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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
How much of a difference am I likely to see on a 9900K system at 4K?
 

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at 4k, the priority is like GPU > CPU > RAM size (not speed)

Check this
 
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At 4k you will see close to zero difference.
At 1080P, when pushing over 100-150FPS, then you'll see some difference, but at that point, you'll likely be limited by the CPU with a highend GPU.
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
at 4k, the priority is like GPU > CPU > RAM size (not speed)

Check this
So, would going up to 64GB help?

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Would either of the following be compatible with a 9900K + Maximus XI Formula system?

1. 32GB G.Skill DDR4 TridentZ RGB 4400Mhz PC4-35200 CL17 1.50V Dual Channel Kit (2x16GB)

2. https://www.overclockers.co.uk/cruc...00c19-4400mhz-dual-channel-kit-my-20l-cr.html

Is the CL17 kit outright better than the CL19 kit? And would I have a better chance of getting a stable overclock to 4400MHz via XMP with the CL17 kit vs the CL19 kit?

Thank you.
 

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There is a difference between speeds but it's mostly in load time, not fps. A fast kit will load games a few seconds faster than a slow kit. As far as 64gb goes if you can get b-dies do it, but the prices are inflated right now for anything over 16gb so it'll cost more but if you can find a kit on sale I say go for it.
 

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So, would going up to 64GB help?

____


Would either of the following be compatible with a 9900K + Maximus XI Formula system?

1. 32GB G.Skill DDR4 TridentZ RGB 4400Mhz PC4-35200 CL17 1.50V Dual Channel Kit (2x16GB)

2. https://www.overclockers.co.uk/cruc...00c19-4400mhz-dual-channel-kit-my-20l-cr.html

Is the CL17 kit outright better than the CL19 kit? And would I have a better chance of getting a stable overclock to 4400MHz via XMP with the CL17 kit vs the CL19 kit?

Thank you.
The IMC on the cpu will likely be the limiting factor here or possibly the mobo or bios version, but again its not the speed you want. its the lower total latency. if a 32GB kit @ 3600 cl15 is cheaper then i would say go for that. But really want you want is Bdie so you can really hammer down those timings to get the best 1% low fps. high speed just gives you more max fps. and at 4k no way are you going to be needing more max fps (not that max fps really matters in the first place tbh) depending on the game but any AAA game at high settings is going to demand way more from your gpu then your gpu will be able to deliver.

32GB is optimal often better than 64GB. That said if your using all 32GB you would then need 64GB. but for gaming 32GB is perfect.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
The IMC on the cpu will likely be the limiting factor here or possibly the mobo or bios version, but again its not the speed you want. its the lower total latency. if a 32GB kit @ 3600 cl15 is cheaper then i would say go for that. But really want you want is Bdie so you can really hammer down those timings to get the best 1% low fps. high speed just gives you more max fps. and at 4k no way are you going to be needing more max fps (not that max fps really matters in the first place tbh) depending on the game but any AAA game at high settings is going to demand way more from your gpu then your gpu will be able to deliver.

32GB is optimal often better than 64GB. That said if your using all 32GB you would then need 64GB. but for gaming 32GB is perfect.
1. How do I calculate total latency?
2. What is b die and how do I identify if a kit is b die or not?
3. What exactly matters when trying to maximise the 1% low FPS, especially when it comes to RAM?
 

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So, would going up to 64GB help?

____


Would either of the following be compatible with a 9900K + Maximus XI Formula system?

1. 32GB G.Skill DDR4 TridentZ RGB 4400Mhz PC4-35200 CL17 1.50V Dual Channel Kit (2x16GB)

2. https://www.overclockers.co.uk/cruc...00c19-4400mhz-dual-channel-kit-my-20l-cr.html

Is the CL17 kit outright better than the CL19 kit? And would I have a better chance of getting a stable overclock to 4400MHz via XMP with the CL17 kit vs the CL19 kit?

Thank you.
Lower latency is always better on ram. I'd say 16gb is optimal and 32gb is ideal right now. With 4 sticks, its harder to overclock. if its like 2x8gb cl16-17 vs 2x16/4x8gb cl19-cl22, first one is better. You don't need 4400 btw.
 
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1. How do I calculate total latency?
2. What is b die and how do I identify if a kit is b die or not?
3. What exactly matters when trying to maximise the 1% low FPS, especially when it comes to RAM?
1. You can't, as latency is affected by too many variables to give a good estimate.
2. B-die is a specific memory IC made by Samsung that overclocks really well. You can find B-die by looking for 3200+ MHz kits where the tRCD and tRP timing is equal to or +1 from tCL. Like 14-14-14, 14-15-15, 15-15-15, (for 3600 MHz and up) 14-16-16, 15-16-16, 16-16-16, (for 4000 MHz and up) 17-17-17, 17-18-18, and so on. For 9900K you will want a 2x8GB kit, or possibly 4x 8GB if you're on a Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Master
3. For memory timings basically every timing will have an impact. If I were to point out a select few, it would probably be tRFC, tREFI, tWR, tRTP, and tRDRD_sg
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Lower latency is always better on ram. I'd say 16gb is optimal and 32gb is ideal right now. With 4 sticks, its harder to overclock. if its like 2x8gb cl16-17 vs 2x16/4x8gb cl19-cl22, first one is better. You don't need 4400 btw.
I’ve been looking only at 2x16 kits, so that’s good.

I was looking at 4400 as that is the maximum my motherboard will allow. If I don’t need 4400, which kit should I get that will give me the best performance?

What is THE ideal 2x16GB DDR4 kit out there right now?

1. You can't, as latency is affected by too many variables to give a good estimate.
2. B-die is a specific memory IC made by Samsung that overclocks really well. You can find B-die by looking for 3200+ MHz kits where the tRCD and tRP timing is equal to or +1 from tCL. Like 14-14-14, 14-15-15, 15-15-15, (for 3600 MHz and up) 14-16-16, 15-16-16, 16-16-16, (for 4000 MHz and up) 17-17-17, 17-18-18, and so on. For 9900K you will want a 2x8GB kit, or possibly 4x 8GB if you're on a Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Master
3. For memory timings basically every timing will have an impact. If I were to point out a select few, it would probably be tRFC, tREFI, tWR, tRTP, and tRDRD_sg
By that formula, both the kits I linked above, Gskill and Crucial, should be Samsung b-die, right? Meaning I should be fine with either? Or are there other options I should consider?

I’m on an ASUS Maximus XI Formula and I want 32GB at the least. Given that there are too many variables, which 32GB kit is the highest performing memory right now for my system?

Thank you.
 

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I’m on an ASUS Maximus XI Formula and I want 32GB at the least. Given that there are too many variables, which 32GB kit is the highest performing memory right now for my system?
if you're overclocking, B-Die.

if you're not overclocking, still probably B-Die.

look at your QVL if you have no idea what to buy.

2513574
 

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CPU and ram will make no difference in 4K on any GPU heavy titles. You could have an i3 and games would run the same in 4K. What games are you trying to get better performance in?
 

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But contrary to popular belief, regardless of your request for 4K usage - get the faster RAM. Even if the latency by CL is slightly lower. More Mhz = moar bandwidth = better in long run/a few circumstances.

Best choice between the two is the third option not listed: Get the faster Mhz with tightest CL possible! See this link.
 
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Resolution doesn't matter, CPU bound games will have the same behavior regardless of the resolution. What matters is your framerate target and type of games you play. If you are playing variety of games including some MMOs and generally older thread limited games then you need every single MHz you can muster, especially if you aim above 60 FPS, but if you just play modern AAA games then you will be GPU bound 100% of the time.

Just get the best kit you can for the amount of money you are willing to spend and do some 3800-4000 with tuned timings and subtimings. Decent kits like Viper Steel 4400 are very versatile and cheap, no point in cheaping out with 3200.
 

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You're going to have a hard time hitting 4400 on a 2x16 dual rank kit or 4x8 kit on z390 in my experience they tend to top out at like 4000-4133. I'd probably aim for 4000 and tighten down the timings like cl16 or so, g.skill has a bunch of 4000 kits with tight timings if you want to go xmp vs manual like this one
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Let’s see if I can start to get a grasp of the situation.

So, am I correct in assuming that

Lower CAS Latency rating = better minimum FPS
Higher RAM frequency = better maximum FPS

If so, and assuming the priority for me at 4K is increasing minimum FPS, would it imply that 3800 MHz CL14 is better than 4400MHz CL17 for increasing minimum FPS?

Also, does the frequency divided by latency formula actually work? Should that be a determinant in how I select a kit?

Also, even if I can’t hit 4400, wouldn’t a 4400 C17 kit provide tighter timings at say 4000 than a 4000 C16 kit?

Last but not least, and I should probably have started with this question - is there an outright “best” 32GB RAM kit for maximising minimum FPS at 4K on a 9900K + Maximus XI Formula?

Thank you to all of you for bearing with me. Your patience and guidance is really appreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I’ve found the following two options to be the better of the bunch based on speed to latency ratio. It’s basically 4400 C17 vs 4000 C14. Please recommend which would be better for my use case scenario.

1.https://www.memoryc.co.uk/35277-32gb-g-skill-ddr4-tridentz-rgb-4400mhz-pc4-35200-cl17-1-50v-dual-channel-kit-2x16gb.html

2.https://www.memoryc.co.uk/35347-32gb-g-skill-ddr4-pc4-32000-4000mhz-ripjaws-v-for-intel-z170-x99-cl14-dual-channel-kit-2x16gb-1-55v.html

Thank you.
 

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you can't figure out latency by dividing two numbers together... read @Arni90 's post again.

Lower CAS Latency rating = better minimum FPS
Higher RAM frequency = better maximum FPS
no, both achieve the same thing. latency drops with speed and it'll drop with better timings. throughput increases with speed and it'll increase with better timings. both are important.

you're not going to notice a difference between either kit if you're just gaming, but I'd get the 4400 kit. 1.55v default voltage on the 4000 doesn't leave you much wiggle room if you're going to be OCing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
you can't figure out latency by dividing two numbers together... read @Arni90 's post again.



no, both achieve the same thing. latency drops with speed and it'll drop with better timings. throughput increases with speed and it'll increase with better timings. both are important.

you're not going to notice a difference between either kit if you're just gaming, but I'd get the 4400 kit. 1.55v default voltage on the 4000 doesn't leave you much wiggle room if you're going to be OCing.
I’m a bit confused. On one hand, we’re considering the possibility that 4400 via XMP or manual overclocking might not even be possible on my system. On the other, you’re recommending a 4400 kit over a 4000 kit based on the argument of higher overclocking potential beyond 4400.

Where is the equilibrium in the discrepancy? What am I missing?

Also, if my system can’t handle 4400 via XMP, what is the next logical step? Manual overclocking to achieve 4400, or dropping the speed to something like 4000?

If it is the latter, would I get better CL than 17 at 4000, since it is rated for C17 at 4400 and thus 4000 should have a lower CL?

Thank you.
 

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overclocking RAM isn't only specifically talking about the frequency. I guess we could use a special word for it, lol. I meant the the 4400 kit will likely do 4000 14-15-15 at the same or lower voltage, so that makes it the better overclocking kit even if you're not going to be running >4000. (just speculation though, you might get a **** kit and it might not).

My RAM is 4266 XMP and I'm at 4200 but I'm running better timings than XMP and my performance is better. It's technically underclocked but nobody really would call it that.

If it is the latter, would I get better CL than 17 at 4000, since it is rated for C17 at 4400 and thus 4000 should have a lower CL?
that's the idea.

my RAM is 4266 17-18-18 and I can do 15-16-16 at 4400 and I get better performance, so that's what I run.

my kit (F4-4266C17D-32GVKB) is what didn't make the bin for the 4400 kit you linked. same timings and voltage but 4266 vs 4400. maybe look into that if it's significantly cheaper.
 
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