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04-02-2020 10:28 AM
ManniX-ITA
Quote: Originally Posted by MyUsername View Post
I was a bit harsh Jack Daniels speaking sorry, OCCT is a good quick system checker. Careful with [email protected], my motherboard had a fit the next day and didn't work for 24 hours. I was about to RMA, got an itch to test the board and got it working again somehow.

VDDP/VDDG at stock voltages my end aren't that stable and I do get sudden shut downs. VDDG should be 50mV under SOC voltage 1.1v, if overclocking the IF/SOC I would increase LLC to turbo or extreme. Memory anything near 3600 I would use VDDP 1050mV, but this isn't as sensitive as VDDG.


Not sure why but I don't get such extreme thermals with [email protected], 78 degrees max. I have to double check...

I tried running at 950/1000, 1000/1050, 1050/1000. Also many other combinations and split VDDG CCD/IOD.
I always end up after maybe a few days of perfection into instabilities or random reboots.
Lasted very long with SOC vCore at 1.168V and 1000/1050; really reliable and good bench scores but at some point again, unstable.
Same for PWM and LLC, tried High, Turbo, Extreme; from zero changes to only worst.

Now I'm back at 900/950 with SOC voltage offset +0.025 and CPU LLC Medium, SOC LLC Low, CPU Current Protection Medium, PWM Auto.
It's finally rock stable and I can get great performances with PBO bug and [email protected], most critical scenario.

I love and hate this CPU, I'm wasting so much time on it...
04-02-2020 10:09 AM
MyUsername
Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post
Well, he needs a good enough check
I didn't try folding, will give a shot to see how it goes on mine.
I was a bit harsh Jack Daniels speaking sorry, OCCT is a good quick system checker. Careful with [email protected], my motherboard had a fit the next day and didn't work for 24 hours. I was about to RMA, got an itch to test the board and got it working again somehow.


Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post
Well, OCCT should just work... whatever BIOS version you use.
If it doesn't there's something wrong lurking in the shadows, sooner or later you'll find something else not working as well.

Probably the other heavy workload you had success with are just on the edge of instability.
I'd recommend you investigate it; try setting LLC for CPU at Medium and SOC at Low and run again OCCT.
Try also setting VDDP/VDDG at 900/950 manually.
VDDP/VDDG at stock voltages my end aren't that stable and I do get sudden shut downs. VDDG should be 50mV under SOC voltage 1.1v, if overclocking the IF/SOC I would increase LLC to turbo or extreme. Memory anything near 3600 I would use VDDP 1050mV, but this isn't as sensitive as VDDG.
04-02-2020 09:19 AM
pschorr1123
Quote: Originally Posted by joker_95 View Post
Again, thanks.
Both guys in the videos seem to know what they're talking about, so I decided to try out the Asus ROG C8H instead. Doesn't make sense to save 100 bucks to potentially get the very same issues.
They also both agree you can't go wrong with any MB on the ~420 price-point from any manufacturer, so I upgraded and I'll still try Asus. VRMs and voltage regulators seem to be much more solid compared to the X570-F.
Also read some reviews saying Asus had better VRMs/thermals in general. And I guess I'll also start to appreciate the external "Clear CMOS" button :-D



Nessun problema, sono Italiano anch'io :-D
Good call on the CH8, you won't be disappointed. That's the board I was going to get if I hadn't got the Master. Only thing that really bugged me was the single phase vrm for the SOC. I like to lurk in all of the Am4 forums so I hope you will report your results over there. Best of luck to you.
04-02-2020 07:26 AM
briank
Quote: Originally Posted by joker_95 View Post
<Snipped>

Could have been the first batch of boards (Aug 2019), but in my 20+ years assembling PCs I have never seen a poorer build quality.
Not in hardware, not in BIOS core stability, not in BIOS UI:
1. Random BIOS resets: really? in 2020? for the money I'm throwing at them for this?
2. Low Battery BIOS resets: even worse: either electronic design was screwed up or the quality of the components wasn't really as marketed? Both of them are scary
3. Happened to get stuck multiple times during BIOS upgrades (51% or so): yes, backup BIOS, BUT WHY DID IT GET STUCK?!

4. Why do VCore voltage offset settings only seem to apply after 2 reboots? Isn't one enough?

5. Why the hell does the BIOS Smart fan panel get stuck/incredibly laggy all the time and only works after clear CMOS? (had it since day 1 with all BIOSes)
6. Why the hell do I need to click "Accept" everytime I want to access PBO settings?
7. Why the hell there are 20 sub-menus for stuff that could have been put in the same section, just with decent dividers?


TL; DR: I gave up, today I filled the online RMA form for this board and have already ordered an Asus Rog Strix X570-F Gaming.
I understand your frustration. I can also say this has been a frustrating experience. I think one of the causes is that AMD has decided to squeeze every last bit of performance from every chiplet. With each chiplet being binned and having a custom VID curve and then features which are supposed to increase stability when the chip is being pushed to the edge (like PBO and clock stretching). Not only do they make each chip unique, they also make it much harder to detect instabilities as they can run along for days before an error or crash happens. All this complexity I think has made it difficult for the Mobo manufacturers to come up with default settings that are truly stable for all CPUs and all workloads. It's clear they are struggling as are we.

I have spent 10X more time fine tuning this CPU / Mobo / Memory combo than any overclock I've done before. And it still has more performance I could squeeze out of it. It just stopped being fun. Maybe I'll return to it sometime in the future, but I'm just burnt out from all the complexities. While it's great having 32 threads, I do miss the simplicity of my previous Intel systems.
04-02-2020 05:26 AM
ManniX-ITA
Quote: Originally Posted by joker_95 View Post
Again, thanks.
Both guys in the videos seem to know what they're talking about, so I decided to try out the Asus ROG C8H instead. Doesn't make sense to save 100 bucks to potentially get the very same issues.
They also both agree you can't go wrong with any MB on the ~420 price-point from any manufacturer, so I upgraded and I'll still try Asus. VRMs and voltage regulators seem to be much more solid compared to the X570-F.
Also read some reviews saying Asus had better VRMs/thermals in general. And I guess I'll also start to appreciate the external "Clear CMOS" button :-D

Nessun problema, sono Italiano anch'io :-D
LoL, perfetto
Good luck with the C8H then, much better choice indeed!
04-02-2020 05:16 AM
joker_95
Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post
Yes MSI did a lot of missteps lately; you have to pick up the right model.
Some have an incredibly very embarrassing VRM part...
But same as well with ASUS.

Here in this thread cidious went back to MSI and was very pleased.
No issues with voltages, straight up working XMP profile and memory overclock, very good performances.

Maybe check buildzoid's video on this board:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtvAd7y9B9o

Again, thanks.
Both guys in the videos seem to know what they're talking about, so I decided to try out the Asus ROG C8H instead. Doesn't make sense to save 100 bucks to potentially get the very same issues.
They also both agree you can't go wrong with any MB on the ~420 price-point from any manufacturer, so I upgraded and I'll still try Asus. VRMs and voltage regulators seem to be much more solid compared to the X570-F.
Also read some reviews saying Asus had better VRMs/thermals in general. And I guess I'll also start to appreciate the external "Clear CMOS" button :-D

Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post

I have just had a look to a similar video comments, in Italian sorry, and they are not good at all.
Seems it's much inferior to the TUF version and the Strix -E and much worse than the Unify...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bwnzpVSt0M
The big red "BOCCIATA" text means: "REJECTED"
Nessun problema, sono Italiano anch'io :-D
04-02-2020 01:44 AM
ManniX-ITA
Quote: Originally Posted by smonkie View Post
Very interesting info indeed. I guess I could try to downgrade BIOS version and try again, but it's just so much hussle just to make OCCT works. Thanks.

By the way, I'm getting so much better Cinebench scores with -0.05V, so I'll let it there.
Well, OCCT should just work... whatever BIOS version you use.
If it doesn't there's something wrong lurking in the shadows, sooner or later you'll find something else not working as well.

Probably the other heavy workload you had success with are just on the edge of instability.
I'd recommend you investigate it; try setting LLC for CPU at Medium and SOC at Low and run again OCCT.
Try also setting VDDP/VDDG at 900/950 manually.
04-02-2020 01:37 AM
ManniX-ITA
Quote: Originally Posted by joker_95 View Post
Thanks for the reply.

Didn't know about 6, must have missed it, thanks.
As for 4, I know it was happening in the past, read about it and observed it happening esp. first 2-3 months of ownership. Perhaps it was visible only on older BIOSes, but still...

A friend suggested Asus ROG as he was always very pleased with the brand/lineup, and googling around for <brand/board> + issues, I found the Asus ROG lineup to have the least/less severe issues compared to the other boards (ofc, some confirmation bias kicks in here).
I also got the impression, for a long time, that MSI sometimes doesn't know how to handle thermals/cooling, so I left the brand as the last choice.
Yes MSI did a lot of missteps lately; you have to pick up the right model.
Some have an incredibly very embarrassing VRM part...
But same as well with ASUS.

Here in this thread cidious went back to MSI and was very pleased.
No issues with voltages, straight up working XMP profile and memory overclock, very good performances.

Maybe check buildzoid's video on this board:

I have just had a look to a similar video comments, in Italian sorry, and they are not good at all.
Seems it's much inferior to the TUF version and the Strix -E and much worse than the Unify...
The big red "BOCCIATA" text means: "REJECTED"
04-02-2020 12:39 AM
joker_95
Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post
Feel sorry for you
Really hope this issues are happening only to the first batches, I'm terrified it could happen to me too at some point...

I agree, especially for the price I paid the Master, the quality isn't on par with the expectations.

About your points:
1. Agree, there's something wrong and this specific issue it's not common to other x570 boards as far I could see
2. Agree, probably related to n.1: I think I saw the first "low CMOS battery level" alarm in 80s... what happened in the last 40 years? It's puzzling the board doesn't detect it
3. Didn't happen to me, maybe an earlier signal something was wrong? On the Master I often get a freeze after BIOS flash the first time I try to save the profile
4. Does not happen to mine; earlier signal too?
5. Does not happen to mine; maybe related to the CSM setting?
6. That's AMD forcing it, not the boards manufacturer. You'll have it too with the ASUS
7. Agree, the BIOS layout is not the best and it's not improving

The board layout is really well done and the VRM part is top notch, these are the best aspects for me.
But the thermal pads for the chipset and for the back-plate are rubbish...
There are good points and bad points; the other brands they have their issues too.
It's a pity the direct support we had here is gone; that alone convinced me to try again with GB.
The last board I had from GB was an half disaster in quality; very similar issues as these ones.

But why did you went ASUS? I'd have bet on MSI, they both have issues but I read much worse about ASUS lately.
Does this model have good reviews or else?
Thanks for the reply.

Didn't know about 6, must have missed it, thanks.
As for 4, I know it was happening in the past, read about it and observed it happening esp. first 2-3 months of ownership. Perhaps it was visible only on older BIOSes, but still...

A friend suggested Asus ROG as he was always very pleased with the brand/lineup, and googling around for <brand/board> + issues, I found the Asus ROG lineup to have the least/less severe issues compared to the other boards (ofc, some confirmation bias kicks in here).
I also got the impression, for a long time, that MSI sometimes doesn't know how to handle thermals/cooling, so I left the brand as the last choice.
04-01-2020 11:53 PM
smonkie
Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post
Temps seems fine. Yes, it could be the board is not giving enough, in my case I have to use a -0.050 instead.
But I've read in this thread people that had to use a +0.050 like you.

I've got mine already with the new AGESA but someone said this is a common issue with the latest one and x570.
The previous version didn't had it so they were blaming AMD not the board manufacturers.
But it's an hearsay, so take it as it is.

Without the negative offset I don't get OCCT errors but poor performances and 5-10 degrees more than it should.

Using the straight optimized defaults I get horrible performances and USB drops, it's just not working reliably as expected.
Guess I have to blame both GB and AMD for it, I'm just not sure how to split it between the two
Very interesting info indeed. I guess I could try to downgrade BIOS version and try again, but it's just so much hussle just to make OCCT works. Thanks.

By the way, I'm getting so much better Cinebench scores with -0.05V, so I'll let it there.
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