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  Topic Review (Newest First)
04-02-2020 03:54 PM
joker_95
Quote: Originally Posted by pschorr1123 View Post
Good call on the CH8, you won't be disappointed. That's the board I was going to get if I hadn't got the Master. Only thing that really bugged me was the single phase vrm for the SOC. I like to lurk in all of the Am4 forums so I hope you will report your results over there. Best of luck to you.
Thanks, will report back then :-)


Quote: Originally Posted by bluechris View Post
What is your MB part number? Myne and several others that their died were from the 1st batches but incredibly yours lasted very long. RMA it asap and don't accept anything with lower PN than 3000
Did my part and searched on google how to look up the PN, but couldn't find any info.
On the Gigabyte website I read that all the stickers to the power connectors were reporting serial numbers, here for reference: "4 719331 005999", "SN192500024507", "B42E993CA878".
If it's the sticker close to the PCH fan (with a small red dot), it reads "1/D/J5A109 01407". I couldn't find anything else on the board that looked like an SN/PN.


If none is correct, can you please point me to the right place to look at?
I'm getting it exchanged anyway for an Asus C8H, but would be good to know. Thank you!
04-02-2020 01:12 PM
bluechris
Quote: Originally Posted by joker_95 View Post
Hi all,


Posting to leave my experience, hoping it helps someone decide whether these boards are worth it.


Built the following config September 2019:
- Aorus Pro X570
- Sapphire Radeon RX 5700 XT
- Seasonic Prime Ultra Titanium 850W
- Corsair Vengeance LPX 4x16GB 3200MHz
The CPU, Ryzen 3800X, came in late September and was the last piece missing (had ordered 3900X with all the build that got delivered mid-Aug, but they were weeks away for delivery).



Experienced more or less in order order:
1. Super-long first startup - a good 4-5 mins - made me think the build was DoA

2. BIOS randomly resetting for a couple weeks after ~1 month the build was running

3. BIOS resetting every day at first cold boot - changed CMOS battery after looking for 3 days straight for answers in forums (and yes, Vbat was 2.78V and after change got back to 3.2Vsomething) - still happened a couple times later on
4. (once) BIOS resetting and switching to backup BIOS (F11 -> F3 stock that was with the board)

5. Random shutdowns during gameplay before BIOS F11



3 weeks ago I then swapped Wraith cooler for Noctua NH-D15s trying to get better thermals, got -10C in idle (~32C absolute) and -15C under load (~72C absolute). CPU was always undervolted to -0.0625V, never had stability issues in Linux (heavy/day long compiling) and got 10C for free under load (90C->80C).

During the swap I discovered that I applied too much thermal paste when I put on the stock cooler (luckily not conductive), had to cleanup and managed to get it working regardless.


Things were perfect for 3 weeks, I thought I had the build perfectly running, finally.
I had upgraded to F12e during this time, no issues before nor after.

When I say things were perfect I mean I was compiling, multiple times, ~1500 packages for 3 days straight without issues.



And... nope.
Today after finishing my work-from-home shift, I click the power button as usual.
3 short beeps, board reboots (fans slow down), fans spin up again to fixed rate, no POST beep.
Checking the LEDs on the board, I see it's stuck on CPU - thought by chance it finally got busted due to some thermal paste stuck somewhere and leaked downwards due to gravity (which anyway shouldn't have mattered as it was silicon-based, but you never know that perhaps it's preventing proper contact for the 1 critical CPU pin).
But it should at least still POST or beep in agony, attempt a BIOS reset, or at least display something on screen.
Nothing.
I clear CMOS, try again, same happens.

Open everything up, look for good cleaning video guides, clean out the CPU as-if just purchased with alcohol and a toothbrush. Disassemble the top plastic part of the socket, clean it properly also with alcohol and toothbrush, clean the bottom part with a needle (luckily there was very little stuff there, so I carefully plucked it out).
Reassemble. Dead.


Now it's stuck on the RAM LED. Pulled out all RAM, nothing.
Tried running with just the CPU (no RAM/GPU/SSD). Tried running without ANYTHING, just the board herself.

Again, nothing at all, for minutes. Of course various clear CMOS were attempted in between, but nothing helped.

It can't be the PSU because the GPU, LEDs and fans do spin. The front USB-C charging only panel does charge the phone.




Could have been the first batch of boards (Aug 2019), but in my 20+ years assembling PCs I have never seen a poorer build quality.
Not in hardware, not in BIOS core stability, not in BIOS UI:
1. Random BIOS resets: really? in 2020? for the money I'm throwing at them for this?
2. Low Battery BIOS resets: even worse: either electronic design was screwed up or the quality of the components wasn't really as marketed? Both of them are scary
3. Happened to get stuck multiple times during BIOS upgrades (51% or so): yes, backup BIOS, BUT WHY DID IT GET STUCK?!

4. Why do VCore voltage offset settings only seem to apply after 2 reboots? Isn't one enough?

5. Why the hell does the BIOS Smart fan panel get stuck/incredibly laggy all the time and only works after clear CMOS? (had it since day 1 with all BIOSes)
6. Why the hell do I need to click "Accept" everytime I want to access PBO settings?
7. Why the hell there are 20 sub-menus for stuff that could have been put in the same section, just with decent dividers?


TL; DR: I gave up, today I filled the online RMA form for this board and have already ordered an Asus Rog Strix X570-F Gaming.
What is your MB part number? Myne and several others that their died were from the 1st batches but incredibly yours lasted very long. RMA it asap and don't accept anything with lower PN than 3000
04-02-2020 10:28 AM
ManniX-ITA
Quote: Originally Posted by MyUsername View Post
I was a bit harsh Jack Daniels speaking sorry, OCCT is a good quick system checker. Careful with [email protected], my motherboard had a fit the next day and didn't work for 24 hours. I was about to RMA, got an itch to test the board and got it working again somehow.

VDDP/VDDG at stock voltages my end aren't that stable and I do get sudden shut downs. VDDG should be 50mV under SOC voltage 1.1v, if overclocking the IF/SOC I would increase LLC to turbo or extreme. Memory anything near 3600 I would use VDDP 1050mV, but this isn't as sensitive as VDDG.


Not sure why but I don't get such extreme thermals with [email protected], 78 degrees max. I have to double check...

I tried running at 950/1000, 1000/1050, 1050/1000. Also many other combinations and split VDDG CCD/IOD.
I always end up after maybe a few days of perfection into instabilities or random reboots.
Lasted very long with SOC vCore at 1.168V and 1000/1050; really reliable and good bench scores but at some point again, unstable.
Same for PWM and LLC, tried High, Turbo, Extreme; from zero changes to only worst.

Now I'm back at 900/950 with SOC voltage offset +0.025 and CPU LLC Medium, SOC LLC Low, CPU Current Protection Medium, PWM Auto.
It's finally rock stable and I can get great performances with PBO bug and [email protected], most critical scenario.

I love and hate this CPU, I'm wasting so much time on it...
04-02-2020 10:09 AM
MyUsername
Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post
Well, he needs a good enough check
I didn't try folding, will give a shot to see how it goes on mine.
I was a bit harsh Jack Daniels speaking sorry, OCCT is a good quick system checker. Careful with [email protected], my motherboard had a fit the next day and didn't work for 24 hours. I was about to RMA, got an itch to test the board and got it working again somehow.


Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post
Well, OCCT should just work... whatever BIOS version you use.
If it doesn't there's something wrong lurking in the shadows, sooner or later you'll find something else not working as well.

Probably the other heavy workload you had success with are just on the edge of instability.
I'd recommend you investigate it; try setting LLC for CPU at Medium and SOC at Low and run again OCCT.
Try also setting VDDP/VDDG at 900/950 manually.
VDDP/VDDG at stock voltages my end aren't that stable and I do get sudden shut downs. VDDG should be 50mV under SOC voltage 1.1v, if overclocking the IF/SOC I would increase LLC to turbo or extreme. Memory anything near 3600 I would use VDDP 1050mV, but this isn't as sensitive as VDDG.
04-02-2020 09:19 AM
pschorr1123
Quote: Originally Posted by joker_95 View Post
Again, thanks.
Both guys in the videos seem to know what they're talking about, so I decided to try out the Asus ROG C8H instead. Doesn't make sense to save 100 bucks to potentially get the very same issues.
They also both agree you can't go wrong with any MB on the ~420 price-point from any manufacturer, so I upgraded and I'll still try Asus. VRMs and voltage regulators seem to be much more solid compared to the X570-F.
Also read some reviews saying Asus had better VRMs/thermals in general. And I guess I'll also start to appreciate the external "Clear CMOS" button :-D



Nessun problema, sono Italiano anch'io :-D
Good call on the CH8, you won't be disappointed. That's the board I was going to get if I hadn't got the Master. Only thing that really bugged me was the single phase vrm for the SOC. I like to lurk in all of the Am4 forums so I hope you will report your results over there. Best of luck to you.
04-02-2020 07:26 AM
briank
Quote: Originally Posted by joker_95 View Post
<Snipped>

Could have been the first batch of boards (Aug 2019), but in my 20+ years assembling PCs I have never seen a poorer build quality.
Not in hardware, not in BIOS core stability, not in BIOS UI:
1. Random BIOS resets: really? in 2020? for the money I'm throwing at them for this?
2. Low Battery BIOS resets: even worse: either electronic design was screwed up or the quality of the components wasn't really as marketed? Both of them are scary
3. Happened to get stuck multiple times during BIOS upgrades (51% or so): yes, backup BIOS, BUT WHY DID IT GET STUCK?!

4. Why do VCore voltage offset settings only seem to apply after 2 reboots? Isn't one enough?

5. Why the hell does the BIOS Smart fan panel get stuck/incredibly laggy all the time and only works after clear CMOS? (had it since day 1 with all BIOSes)
6. Why the hell do I need to click "Accept" everytime I want to access PBO settings?
7. Why the hell there are 20 sub-menus for stuff that could have been put in the same section, just with decent dividers?


TL; DR: I gave up, today I filled the online RMA form for this board and have already ordered an Asus Rog Strix X570-F Gaming.
I understand your frustration. I can also say this has been a frustrating experience. I think one of the causes is that AMD has decided to squeeze every last bit of performance from every chiplet. With each chiplet being binned and having a custom VID curve and then features which are supposed to increase stability when the chip is being pushed to the edge (like PBO and clock stretching). Not only do they make each chip unique, they also make it much harder to detect instabilities as they can run along for days before an error or crash happens. All this complexity I think has made it difficult for the Mobo manufacturers to come up with default settings that are truly stable for all CPUs and all workloads. It's clear they are struggling as are we.

I have spent 10X more time fine tuning this CPU / Mobo / Memory combo than any overclock I've done before. And it still has more performance I could squeeze out of it. It just stopped being fun. Maybe I'll return to it sometime in the future, but I'm just burnt out from all the complexities. While it's great having 32 threads, I do miss the simplicity of my previous Intel systems.
04-02-2020 05:26 AM
ManniX-ITA
Quote: Originally Posted by joker_95 View Post
Again, thanks.
Both guys in the videos seem to know what they're talking about, so I decided to try out the Asus ROG C8H instead. Doesn't make sense to save 100 bucks to potentially get the very same issues.
They also both agree you can't go wrong with any MB on the ~420 price-point from any manufacturer, so I upgraded and I'll still try Asus. VRMs and voltage regulators seem to be much more solid compared to the X570-F.
Also read some reviews saying Asus had better VRMs/thermals in general. And I guess I'll also start to appreciate the external "Clear CMOS" button :-D

Nessun problema, sono Italiano anch'io :-D
LoL, perfetto
Good luck with the C8H then, much better choice indeed!
04-02-2020 05:16 AM
joker_95
Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post
Yes MSI did a lot of missteps lately; you have to pick up the right model.
Some have an incredibly very embarrassing VRM part...
But same as well with ASUS.

Here in this thread cidious went back to MSI and was very pleased.
No issues with voltages, straight up working XMP profile and memory overclock, very good performances.

Maybe check buildzoid's video on this board:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtvAd7y9B9o

Again, thanks.
Both guys in the videos seem to know what they're talking about, so I decided to try out the Asus ROG C8H instead. Doesn't make sense to save 100 bucks to potentially get the very same issues.
They also both agree you can't go wrong with any MB on the ~420 price-point from any manufacturer, so I upgraded and I'll still try Asus. VRMs and voltage regulators seem to be much more solid compared to the X570-F.
Also read some reviews saying Asus had better VRMs/thermals in general. And I guess I'll also start to appreciate the external "Clear CMOS" button :-D

Quote: Originally Posted by ManniX-ITA View Post

I have just had a look to a similar video comments, in Italian sorry, and they are not good at all.
Seems it's much inferior to the TUF version and the Strix -E and much worse than the Unify...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bwnzpVSt0M
The big red "BOCCIATA" text means: "REJECTED"
Nessun problema, sono Italiano anch'io :-D
04-02-2020 01:44 AM
ManniX-ITA
Quote: Originally Posted by smonkie View Post
Very interesting info indeed. I guess I could try to downgrade BIOS version and try again, but it's just so much hussle just to make OCCT works. Thanks.

By the way, I'm getting so much better Cinebench scores with -0.05V, so I'll let it there.
Well, OCCT should just work... whatever BIOS version you use.
If it doesn't there's something wrong lurking in the shadows, sooner or later you'll find something else not working as well.

Probably the other heavy workload you had success with are just on the edge of instability.
I'd recommend you investigate it; try setting LLC for CPU at Medium and SOC at Low and run again OCCT.
Try also setting VDDP/VDDG at 900/950 manually.
04-02-2020 01:37 AM
ManniX-ITA
Quote: Originally Posted by joker_95 View Post
Thanks for the reply.

Didn't know about 6, must have missed it, thanks.
As for 4, I know it was happening in the past, read about it and observed it happening esp. first 2-3 months of ownership. Perhaps it was visible only on older BIOSes, but still...

A friend suggested Asus ROG as he was always very pleased with the brand/lineup, and googling around for <brand/board> + issues, I found the Asus ROG lineup to have the least/less severe issues compared to the other boards (ofc, some confirmation bias kicks in here).
I also got the impression, for a long time, that MSI sometimes doesn't know how to handle thermals/cooling, so I left the brand as the last choice.
Yes MSI did a lot of missteps lately; you have to pick up the right model.
Some have an incredibly very embarrassing VRM part...
But same as well with ASUS.

Here in this thread cidious went back to MSI and was very pleased.
No issues with voltages, straight up working XMP profile and memory overclock, very good performances.

Maybe check buildzoid's video on this board:

I have just had a look to a similar video comments, in Italian sorry, and they are not good at all.
Seems it's much inferior to the TUF version and the Strix -E and much worse than the Unify...
The big red "BOCCIATA" text means: "REJECTED"
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