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Moving from single to double loop - advice needed on reservoir / pumps

 
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post #1 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-18-2019, 04:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Moving from single to double loop - advice needed on reservoir / pumps

Hello everyone,

My current build just died on me, and I will likely have to replace the motherboard and the proc, which means tearing down my loop. In order to ease maintenance, I would like to go to a double loop system, with a simpler loop each time.

What I have currently :
- 6900K @ 4.2 + 2x 1080 Ti @stock . The whole thing was running super cold, I don't think the GPU ever ran hotter than 40°
- EK mobo block + 2x waterblocks for the 1080Ti, with a parallel block bridge
- single loop with a 450ml res, 2 pumps in serial (achieving roughtly 0.9GPM, but no more)
- 3 rad, in serial (Hardware Labs Black Ice Nemesis GTX 480, a GTX 280, and a GTX 560)
- a flow sensor (Aquacomputer flow sensor with Aquabus)

My issues :
- the loop is huge, purging is is a pain even though I designed it for that (valves everywhere, etc...)
- I used passthrough, which looks super neat, but is a gigantic pain in the neck to maintain (they never stay tight, and I almost lost fingers tightening the pump --> passthrough tube )
- I neglected the amount of vibration the pumps would generate, and I didn't use the decoupling screws very well (too tight), so the setup vibrates at certain pump speeds
- despite having a SMA8, the case is crowded (especially the lower chamber), making any change tedious
- the dual GPU setup is less and less needed, and is probably killing my flow

What I like to do :
- Single CPU loop : CPU bloc --> GTX 480 --> 150ml reservoir + pump attached under (a 480 should be well enough for a Ryzen 3900X)
- Single GPU loop : GPU block --> GTX 560 --> 150ml reservoir + pump attached under (the 560 should be even overkill)
- discard the GTX 280

Variant : I could get rid of the GTX 560 and use the GTX 280 instead (not sure if this would be sufficient for a 2080Ti)

My questions :
- When running on a single loop, do you have concerns that if the pump dies it can damage the thing ? I have an AQ6 so I can instruct it to shut down the computer when that happens (I built the relay thing so it is equivalent to a finger press on the power button), is that a sufficient protection ?
- would a single pump be OK to drive those loops ?
- how to fix the pump+res assembly so it doesn't vibrate ?
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post #2 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-18-2019, 07:25 AM
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.9gpm with 2 pumps? What kind of pumps do you have? I'm pretty sure a D5 PWM single pump would get better performance than that .


And how did your current build die? It's very unlikely a CPU died if it worked to begin with.

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post #3 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-18-2019, 08:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote: Originally Posted by sok0 View Post
.9gpm with 2 pumps? What kind of pumps do you have? I'm pretty sure a D5 PWM single pump would get better performance than that .


And how did your current build die? It's very unlikely a CPU died if it worked to begin with.
1/ aquacomputer D5 pumps (USB/Aquabus) : if I push them to 100% I can go to maybe 1.2gpm, but then they became super loud, which kills the whole point of watercooling . But as I said the loop is long, with everything in serial (2 GPU blocks in parallel, 1 mobo block, 4 rad, 1 flow sensor, and I have Ts for the exhaust and intake valves.

2/ Note : this build has been working flawlessly for 2 years. I was just playing yesterday morning (Apex legends, online) when the computer shut down (power loss style, not a graceful windows shutdown). I tried to restart it and the whole computer starts for about 0.5 sec (barely enough to get the fans spinning), then shuts down again. I don't even get anything on screen, and the Q-code never even show any digits.

I tried :
- wait and retry after the PC would have cooled down (if the CPU overheats, you can normally pass POST and it crashes during OS boot) ==> same issues
- another PSU : same issues
- remove everything and keep only the AQ6 running and the fans : runs smoothly, all fans start, pumps start, etc...
- remove the RAM altogether : same symptom.

I don't see why you say the CPU and/or the mobo cannot die after 2 years : the CPU was OC, maybe it just died ?
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post #4 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-18-2019, 04:23 PM
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Most likely it was the motherboard that died, not the CPU..

Something seems wrong with your pumps to be honest. I dont see how a single d5 couldnt handle that loop, let alone 2... They shouldnt vibrate much either, I cant even tell my d5 is running unless i look at the water movement in the res.

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post #5 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-19-2019, 02:56 AM
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The flow rate you had is perfectly normal for 4 blocks, 3 rads and a flow sensor plus all fittings and tube. Only a much simpler loop will get to 1.5GPM

Noise is extremely subjective. The quieter a system gets the more likely you are to notice pump noise even if in reality it might be similar to an old fashioned hard drive in real levels.
Pump mounting does make a big difference though. A pump mounted to a large flat surface like a case wall or motherboard tray can generate much more vibration, noise and resonance than a pump mounted with a well designed isolation system to something with mass like a radiator. When I changed from case wall mount using the EK Xres mount system to a 140mm fan mount attached to radiator the vibration dropped significantly.

Dual loops will work just fine in the config you mention or just about any way you like. Its quite hard to truly go wrong. The only thing you will see is higher GPU temps but seeing as even with just the 280 they will still be way cooler than air cooling it works fine.
Its just two different schools of thought when it comes to dual loops. Do you put the larger rad on the CPU or the GPU loop? On one hand the GPU puts out much more thermal load so some put the large rad on it. On the other hand GPU's are much more effectively cooled than CPU's so they can get away with less rad and still be far cooler than air cooled. Its just down to preference really.

The Aq6 shut down system works very well if you set it up right but the inbuilt thermal shutdown and throttling systems work just fine to protect hardware too. I like to have an alarm set to trigger before the shutdown would so that I can see any problem and fix it while the system is still safe if I'm not there. Its worked great for me.
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