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UltraMega 12-12-2019 12:04 PM

Quote:


The thing about building a more efficient design, is that if you do not need more performance, you can instead clock it down, make it smaller, use less power, easier to cool, and live longer.

Even burst speed, when tuned correctly, can be more efficient for lower powered systems over all.
Obviously.

My point is that unless you need longer laptop battery life, nothing about CPU advancements in the last decade really affect most people since most people only do simple tasks.

Imouto 12-12-2019 01:20 PM

It isn't AMD they can't compete with, it is TSMC and Samsung. TSMC has 5 nm on track for 1H next year and Samsung can dump memory into the market like there is no tomorrow.

When you are as big as Intel and with such a big portfolio you leave a lot of fronts open and they don't have the ability to turn around because that would leave something else exposed. There are a lot of companies looking to snag some market from Intel like Qualcomm or Apple. TSMC, Samsung and AMD were just the first ones to realize the emperor is naked. The only way they can survive this is specializing in one area and giving up on everything else.

You can't be the best at everything forever. You can't even be the best at one thing forever.

CDub07 12-12-2019 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imouto (Post 28235040)
It isn't AMD they can't compete with, it is TSMC and Samsung. TSMC has 5 nm on track for 1H next year and Samsung can dump memory into the market like there is no tomorrow.

When you are as big as Intel and with such a big portfolio you leave a lot of fronts open and they don't have the ability to turn around because that would leave something else exposed. There are a lot of companies looking to snag some market from Intel like Qualcomm or Apple. TSMC, Samsung and AMD were just the first ones to realize the emperor is naked. The only way they can survive this is specializing in one area and giving up on everything else.

You can't be the best at everything forever. You can't even be the best at one thing forever.

Well said!!!! To me that is the one of the biggest downfalls I don't understand about the stock market. Unless you have your head on a swivel someone hungrier is always around the corner is waiting for there chance to become king of the monuntain. The bubble of extreme profits one day will pop. I guess make as much money as you can and get out ahead or fall like a giant or always stay innovating to stay relevant.

KyadCK 12-12-2019 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UltraMega (Post 28234916)
Obviously.

My point is that unless you need longer laptop battery life, nothing about CPU advancements in the last decade really affect most people since most people only do simple tasks.

That's when you make it smaller (IE less material, cheaper), use less power so it puts off less heat so you can advertise being Eco friendly and/or silent, as well as give it a longer warranty, and then charge more for being "better".

You aren't being creative enough.

It isn't just that laptops now last 3x longer than they did back then; Look at the form factors and weight, or TVs that can have them built in and still be sleak, look at AIO PCs from then and now. There are Thin Clients where it's an AIO that can be entirely powered by PoE, even the 1080p monitor!

skupples 12-12-2019 05:39 PM

can confirm, we provide the general population with i3 16gb 512gb touch screen HP 360s. Only the execs and top managers get better equipment(i7s), and that's only because they tend to want 10 keys and bigger screens.

hell, most of the devs are on ancient i5 lenovo laptops.

rluker5 12-13-2019 06:42 AM

Those low powered dual cores are surprisingly adequate for most common uses. Even the core m series all the way back to Broadwell. (at least the full 6w versions)
If you aren't gaming or doing some niche, high powered compute, why would you replace something that works well? The igpus have been more than adequate for non gaming for quite some time as well.

From a measure of click to completion of most common tasks, performance has been stagnant for quite a while and as the market saturates sales should stagnate as well.
For example, I picked up this thing: https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/20063399
for $145 off of ebay. It's a fanless tablet from 2015.

Intel has to come up with more than just a slightly faster cpu for the plebs asking "so how will this new model be better for me?" For them upgrading a cpu is a lot like upgrading their ssd.

umeng2002 12-13-2019 07:38 AM

Which reminds me, where the hell are all the Ryzen laptops?

I was fixing my brothers laptop that has an i5-7200u and thought it was laughably slow... but then I took out the 5400 rpm HDD and put in an SSD, and it's like night and day. Intel and AMD should band together and force laptop makers to stop using HDD as boot devices.

But the arrogance of Intel is legendary... as soon as they don't have the best CPUs anymore, they act like the CPU market is too small for them... meanwhile they get "security analysts" and Ryan Shrout to do hit pieces on AMD.

Imouto 12-13-2019 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by umeng2002 (Post 28236016)
I was fixing my brothers laptop that has an i5-7200u and thought it was laughably slow... but then I took out the 5400 rpm HDD and put in an SSD, and it's like night and day. Intel and AMD should band together and force laptop makers to stop using HDD as boot devices.

It is because of Windows. I did the same this week on a relative's laptop and it was night and day but I still remember it performing alright when I bought it for them. First I tried doing a fresh install but it was barely any faster and only a fresh install on the SSD fixed it. Out of curiosity installed Manjaro on the 5400 rpm drive and it was pretty decent.

Hell, when I was moving their stuff out the old HDD on a Manjaro live USB it was faster than Windows on the 5400 rpm HDD.

skupples 12-13-2019 09:59 AM

Only low end mobility comes with a spinny disk these days, including cheap high capacity options. 99% of our HP stuff comes with m.2, nvme, or SATA SSD.

bluechris 12-13-2019 10:39 AM

I don't think AMD will grow so fast in server area and in specific in virtualized environments since this is the biggest market share atm and constantly grows.
The reason is that no matter the size of the company you have invested a ton of money and you have Intel stuff. Because of this if you suddenly throw in the server room amd servers you loose automations like vmotion, HA etc. Its to much money for companies to replace everything with amd hardware. It needs as i see it 2-3 years at least for AMD to make a solid base.

Offcourse there are monster companies like Google or AWS that have custom virtualized software but they need time also but not so much.

I see a huge grow in desktop, laptop and workstations and slowly rise in the server area. If Intel doesn't do something big in the next 2 years then im afraid the ship will sail.


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