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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hello everyone,
I need a little advice to choose which heatsink to install on each of my three PCs:
PC1: I7 [email protected] Ghz, 32 gb of Gskill Ripjaws 4 2666 (4x8Gb), MSI X99A Xpower AC. Right now I'm using a Corsair H110 (with 4 Akasa Viper fans in Push / pull) but I would like to eliminate the AIO heatsink to go back to one air (I think it's more reliable)
PC2: I7 [email protected] Ghz, 32 Gb of Crucial Ballistix Elite 3466 (4x8Gb), Gigabyte Z270X Gaming 7. Right now I'm using a Cryorig R1 with the central stock fan and the second fan replaced with a TY-147 (it's quieter but not as much as I'd like!)
PC3: I7 2600k stock, 32 GB ogf Gskill ram, gigabyte P67 UD4-B3. Used as a personal server with low power consumption and maximum silence. Until today I'd using a Macho Rev.A that I sold to a friend a couple of days ago.

Heatsinks available:
1 - Cryorig R1 ultimate with 2 or 3 25mm fans (also available 2 Cryorig slim fans for better compatibility)
2 - Thermalright Le Grand Macho RT (should arrive in a couple of days) should be very quiet and performing
3 - Raijintek Tisis / Nemesis (still closed in its box ...) but has a little stock fan so I thought to replace them with two Thermalright TY-147
4 - BeQuiet! Dark rock Pro 3 - really very silent. very quiet but definitely not performing like the others

I was thinking of installing the Raijintek with two TY-147 fans on the PC with the 6850k and the LMRT on the 7700k while the Dark Rock Pro 3 would be perfect on the PC3. What do you think?

What is in your opinion the best combination of the PC listed above and the heatsinks / fans I have available? I have some doubts about 6850k because passing from liquid to air I would not want to lose many performances.

Thank you all for helping!
 

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What is the height of RAM in each of your systems? I could look it up but would rather you did it. ;)

Of the 4 coolers the Le Grand Macho RT is the best followed closely by R1 and Dark Rock Pro 3 .. Tisis / Nemesis is not as good.

Le Grand Macho RT will clear all RAM in front of cooler, but has limited clearance in back of CPU / under cooler.

Same applies to R1 Universal, but Cryorig fans are not as quiet as Thermalright and be quiet!

Dark Rock Pro 3 is has limited RAM clearance both front and back of CPU.

All will cool within a couple degrees of each other.
 

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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Thanks Doyll, your post are Always complete and accurate!



Here the Memory modules height:



PC1: Gskill Ripjaws 4; H=40mm



PC2: Crucial Ballistix Elite; H=40,75mm



PC3: Gskill RipjawsZ 3; H=40mm



P.s: I'm confident about Tisis's performance increase because the stock fans are really bad (very low rpm, low cfm and low pressure....the worst of the worst!) :D

I absolutely have to do some tests to clarify these doubts since looking online seems linke no one has done similar test on Tisis



Inviato da mTalk
 

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That's fairly tall RAM, but not extreme.

R1 Ultimate has 38mm top of CPU to bottom of fins .. that is 43mm RAM clearance. Problem with be case may not have enough CPU clearance.

Case CPU clearance plus 5mm equals total room for fan and RAM.
RAM height plus fan size must be equal to or less than CPU clearance plus 5mm.

This link is to image showing how to determine clearances. http://www.overclock.net/forum/23232751-post29.html
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Finally i received and installed the LGMRT on PC2 (i7 7700k) and is runnig very well wit performance on pair with R1 Ultimate but lower noise :)

I also tested the Raijintek Tisis/Nemesis and damn it's simply excellent!! Please see attached images.
Test system: Cpu I7 7700K @ 4800mhz, mainboard Asus Maximus VIII Gene
As you can see in my test system the two heatsinks have substantially the same performance/temp.

I'd like to test some low noise fan with better airflow (maximum rpm: 1200/1600 - in normal usage i'll never go over 1200 / 35 dBA). What do you suggest? TR TY147 for sure but there are also other good altenatives? Noiseblocker eLoop B14-3, Ek Vardar .........
 

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Finally i received and installed the LGMRT on PC2 (i7 7700k) and is runnig very well wit performance on pair with R1 Ultimate but lower noise :)

I also tested the Raijintek Tisis/Nemesis and damn it's simply excellent!! Please see attached images.
Test system: Cpu I7 7700K @ 4800mhz, mainboard Asus Maximus VIII Gene
As you can see in my test system the two heatsinks have substantially the same performance/temp.

I'd like to test some low noise fan with better airflow (maximum rpm: 1200/1600 - in normal usage i'll never go over 1200 / 35 dBA). What do you suggest? TR TY147 for sure but there are also other good altenatives? Noiseblocker eLoop B14-3, Ek Vardar .........
Was that with fans at full speed? Would be interesting to see results with fans at maybe 700rpm, 1000rpm and 1300rpm. That would give a general idea of temps and noise at different speeds. Do you have a sound meter?

So you found Le Grand Macho to perform about the same but quieter. Which is to be expected. :thumb:

I don't know of a better or lower noise fans wiht 105mm mount spacing than TY-147A or B. TY-143 is same noise, CFM and mm H2O at same speeds as TY-147A or B.

Other 140mm rounded housing with 105mm mounting hole spacing:
Noctua NF-A15 is almost same at same speeds.
Reeven Coldwing
Silverstone FHP141 & FHP141-VF are 38mm thick
SilentiumPC Sigma Pro and Sigma Pro PWM are copies of TY-14x​
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I've done all tests with fans at 100%. Tisis have two fans one PWM with max speed 1000 rpm and the second is not PWM but can reach 1250 rpm.
Would you like a test with all the fans at the same speed 700/1000/max speed? I can try :)
I've not a sound meter in my hands but i can borrow it from a friend.
About alternative fans: the Ek Vardar seem the best fan (better than the TY-143) if you consider the noise/airflow rate: https://imgur.com/74hZlx4; the biggest advantage is the better airflow at similar noise (but different rpm), TY147 and 143 have the same performance at the same rpm.
observing a standard square fan it does not seem very difficult to add 4 fixing holes suitable to the heatsink brackets (i'll also cut the 4 corners).
What do you think about these theories?
 

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I've done all tests with fans at 100%. Tisis have two fans one PWM with max speed 1000 rpm and the second is not PWM but can reach 1250 rpm.
Would you like a test with all the fans at the same speed 700/1000/max speed? I can try :)
I've not a sound meter in my hands but i can borrow it from a friend.
About alternative fans: the Ek Vardar seem the best fan (better than the TY-143) if you consider the noise/airflow rate: https://imgur.com/74hZlx4; the biggest advantage is the better airflow at similar noise (but different rpm), TY147 and 143 have the same performance at the same rpm.
observing a standard square fan it does not seem very difficult to add 4 fixing holes suitable to the heatsink brackets (i'll also cut the 4 corners).
What do you think about these theories?
I thought Tisis came with 2 of the same fan. I'm surprised you find Vardar better on coolers than TY-14x fans. VSG and I (and others) found them to have same performance to noise .. less noise at same rpm and less airflow at same rpm, but same airflow at same noise level.

Here is Thermalbench (VSG) reveiw of TY-143 SQ http://thermalbench.com/2016/08/19/thermalright-ty-143-sq-140-mm-fan/3/

TY-147A SQ
http://thermalbench.com/2016/08/11/thermalright-ty-147a-sq-140-mm-fan/3/

TY-147A
http://thermalbench.com/2015/10/31/thermalright-ty-147a-140mm-fan/3/

I use both sound meter and my ears because some fans with lower DB(A) SPL (sound pressure level) sound louder/worse than some higher DB(A) ones TY-140, 147, 147A, 147B, 143, 147A SQ and 143SQ sound better to my ears compared to most others at same or slightly higher DB.

Yeah, if it's not too much work, having results of coolers with fans at specific speed / dB(A) levels gives us a much more rounded view of coolers' performance. Some coolers peform better/worse at lower rpm, even with same fans as others use. Le Grand Macho and other Macho coolers out-perform most others at lower fan speed / lower airflow speeds. The original Silver Arrow was like that .. I think .. been a long time sense I used one of them. :eek:
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I explain my theory in the attached image (saved from thermalbench review of the TY-143SQ fan). As you can see my (our?) needs is "better airflow with minor noise" so observing the graph at mid/low dBA for example at 30 and 35dBA:

30dBA: TY-143SQ--> 130 FPM and Vardar F3-140ER-->155FPM
35dBA: TY-143SQ--> 230 FPM and Vardar F3-140ER-->250FPM

So, at 30dBA the Vardar fan has a 20% better air flow and at 35dBA the advantage is minor, and about 9,5 - 10% better than Ty-143.
The biggest difference of the Vardar could be the noise generated from the motor and the bearing, but both fans in question have a double ball bearing, so the noise *may be* similar.
Now if you switch to che second graph you can see that:

30dBA: TY-143SQ--> 130 [email protected] and Vardar F3-140ER-->[email protected]
35dBA: TY-143SQ--> 230 [email protected] and Vardar F3-140ER-->[email protected]

The determining factor is: does the engine and bearing noise of the Vardar look similar to / lower than the TY-143 or is it harder to bear? In the past I had fans that had a noise not very high but ... unbearable!
Here in Italy, however, the fans with the best price performance seems to be the TY-143 (about 15/16 € + shipping) while the Vardar EVO 140ER cost about 20 € + shipping ............ so I probably spent a lot of words for nothing :D I'll probably be on the safe side with a pair of TY-143.

P.S.: i also considered the be quiet! Silent Wings 3 140 mm High-Speed but seem to have problems with some pwm controllers.

"SilentiumPC Sigma Pro and Sigma Pro PWM are copies of TY-14x"
These fans seem really very interesting considering the very low cost but I have not found any review with instrumental tests to evaluate the real performance :-\

For the PC1 (on which I'll install the Tisis) now I have to evaluate how to revolutionize the aeration of the case (Corsair 400C - see attached photo that currently mounts Akasa Viper, for aesthetic reasons, but the two video cards in sli and overclocked to handle the 4K need a much improved air recirculation (before with the 2k monitor they heated very little).
On the front I can install 2 fans 140mm or 3 120mm, I have to check what may be the best solution to maximize the air intake. The attached photo represent the best fan config atm: rear and upper exhaust and 2 front intake through H110 and PCI closures removed.
As usual the rear fan will be removed and the PCI slot closures removed.
 

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Q

I explain my theory in the attached image (saved from thermalbench review of the TY-143SQ fan). As you can see my (our?) needs is "better airflow with minor noise" so observing the graph at mid/low dBA for example at 30 and 35dBA:

30dBA: TY-143SQ--> 130 FPM and Vardar F3-140ER-->155FPM
35dBA: TY-143SQ--> 230 FPM and Vardar F3-140ER-->250FPM

So, at 30dBA the Vardar fan has a 20% better air flow and at 35dBA the advantage is minor, and about 9,5 - 10% better than Ty-143.
The biggest difference of the Vardar could be the noise generated from the motor and the bearing, but both fans in question have a double ball bearing, so the noise *may be* similar.
Now if you switch to che second graph you can see that:

30dBA: TY-143SQ--> 130 [email protected] and Vardar F3-140ER-->[email protected]
35dBA: TY-143SQ--> 230 [email protected] and Vardar F3-140ER-->[email protected]
Before I get into how little the difference in airflow is at 30dB I want to point out that these 30 dB readings were measure 6" from the fan. That converts to 14.44 dB at 3 feet. The reason for measuring at 6" is because the fan noise level is too low to be measured at greater distance. After all 14.44dB is less than half of the 30dB noise level in a very quiet room in at about 3AM. We have to go up to 45db @ 6" to reach 29.44dB @ 3 feet (about the same noise level as a very quiet room late at night).

Your first graph is only of fan speed to fan noise with TY-143 SQ being much quieter at same rpm. In fact to make as much noise as others it has to be running almost 300rpm faster then they are. :D

I get basically the same numbers you do using VSG's Thermalbench graph of fan noise level to linear airflow. All of the fans in graph are piled on top of each other so it very hard to interpolate data, but a quick scaling at 30dB I get a maximum difference of about 27.6FPM difference from lowest to highest FPM @ 14.4dB at 1 yard distance in below graph. We have to go up to 45db @ 6" to reach 29.44dB @ 3 feet (about the same noise level as a very quiet room late at night). At this sound pressure level the difference between all fans in that graph is only about 13 FPM maximum and TY-143 SQ if not the best is right there with the best.
Attached image below.


The determining factor is: does the engine and bearing noise of the Vardar look similar to / lower than the TY-143 or is it harder to bear? In the past I had fans that had a noise not very high but ... unbearable!
Here in Italy, however, the fans with the best price performance seems to be the TY-143 (about 15/16 € + shipping) while the Vardar EVO 140ER cost about 20 € + shipping ............ so I probably spent a lot of words for nothing :D I'll probably be on the safe side with a pair of TY-143.

P.S.: i also considered the be quiet! Silent Wings 3 140 mm High-Speed but seem to have problems with some pwm controllers.
The only PWM control problem I can verify is on aquaero 5 and aquaero 6 PWM controllers. I started a started a thread asking anyone with Silent Wings 3 PWM fans if they have any problems controlling them.
http://www.overclock.net/forum/246-air-cooling/1692337-quiet-silent-wing-3-pwm-control-issues.html

"SilentiumPC Sigma Pro and Sigma Pro PWM are copies of TY-14x"
These fans seem really very interesting considering the very low cost but I have not found any review with instrumental tests to evaluate the real performance :-\
Being that they are definitely copying Thermalright and others .. even their coolers look like Thermalright, I am hesitant to buy any of their products.

For the PC1 (on which I'll install the Tisis) now I have to evaluate how to revolutionize the aeration of the case (Corsair 400C - see attached photo that currently mounts Akasa Viper, for aesthetic reasons, but the two video cards in sli and overclocked to handle the 4K need a much improved air recirculation (before with the 2k monitor they heated very little).
On the front I can install 2 fans 140mm or 3 120mm, I have to check what may be the best solution to maximize the air intake. The attached photo represent the best fan config atm: rear and upper exhaust and 2 front intake through H110 and PCI closures removed.
As usual the rear fan will be removed and the PCI slot closures removed.
Monitor your airflow temp into cooler as you setup your case airflow. That way you will be able to see how cool / hot the air going into cooler is during a stress test and hopefully have better ideas of how to get that airflow temp down. Monitor cooler intake air temp and record it at same time you record CPU temp to get an accurate CPU delta temp. Well, as accurate as airflow air density & humidity are as cooler intake air temp varies from room air temp. If airflow temp into cooler varies by more than 5c I won't test .. but my room and test station never vary more than +/- 1.5c (21-23c) and not more than +/-0.5c during a test, same for air temp going into cooler being tested. If temp changes more than 1c during a test I run it again, but system is setup to be that accurate. You probably won't be able to get your case to flow air that well. My case systems will vary 2-3c from 0c difference to as much as 3c warmer during stress tests with CPU and GPU both running at full load. ;)
 

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