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  Topic Review (Newest First)
05-15-2019 01:21 PM
wingman99 Having a power-supply watts rating equal to what the rig is using will last the 10 year warranty just the same as purchasing increased watt ratting that you won't use.
05-15-2019 03:25 AM
nanotm
Quote: Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
Editing a few videos won't result in a high power consumption.

How many hours per day would this gaming be done? 2? 3? I don't know many people who can spend much more time than that gaming, except maybe on the weekends. I mean, really, unless it's like 10 hours per day, it doesn't increase the average all that much.

People get far more worried about power consumption than they should, especially when they are carefully making sure to buy a GOOD power supply. "Omg, I game for 3 hours per day with my GTX 2080. I'd better buy a good 850W PSU". Facepalm. That would be a stupid way to spend money. Period.
well I used to spend most of every day playing games, which is down to my personal circumstances, indeed that will likely be the case in the future as well... in some ways its great having nothing but leisure time in others not so much /
05-15-2019 12:12 AM
TwoCables
Quote: Originally Posted by nanotm View Post
sure but since my average use case was playing some game or other, maybe editing a few videos and my occasional use was reading a book or doing some word processing I based my average power draw on my peak power draw, which is why I said in my experience...
Editing a few videos won't result in a high power consumption.

How many hours per day would this gaming be done? 2? 3? I don't know many people who can spend much more time than that gaming, except maybe on the weekends. I mean, really, unless it's like 10 hours per day, it doesn't increase the average all that much.

People get far more worried about power consumption than they should, especially when they are carefully making sure to buy a GOOD power supply. "Omg, I game for 3 hours per day with my GTX 2080. I'd better buy a good 850W PSU". Facepalm. That would be a stupid way to spend money. Period.
05-14-2019 02:13 AM
nanotm
Quote: Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post
No, no, no, no. It doesn't work that way. Your understanding of it is not quite correct (but then MOST people don't understand it correctly). Yes, most PSUs should give their best efficiency when the power consumption is between 40% and 60% of its total output capacity, but there's more to understand than just that alone. You want your average power consumption to fall in that range, not your peak. Even then, this really doesn't apply to today's good PSUs like it did to PSUs from many years ago. Some good PSUs today give their best efficiency at almost any power draw. So this is really an obsolete concern and there's really nothing more to discuss.

However, if one were to insist that this is important for them, then again, they should figure out what their average power consumption will be day to day and then base their purchase on that.

So, ok, let's say your most demanding activity is gaming and let's say you only do that for a couple of hours every day and the rest of the time your system is either idling, or under VERY low loading conditions, or off completely. That's a VERY low average power draw. Let's say the power consumption while gaming is precisely 500W. With everything else being the same as I just described (resulting in the extremely low average power draw), you could power this just fine with a high-end 550W PSU if you had to and you'd be fine and your average efficiency would still be quite good and this PSU would give you years and years and years of excellent service.

Now, let's take this in the complete opposite direction and say that your system is at full load 24/7. Maybe it's Folding and mining at the same time 24/7. Let's assume it is, and let's assume the power consumption is 500W. For THIS particular system and loading scenario, the average power consumption is 500W. That's enormously different from the previous situation where the average loading condition was extremely low. For an average load of 500W, yeah, I would recommend nothing less than a high-end 850W PSU. I would be foolish to recommend anything less than that for a 500W average power draw.

So you see, you can't just say "well, my peak hits 500W, so therefore I want an 850W PSU or bigger".

I don't want to hear about keeping the PSU cool either. With today's good PSUs, if you choose to keep your average power consumption at 40-60% of the total output capacity (which would be at least 100-200W higher than the continuous wattage rating that's advertised), then you're looking at a life of over 10 years for that PSU. Easily. Probably far longer than 10 years.

Yes, the GOOD PSUs only advertise their continuous wattage rating, not their absolute peak. So that 550W PSU I mentioned might actually have a peak of 750W, especially if it's a very high-end unit. Think about that for a while! The continuous rating means exactly that: continuous. 24/7. Non-stop. Imagine how damn good the PSU has to be in order to deliver 550W continuously. Why worry about pulling 500W out of a PSU like this for a few hours every day?! Right?!?! Right.
sure but since my average use case was playing some game or other, maybe editing a few videos and my occasional use was reading a book or doing some word processing I based my average power draw on my peak power draw, which is why I said in my experience...
05-12-2019 09:22 PM
TwoCables
Quote: Originally Posted by nanotm View Post
well its been my personal opinion that since the sweet spot of efficiency is between 50%>80% load on the psu your best of determining what your peak power draw should be cpu+gfx +100w (average for ancillaries) (most often somewhere around 500>650w meaning you should be looking at between 850 and 1000w psu's to be within the peek efficiency curve for hte psu (this also means its not likely to get warm through use nor need more than around 30% fan speed even on the hottest days) this will also mean that providing your running from a stable supply its unlikely to make any noise
No, no, no, no. It doesn't work that way. Your understanding of it is not quite correct (but then MOST people don't understand it correctly). Yes, most PSUs should give their best efficiency when the power consumption is between 40% and 60% of its total output capacity, but there's more to understand than just that alone. You want your average power consumption to fall in that range, not your peak. Even then, this really doesn't apply to today's good PSUs like it did to PSUs from many years ago. Some good PSUs today give their best efficiency at almost any power draw. So this is really an obsolete concern and there's really nothing more to discuss.

However, if one were to insist that this is important for them, then again, they should figure out what their average power consumption will be day to day and then base their purchase on that.

So, ok, let's say your most demanding activity is gaming and let's say you only do that for a couple of hours every day and the rest of the time your system is either idling, or under VERY low loading conditions, or off completely. That's a VERY low average power draw. Let's say the power consumption while gaming is precisely 500W. With everything else being the same as I just described (resulting in the extremely low average power draw), you could power this just fine with a high-end 550W PSU if you had to and you'd be fine and your average efficiency would still be quite good and this PSU would give you years and years and years of excellent service.

Now, let's take this in the complete opposite direction and say that your system is at full load 24/7. Maybe it's Folding and mining at the same time 24/7. Let's assume it is, and let's assume the power consumption is 500W. For THIS particular system and loading scenario, the average power consumption is 500W. That's enormously different from the previous situation where the average loading condition was extremely low. For an average load of 500W, yeah, I would recommend nothing less than a high-end 850W PSU. I would be foolish to recommend anything less than that for a 500W average power draw.

So you see, you can't just say "well, my peak hits 500W, so therefore I want an 850W PSU or bigger".

I don't want to hear about keeping the PSU cool either. With today's good PSUs, if you choose to keep your average power consumption at 40-60% of the total output capacity (which would be at least 100-200W higher than the continuous wattage rating that's advertised), then you're looking at a life of over 10 years for that PSU. Easily. Probably far longer than 10 years.

Yes, the GOOD PSUs only advertise their continuous wattage rating, not their absolute peak. So that 550W PSU I mentioned might actually have a peak of 750W, especially if it's a very high-end unit. Think about that for a while! The continuous rating means exactly that: continuous. 24/7. Non-stop. Imagine how damn good the PSU has to be in order to deliver 550W continuously. Why worry about pulling 500W out of a PSU like this for a few hours every day?! Right?!?! Right.
05-11-2019 07:41 AM
ryan92084 I wouldn't say yours is a typical home use case. Regardless we are well outside the topic now.
05-11-2019 06:26 AM
nanotm
Quote: Originally Posted by ryan92084 View Post
Most home users would be looking at something more like https://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...82E16842102238
would that be why the vast majority dont end up with what they need and end up annoyed that the device isnt up to the job ?

this is the actual device I purchased https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I've had it for around 5 years, prior to that I purchased other junk like the item you listed and it was woefully inadequate and ended up purchasing several different ones over about 15 years, mostly because the sort of item I actually wanted was way outside of my price bracket until one day it wasn't...

and I can run my pc off the ups box for about an hour whilst under heavy load (at max power draw my old system was sucking in around 750w, my new rig barely pops over 500w but thats what happens 10 years on everything is more power efficient)


prior to getting the UPS and plugging an extension bar into it (for things like the phone wall wart and the psu's for the modem, external drives etc) I was replacing those things way too often (but the old UPS could barely keep the pc running never mind anything else) now I have had the same UPS router and multiple power bricks since 2014 and saved a bunch of money in the process....

I knew what I needed and when I finally found something that fit the price bracket I got it happily (certainly cheaper than rma'ing the psu that I had replaced twice due to problems caused by the incoming supply being erratic)
05-10-2019 05:10 PM
ryan92084
Quote: Originally Posted by nanotm View Post
well its been my personal opinion that since the sweet spot of efficiency is between 50%>80% load on the psu your best of determining what your peak power draw should be cpu+gfx +100w (average for ancillaries) (most often somewhere around 500>650w meaning you should be looking at between 850 and 1000w psu's to be within the peek efficiency curve for hte psu (this also means its not likely to get warm through use nor need more than around 30% fan speed even on the hottest days) this will also mean that providing your running from a stable supply its unlikely to make any noise

as to the op's question on page 1 by UPS I mean Uninterruptable Power Supply like this https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0083TXNMM...i-a=B0083TXNMM

I'm not in the US though I'm fairly certain you can get better deals than the ones listed on the amazon page, however you should be looking for something thats going to give you at a minimum 1500va for 30 mins (this also means you can run the tower +monitor +modem/router off of it and if you shut down the pc during a power cut your wifi will still work for several days due to the minimal power draw, I know this last part from personal experience, although best if you get one that lets you turn the alarms off becasue they tend to be loud and annoying)

oh found this https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0083TXNMM...i-a=B0083TXNMM
much better price but I didnt bother looking to far into it / probably still cheaper and better options from places like Walmart or bestbuy /
Most home users would be looking at something more like https://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...82E16842102238
05-10-2019 10:54 AM
nanotm well its been my personal opinion that since the sweet spot of efficiency is between 50%>80% load on the psu your best of determining what your peak power draw should be cpu+gfx +100w (average for ancillaries) (most often somewhere around 500>650w meaning you should be looking at between 850 and 1000w psu's to be within the peek efficiency curve for hte psu (this also means its not likely to get warm through use nor need more than around 30% fan speed even on the hottest days) this will also mean that providing your running from a stable supply its unlikely to make any noise

as to the op's question on page 1 by UPS I mean Uninterruptable Power Supply like this https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0083TXNMM...i-a=B0083TXNMM

I'm not in the US though I'm fairly certain you can get better deals than the ones listed on the amazon page, however you should be looking for something thats going to give you at a minimum 1500va for 30 mins (this also means you can run the tower +monitor +modem/router off of it and if you shut down the pc during a power cut your wifi will still work for several days due to the minimal power draw, I know this last part from personal experience, although best if you get one that lets you turn the alarms off becasue they tend to be loud and annoying)

oh found this https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0083TXNMM...i-a=B0083TXNMM
much better price but I didnt bother looking to far into it / probably still cheaper and better options from places like Walmart or bestbuy /
04-30-2019 08:15 PM
munternet Is the GPU whine something associated with 110v supplies?
I run a HX1200i and the fan never turns on that I've noticed so there's no fan noise and I've never heard a whine coming from the GPU/VRMs except once on a stress test (forget which one).
Parts in sig.

I didn't read all the posts so I apologize if this was already addressed
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