VRM with NTMFS4C09N mosfets) http://www.ixbt.com/mainboard/asus/asus-z170-pro-gaming.shtml

http://www.realcpu.co.kr/web_2013/news_product.html?tname=nboard_p_news&mode=view&idx=833&page=1&key=&keystring=&PHPSESSID=5f70d2d476c9268aad77d499cff55585

ferra.ru review of MSI Z170A gaming M7 (intersil PWM ISL95856) http://www.ferra.ru/ru/system/review/msi-z170a-gaming-m7/#.VfHvsZaopSA

Chiphell review of MSI Z170 Gaming M9 (intersil PWM: ISL95856) http://www.chiphell.com/article-14363-3.html

itbbs review of asrock extreme 6 , intersil PWM http://itbbs.pconline.com.cn/diy/52406300.html

Gecid review of Gigabyte Z170X Gaming 3 (ISL95856 , SiRA12DP and SiRA18DP) http://en.gecid.com/mboard/gigabyte_ga-z170x-gaming_3/?s=all
Gecid review of GIgabyte Z170X Gaming 7 (ISL95856) http://en.gecid.com/mboard/gigabyte_ga-z170x-gaming_7/
Gecid review of EVGA Z170 Claymore (unnamed VRM but has pictures) http://en.gecid.com/mboard/ecs_z170-claymore/?s=all
Gecid review of MSI z170a Gaming M5 (ISL95856) http://en.gecid.com/mboard/msi_z170a_gaming_m5/?s=all
Gecid review of ASUS Maximus VIIII Hero (ASP1405I PWM, TI NexFETS) http://en.gecid.com/mboard/asus_maximus_viii_hero/
Gecid review of ASUS Z170 Pro Gaming (ASP1400B PWM, 10 phase) http://en.gecid.com/mboard/asus_z170_pro_gaming/?s=all
Gecid review of ASUS z170A (ASP1400B PWM, 10 phase) http://en.gecid.com/mboard/asus_z170-a/

TPU review MSI Z170A Gaming M7 , no VRM specifications, just a picture https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/Z170A_GAMING_M7/5.html

Highlights:
* Asrock is still using Intersil "hybrid" VRM , except on the OC Formula.
* ASUS is still using ASP rebranded International Rectifier PWMs
* EVGA is using IR3553M in large numbers
* Gigabyte has gone to hybrid ISL VRM on the UD5
* MSI has retained the hybrid ISL VRM , on their pages they have OC on M7 board to 4.6Ghz (https://gaming.msi.com/article/skylake-z170-overclocking-experience-247-air-water-and-sub-zero-cooling-oc-results)



Phases must provide power for : VCC (VCore), VCCGT (Graphics core), VCCSA (System Agent), and VCCIO (CPU IO)

---

So I think the Digital VRM ~ $160 ASUS Z170-A could be the best buy right now (at these prices) other than the ~$250 Asrock OC Formula / ~$230 ASUS Maximus VIII Hero, unless you spring for the EVGA FTW ~ $170. However I don't have much confidence in EVGA Motherboards (and the FTW lacks USB 3.1) , but these seem to have IR3553M VRMs.


I have a feeling that phase count will be misleading as usual.
Current market prices off PCPartpicker (Click to show) Motherboards used for HWbot submissions (Click to show)
TL;DR: Buy stock in Intersil, they have pretty much dominated the entire Z170 motherboard ranges. Sorry for the messy post, I haven't organized it all.

Something caught my attention on Asus Z170-A. I have also thought that Z170-A has a Digital PWM. Then, I realize that all IR PWMs that have been used before by Asus does not have 52 pins (13 x4) (IR3580, IR3567B, IR3563A, IR3548, IR35201 etc). But, ASP1400B has 52pins, like ISL95856 and ISL95824. Can it be a rebranded version of ISL95856 or ISL95824?
Probably I'm wrong, but I've some weird feelings about it.

Here is the some IR PWMs' diagrams:
http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/pb-ir3580.pdf
http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/pb-ir3563a.pdf
http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/ir3548.pdf
http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/pb-ir3567b.pdf
http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/pb-ir3567a.pdf

This is the ASP1400B:
http://gecid.com/data/mboard/201508061200-39645/img/16_asus_z170-a.jpg

ISL95824:
http://imagescdn.tweaktown.com/content/7/2/7279_19_asrock-fatal1ty-z170-gaming-k6-intel-motherboard-review_full.jpg

ISL95856:
http://imagescdn.tweaktown.com/content/7/2/7295_18_asrock-z170-extreme4-intel-motherboard-review_full.jpg
http://abload.de/img/dsadsovpbn.png

KizilejdeR , it's a legitimate concern.

I looked into it a bit: Z170 Pro Gaming has a ASP1400B PWM controller but the number under ASP1400B is different: G1520AS (http://www.ixbt.com/mainboard/asus/asus-z170-pro-gaming/photo/big/vrm.jpg). The Maximus VIII Ranger uses a PWM that reads ASP1400B with 1522AS underneath (http://www.overclockers.ua/motherboard/asus-maximus-VIII-ranger/10-big-asus-maximus-VIII-ranger.jpg ) The Z170-A has a ASP1400B PWM controller with G1515AS underneath.

If they're using a Intersil PWM I believe a board such as the ASRock Fatal1ty Z170 Gaming K4 , Z170 Extreme4 OR Gigabyte GA-Z170X-UD3, Gigabyte GA-Z170X-Gaming 5 would be as good or better. Today I checked pcpartpicker and the ASUS Z170 Pro Gaming also dropped to $163

We need someone with hwinfo64 to confirm what ASUS is using on the Z170 non ROG boards.

Another thing is in my previous post I wrote EVGA Claymore, it's ECS not EVGA.

"CE1"s using on Z170-A as drivers are most likely Richtek 5AZ. If that is so, this makes that the PWM is Intersil. (Only IR PWM being used is IR35201. IR implementations use IR drivers (has no integrated drivers), and Intersil implementations use Intersil or Richtek drivers or no drivers.) I hate that rebranded things... We need someone who has Z170-A and test whether pinout is same as Intersil or not.

CE1: http://abload.de/img/15_asus_z170-ai3pq1.jpg
5AZ: http://abload.de/img/7326_19_gigabyte-z170e9qap.jpg

There's too much Intersil!

I agree. For Z170 you need IMVP 8 which is essentially a mobile specification, and Intersil is pretty big in the mobile arena, so I guess they gave desktop boards a discount on the PWM. So Intersil is basically the standard now with IR being more desired and harder to find. Of course, the important thing is that the company needs to implement LLC on their own for the PWM (as it isn't in there as a stock settings in the Intel/AMI code), and this brings up many problems with the lower end motherboards. It also isn't great when a company applies ISL LLC guidelines to an IR PWM and visa versa.