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-   -   G403 Angled sensor vs G pro (https://www.overclock.net/forum/375-mice/1623966-g403-angled-sensor-vs-g-pro.html)

noibat2 02-23-2017 06:44 AM

Anyone have problems with the angled sensor? I cant make a straight line. I don't know if is my hand size and my grip ( Hybrid Claw/Palm and 17cm hand.) or it's the angled sensor.

Also, the G pro have the same sensor angle?

Thanks.

Avalar 02-23-2017 07:06 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by noibat2 View Post

Anyone have problems with the angled sensor? I cant make a straight line. I don't know if is my hand size and my grip ( Hybrid Claw/Palm and 17cm hand.) or it's the angled sensor.

Also, the G pro have the same sensor angle?

Thanks.

The G403 I know has a weird sensor angle, but as far as I know, my G Pro is completely straight.

If this is some kind of manufacturing error, I'd love a replacement. biggrin.gif

shatterboxd3 02-23-2017 08:08 AM

The sensor is fine. it's your grip on the mouse and how you're moving it.

fourthavenue 02-23-2017 08:35 AM

What do you mean by "cant make a straight line"?
If you mean the line you draw is curved, that's because these mice don't have angle snapping.
If you mean the line is running diagonal, like "from top left to bottom right" or "from bottom left to top right", that's because of your grip.

fourthavenue 02-23-2017 08:46 AM

Logitech China even has an official tip on why G403 users can't draw a horizontal line.



I believe G403 is not the only mouse that would have this problem. If one is using IE3.0, he's likely to have the same experience.

It's just that G403 is so hyped. People have really high expectation of it.
So many people put interests and attention into it. So many bought it even if they never handled a gaming mouse before.

People notice some issues on G403 and yelling around every forum, saying they are cheated by Logitech.
It's just because they never really paid attention to a mouse like they did to G403. It's not G403 having the issues.

noibat2 02-23-2017 08:55 AM

Thank you for all that info!
My grip is exaclty what picture shows : 1-3-1. My previous mouse was a 4 years old D.A where I tried to apply the same grip on G403.

Now , I'll start my training with a new grip style
Quote:
Originally Posted by fourthavenue View Post

Logitech China even has an official tip on why G403 users can't draw a horizontal line.



I believe G403 is not the only mouse that would have this problem. If one is using IE3.0, he's likely to have the same experience.

It's just that G403 is so hyped. People have really high expectation of it.
So many people put interests and attention into it. So many bought it even if they never handled a gaming mouse before.

People notice some issues on G403 and yelling around every forum, saying they are cheated by Logitech.
It's just because they never really paid attention to a mouse like they did to G403. It's not G403 having the issues.

noibat2 02-23-2017 08:55 AM

Sorry double.

NovaGOD 02-23-2017 09:01 AM

My grip is like the second "wrong" picture but i think i adjusted to it.

fourthavenue 02-23-2017 11:16 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by noibat2 View Post

Thank you for all that info!
My grip is exaclty what picture shows : 1-3-1. My previous mouse was a 4 years old D.A where I tried to apply the same grip on G403.

Now , I'll start my training with a new grip style

My grip is "angled" too. But I'm ok with G403 because I have been gripping like this for years and I'm use to such situations. My wrist movement will compensate my angled grip.
It is actually automatically done by the brain, not because I spent time adapting to it. Everyone can adapt to it in a hour of gaming session.
Like I said, it's just that most people never tried to draw a horizontal line before they receive a G403.

CorruptBE 02-23-2017 11:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by NovaGOD View Post

My grip is like the second "wrong" picture but i think i adjusted to it.

I did that years ago with the MX518. No big deal, I adjusted to it over time.

fourthavenue 02-23-2017 11:24 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CorruptBE View Post

I did that years ago with the MX518. No big deal, I adjusted to it over time.
Yes my grip is angled with almost every mouse, even with ambidextrous mice. But it doesn't hinder my gameplay. Because human can easily adjust to it.

SmashTV 02-23-2017 11:33 AM

As others said here it's your grip.

I've linked to the Deathadder post a few times. It's a "problem" with that style of ergo mice personally speaking.

daniel0731ex 02-23-2017 11:34 AM

I wonder if at any point in the Logitech design process they tried to analyze the moment of inertia tensor to see if the sensor is aligned with the shape's principle axes. If not, the sensor can technically be misaligned to how the shape tends to move.

imdavidboss 02-23-2017 01:21 PM

I have that same grip with almost all ergo mice. It's just what's most comfortable. My brain just adjusts how to move the mouse to compensate I guess because I have no problem with straight lines.

plyr 02-23-2017 01:54 PM

After a calibration on the surface here I can make straight lines, no problem. With that said, I don't like to where they point the sensor, you really have to play a bit to get used to it. I prefer the G Pro.

popups 02-23-2017 02:18 PM

If I hold the G403 in the most comfortable way the sensor will be slightly misaligned in my hand. If I hold it with the senor aligned I start to want to use another mouse. I sent the mouse back because the shape wasn't good for me -- I was always fighting to get comfortable while maintaining control.

The Pro was fine as it's a symmetrical shape. Main reason I continue to use symmetrical mice.

Artifact 02-23-2017 03:14 PM

Welcome to having a fingertip grip. Either get a mouse that accommodates it (G502, Naos...), or get used to having to compensate for the angle.

pindle 02-23-2017 03:16 PM

Same for me, played like that for years so np at all.

frunction 02-23-2017 03:55 PM

The problem with G403 is that the sensor is angled in the wrong direction for how many hold ergo mice... even worse than a normal mouse with a straight sensor. Another reason I gave up on it.

jjpjimmy 02-23-2017 05:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by fourthavenue View Post

Logitech China even has an official tip on why G403 users can't draw a horizontal line.



....

Ring finger on the right click button? Okay, I'll try it.

Avalar 02-23-2017 05:30 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjpjimmy View Post

Ring finger on the right click button? Okay, I'll try it.

Kinda have to if you want it to be straight.

It's weird. :/

SeanyC 02-23-2017 05:34 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by popups View Post

If I hold the G403 in the most comfortable way the sensor will be slightly misaligned in my hand. If I hold it with the senor aligned I start to want to use another mouse. I sent the mouse back because the shape wasn't good for me -- I was always fighting to get comfortable while maintaining control.

The Pro was fine as it's a symmetrical shape. Main reason I continue to use symmetrical mice.

I think the problem op is having is exactly this. I have the same problem with most Ergo mice.
I hold the Zowie EC and the SteelSeries Rival at an angle because they are more comfortable in my hand that way.
I've thought that the perfect ergo mouse (for me) would have its buttons angled to the left with some other visual indicator to show where the tip of the front is.

daniloberserk 02-23-2017 11:36 PM

Maybe it's the time for we have some "angle compensation option" on mice softwares?

popups 02-24-2017 12:28 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by daniloberserk View Post

Maybe it's the time for we have some "angle compensation option" on mice softwares?

Some sensors have that...

pindle 02-24-2017 04:23 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Avalar View Post

Kinda have to if you want it to be straight.

It's weird. :/

Nah I don't agree. Been using mainly Logitech mice for the past 15 years (some small timeframe exceptions), almost always ergo, mostly eggshell shapes, and this is a problem that's been with most if not all these mice. I'm holding it 1-2-2 because I just don't have good control with 1-3-1, so I don't want to change to Logitech's vision of a "good" grip. I guess I've adjusted my movements to it because I don't have a single problem with it. Can imagine though this is not for some people, esp. if you haven't been messed up like I apparantly have been smile.gif

daniloberserk 02-24-2017 08:39 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by popups View Post

Some sensors have that...

Hmm, I'm not talking about prediction or things like that. But imagine you turn 90º compensation on the option and suddenly when you move horizontally, the sensor goes vertically (but without skipping angle movement on your hand). Perfect straight horizontal lines will be perfect straight vertical lines, and imperfect horizontal lines will be imperfect vertical lines.
My english is kinda basic but maybe "tilting" os "rotating" is a better word?

Anyway. The only software I could find about this issue is here: http://www.maf-soft.de/mafmouse/

Give it a try and come back here!

Regulations 02-24-2017 09:20 AM

Yeah I had to hold my G403 at a really uncomfortable angle to keep from drifting up or down on swipes. Put a lot of strain on my wrist and made the mouse completely unusable for me. Too bad, it's a pretty solid mouse otherwise.

popups 02-24-2017 09:31 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by daniloberserk View Post

Hmm, I'm not talking about prediction or things like that. But imagine you turn 90º compensation on the option and suddenly when you move horizontally, the sensor goes vertically (but without skipping angle movement on your hand). Perfect straight horizontal lines will be perfect straight vertical lines, and imperfect horizontal lines will be imperfect vertical lines.
My english is kinda basic but maybe "tilting" os "rotating" is a better word?

Anyway. The only software I could find about this issue is here: http://www.maf-soft.de/mafmouse/

Give it a try and come back here!

I remember seeing an option in the sensor documentations about such a feature. It's something that can be done through the SROM of some sensors. I don't think there is a commonly used mouse that allows you to set it through driver software.

Conditioned 02-24-2017 11:33 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by daniloberserk View Post

Hmm, I'm not talking about prediction or things like that. But imagine you turn 90º compensation on the option and suddenly when you move horizontally, the sensor goes vertically (but without skipping angle movement on your hand). Perfect straight horizontal lines will be perfect straight vertical lines, and imperfect horizontal lines will be imperfect vertical lines.
My english is kinda basic but maybe "tilting" os "rotating" is a better word?

Anyway. The only software I could find about this issue is here: http://www.maf-soft.de/mafmouse/

Give it a try and come back here!

While I haven't tested this myself I believe the povohat driver can do this.

xmr1 02-24-2017 01:48 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by daniloberserk View Post

Hmm, I'm not talking about prediction or things like that. But imagine you turn 90º compensation on the option and suddenly when you move horizontally, the sensor goes vertically (but without skipping angle movement on your hand). Perfect straight horizontal lines will be perfect straight vertical lines, and imperfect horizontal lines will be imperfect vertical lines.
My english is kinda basic but maybe "tilting" os "rotating" is a better word?

Anyway. The only software I could find about this issue is here: http://www.maf-soft.de/mafmouse/

Give it a try and come back here!

3310 (and maybe others) has this angle tuning option native but not many made it available in software. I only remember Mionix software having it.

SoFGR 02-24-2017 03:19 PM

roccat KPM software has it as well ^



"sensor alignment"

c0dy 02-24-2017 04:45 PM

The mouseaccel-driver also has it.

https://mouseaccel.blogspot.com/p/blog-table-of-contents.html

Derp 02-24-2017 10:58 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by fourthavenue View Post

Logitech China even has an official tip on why G403 users can't draw a horizontal line.



When companies tell their customers they're doing it wrong. ?

popups 02-24-2017 11:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Derp View Post

When companies tell their customers they're doing it wrong. ?

They flared out the front instead of how they make it bend inward on the Pro and G100s. Naturally your hand doesn't follow the shape of the G403, as shown in the first figure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by popups View Post

I am more of a palm user for most motions, then I switch to a fingertip grip for precise motions. I don't feel in complete control

The mouse tends to end up slanted in my hand, making the sensor not align with my arm, thus making the cursor move diagonally instead of horizontally. The rear is tall and starts early, which makes it hard to do small downward motions as the mouse is already filling the palm and it stops me from having my palm on the pad in a way that gives me more control. The rear feels like a smaller Zowie AM more than a Zowie EC2. The mid to top right corner slants outward |_/ in a way that makes my small finger feel like it's in an awkward position, this decreases my control and kind of feels like I would get a cramp after a long session if I squeeze the mouse. So I try to hold the mouse more toward the rear, but I can't because the thumb area is designed for your finger to be under the side buttons and the rear is too thin to fill my palm in that position. Mouse 1 feels too tall for the arch, feels as if it makes me slower at pressing the button due to the angle. Some areas of the sides feel like a Zowie AM's or IntelliMouse Optical's sides / \.

Aliandro1d 02-25-2017 03:26 AM

I siad this on the main 403 thread that the sensor so SO angled that even with this "correct" grip, which by the way i naturally do the sensor is still angled.The info graphic show that where the cable attaches or essentially in between the left/right click is where the sensor faces straight along the y axis, this is false it's almost 5 degrees more to the left click than it "should" be. I think ill be returning and getting a g900 (i have the wireless g403 atm). For anyone on the fence i'd stay clear until Logitech sees the complaints and hopefully address it. all they have to do is move the pcb posts in the shell(some one can do this themselves but u shouldn't have to be cutting at the mouse to fix a design flaw). Yes you can adjust to the sensor angle but from my experience getting a mouse you can grip in a way the sensor moves closely to perfect is always so much better. mad.gif

paers 02-26-2017 11:40 AM

I own an obscene amount of mice and G403 is the only one I've ever had to resort to angle adjustment with. -4 in qlmoufiltr. Ridiculous. I give up. It's impossible to grip this mouse "properly".

Melan 02-26-2017 11:46 AM

I'd say how it took me only couple of hours to easily readjust my self to new sensor pos after G303 but why bother really. People will complain either way.arrowheadsmiley.png

paers 02-26-2017 11:59 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Melan View Post

I'd say how it took me only couple of hours to easily readjust my self to new sensor pos after G303 but why bother really. People will complain either way.arrowheadsmiley.png

And G303 is another very divisive shape, there's a reason it's discontinued

Melan 02-26-2017 12:02 PM

Well, I can tell you that I had the same issue when I've switched from EC1 evo to FK1.

SmashTV 02-26-2017 12:05 PM

With me it happens with IME 3.0 style mice. DA, EC, you name it. But I've adjusted to all of those when I used them so no biggie. They all end up angled in my hand.

Some of the replies here you'd think the mouse broke someone's hand. Yeesh.

Pa12a 02-26-2017 01:35 PM

People just don't get used to anything before drawing to conclusions. It's not a technical problem, you just grip your old mouse in a different way and it just screws your mouse movement when using the old grip on your new mouse.

Had the same happen by going G303 -> EC2-A -> FK1 -> G403.

It's like Lemon -> Orange -> Lemon -> Orange.

detto87 02-26-2017 03:16 PM

People are really desperate to find flaws in their mice. biggrin.gif

popups 02-26-2017 04:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by detto87 View Post

People are really desperate to find flaws in their mice. biggrin.gif

I like my G100s.

p1r4nh4 02-26-2019 03:03 PM

Does the g703 have the same problem with the sensor?

the1freeMan 02-27-2019 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p1r4nh4 (Post 27870678)
Does the g703 have the same problem with the sensor?

a) it's not a problem b) yes the shell is the same (google g703 bottom)


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