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Bad EKWB CPU Contact, please help.

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post #161 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 02:06 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by m70b1jr View Post
I have my EK Classic RGB block setup as shown in your 2nd picture. Is there a modified version out the the coldplate closer to the chiplets?
No I think @ExB said he actually modified the Jet Plate himself, to make it closer to the Chiplets, however he also noted that it made absolutely no difference in temps.

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post #162 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 11:30 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by oreonutz View Post
Real Quick I am only posting because @ExB mentioned he wasn't sure what voltage displayed in RM. You were right to be suspicious of it. It is not a voltage at all, it is VID. I am not sure how it calculates it's VID number, it seems to be an Average of all the Cores VID, over a certain period of time. Before the RM and Chipset update last month, it used to just pick the Core with the Highest VID and report that, but after the update where they changed the Temperature reporting to an average over a period of time, they seemed to do the same with the VID, which only makes it harder for people to guess what it is by comparing with values in HWinfo. But it is MOST DEFINITELY a VID. This is why when you set your voltage Manually in UEFI and then try to adjust in RM it doesn't do anything, because VID is ignored when in OC Mode (Manual Vcore set in UEFI).
Well, that's exactly the thing.. VIDs shown in hwinfo and the voltage in RM don't match either, that's why I'm a bit confused about that I did suspect it is a VID though..

Quote: Originally Posted by MrSnowmobiling View Post
That's a fantastic image @ExB ! My motherboard is a Crosshair VIII Hero. My vcore droops down to 1.319v under R20 so I'm not a whole lot higher than yours. LLC at level 3 currently.

@oreonutz that's a good point also. I didn't realize RM is setting VIN and not vcore... I'm 1.35v in UEFI so RM doesn't change it at all. I was kinda curious as to what that does.
I have the same mobo, have a play with the voltages a bit, I too use LLC3 and I have a manual 1.3125V set in UEFI and I'm kinda stable at 4.25GHz for AVX prime.. (it does reboot randomly sometimes, maybe every 10th torture test I do after more than 30mins of running the test - that's about the time my bench loop takes to stabilize all water temp sensors so I can take repeatable and comparable measurements). It's honestly the max I wanna run my chip at, I don't like running into 90s for extended periods of time, and it's definitely enough power to test and highlight differences in block designs and positions and contacts..

Quote: Originally Posted by m70b1jr View Post
I have my EK Classic RGB block setup as shown in your 2nd picture. Is there a modified version out the the coldplate closer to the chiplets?
No, as oreonutz pointed out, I modified my mounting plate (the black metal part with mounting holes) so I can move the position of the block around on the CPU. And still this effort was for nothing, I had same temps as if my Velocity was mounted regularly (jet plate vertical)..
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post #163 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 11:39 AM
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This is not strictly about EKWB blocks, but Igor is doing lots of good testing with modified block for Ryzen as well, for anyone interested: https://www.igorslab.media/en/ryzen-...sting-results/

Confirms my suspicion that the IHS on these chips is really good at it's job and it won't really matter where the inlet to the block is, the deciding factor in good cooling for these chips will be who manages to produce a block, that will have the best coldplate to IHS contact will be my guess
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post #164 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 12:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by ExB View Post
This is not strictly about EKWB blocks, but Igor is doing lots of good testing with modified block for Ryzen as well, for anyone interested: https://www.igorslab.media/en/ryzen-...sting-results/

Confirms my suspicion that the IHS on these chips is really good at it's job and it won't really matter where the inlet to the block is, the deciding factor in good cooling for these chips will be who manages to produce a block, that will have the best coldplate to IHS contact will be my guess
Should I lap my IHS then? Cold plate is completely flat, maybe I should do IHS Next?

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post #165 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 12:52 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by ExB View Post
This is not strictly about EKWB blocks, but Igor is doing lots of good testing with modified block for Ryzen as well, for anyone interested: https://www.igorslab.media/en/ryzen-...sting-results/

Confirms my suspicion that the IHS on these chips is really good at it's job and it won't really matter where the inlet to the block is, the deciding factor in good cooling for these chips will be who manages to produce a block, that will have the best coldplate to IHS contact will be my guess
Damn this is interesting stuff. So ****. After years of practice of mounting Cold Plates to CPU's, and getting so damn effecient at it, it would seem that AMD has come and upset the status quo, by making us question whether our mounts are sufficient, and by requiring us to lap our cold plates! LOL! But seriously, if we want our chips to do real work, where they are going to be run with a full AVX Load for 12 to 24 hours a day, then its going to be important to get this right. I guess its time for me to break out the sandpaper!

I am grateful for all the information everyone has posted here. I have only ever lapped a block once, and to be honest, I did such a poor job that the difference was only 4 Degrees C. So not looking forward to this...

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post #166 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 09:44 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by ExB View Post
I have the same mobo, have a play with the voltages a bit, I too use LLC3 and I have a manual 1.3125V set in UEFI and I'm kinda stable at 4.25GHz for AVX prime.. (it does reboot randomly sometimes, maybe every 10th torture test I do after more than 30mins of running the test - that's about the time my bench loop takes to stabilize all water temp sensors so I can take repeatable and comparable measurements). It's honestly the max I wanna run my chip at, I don't like running into 90s for extended periods of time, and it's definitely enough power to test and highlight differences in block designs and positions and contacts..
After reading some reddit yesterday, I pulled the voltage down to 1.3V and just some testing in R20, I appear stable at 4.45GHz CCD0 and 4.25GHz CCD1. I haven't tested other things like AIDA or Asus realbench yet so I'm not sure if this is 24/7 good or not. Temps are quite a bit lower. I'd rather risk my $100 block with lapping than my $500 CPU
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post #167 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-11-2019, 12:28 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by oreonutz View Post
But seriously, if we want our chips to do real work, where they are going to be run with a full AVX Load for 12 to 24 hours a day, then its going to be important to get this right. I guess its time for me to break out the sandpaper!
To be honest, any real workload, even using AVX for long times for rendering and video encoding tasks isn't going to be as taxing as Prime AVX load, not in my experience anyway. I always run a prime avx "unstable" overclock in my daily (but stability obviously checked in other benchmarks, meaning apps and games I actually use..).

Quote: Originally Posted by m70b1jr View Post
Should I lap my IHS then? Cold plate is completely flat, maybe I should do IHS Next?
Well, if you already lapped the cold plate to be completely flat (mounted fully into the block of course, as that will change it's shape), then you definitely should lap the IHS as well (your own decision of course, this will void the CPUs warranty). Even then, two completely flat surfaces are very very hard to mount to eachother perfectly, you will have to play with mounting pressure and thermal paste application, not just tighten everything down completely and call it done.

Quote: Originally Posted by MrSnowmobiling View Post
After reading some reddit yesterday, I pulled the voltage down to 1.3V and just some testing in R20, I appear stable at 4.45GHz CCD0 and 4.25GHz CCD1. I haven't tested other things like AIDA or Asus realbench yet so I'm not sure if this is 24/7 good or not. Temps are quite a bit lower. I'd rather risk my $100 block with lapping than my $500 CPU
Mine is stable 4.4GHz both CCDs in CB R20 and most other benchmarks, but not prime AVX (errors immediately )
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post #168 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-12-2019, 02:31 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by ExB View Post
To be honest, any real workload, even using AVX for long times for rendering and video encoding tasks isn't going to be as taxing as Prime AVX load, not in my experience anyway. I always run a prime avx "unstable" overclock in my daily (but stability obviously checked in other benchmarks, meaning apps and games I actually use..).
Yeah I do the same. I actually have a Per CCX Overclock going on that is stable for everything, including Y Cruncher for 30 Minutes (Which was the longest I was willing to keep my Processor That hot for) the only issue is my Processor ran at 103.3c, with CCD1 At 102.5c and CCD2 at 94.5c for an entire half an hour, and did not get 1 Error. Thats with CCX0 at 4.4Ghz, CCX1 at 4.425Ghz, CCX2 at 4.275Ghz, and CCX3 at 4.25Ghz and this was completely 100 Percent Stable, at least for that 30 Minute run, it just was MUCH HOTTER then I am willing to run for longer then 30 Minutes, to be honest that is probably already too long, I just was convinced it was going to crash, and it didn't so I am pretty sure that CCX OC would be able to take just about any load. This was using Y Cruncher BBT Stress Load, which uses an AVX2 Floating Point Load.

But for literally EVERYTHING ELSE, including my most intense Blender Renders, Vegas Video Renders (using a crap ton of FX Plugins), Handbrake x265 4k Renders, and 6 x265 Renders simultaneously, each inside there own Debian VM from my Windows 10 Host using VMWare Workstation Pro, each assigned 2 Cores and 4 Threads Each, leaving 2 Cores and 4 Threads left for the Host OS which was running the 6th Handbrake x265 Render, with the Affinity in Handbrake Set to use the One Core and 2 Threads (to leave some overhead for the hypervisor). With every single One of these tests, My Everyday Per CCX OC Is 100 Percent Stable, and thats CCX0 at 4450, CCX1 at 4475, CCX2 at 4275, and CCX3 at 4250, and the Hottest My CPU Gets is with a Blender Render after an Hour the Tctl Gets to 87c, with CCD1 at 86c and CCD2 at 78c. And then during the VM x265 Renders, after about 25 Minutes Temps Reach 89c with CCD1 at 88c and CCD2 at 80c. Running the CPU with this CCX OC gets me the Closest to having the best of both worlds with a decently high Single Core Clock for my Favored Cores, and doing better then if I settled for my All Core OC of 4.25Ghz, which because of my Weak CCX3, is what I am limited to, unless I want to bring my CPUv above 1.4v. Oh and by the way, both of these Per CCX OC's are achieved with just 1.287v, which is not bad considering I was running an All Core OC of 4.25Ghz at 1.275v previously, so I only had to up my Voltage by 12 mV to achieve a damn stable OC. Also, I can do all this without ever having to open Ryzen Master or opening any tool at all after boot, I have worked out a way to have the CCX OC take effect at Windows Boot, which is great!

Anyways, I only bring all this up, to say that I definitely agree with you, but because my temps are still on the high side, I do still definitely need to figure out a way to bring down my temps, because even with the Blender Render (and the Handbrake and Vegas Renders which are only about 2 degrees lower then my Blender Render) this is something I do regularly, and 85 to 88c is just too hot, so I definitely have to figure out a way to get this Mount to be much better. ANyways I am going to shut up now!

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post #169 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-12-2019, 02:35 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by m70b1jr View Post
Should I lap my IHS then? Cold plate is completely flat, maybe I should do IHS Next?
you should'a done both from the get go.

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post #170 of 170 (permalink) Old 09-12-2019, 02:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by skupples View Post
you should'a done both from the get go.
Trying to come to terms that my warranty will go bye bye

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