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Meep
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Once the asphalt was treated, the authors could add lithium to it simply by electroplating it. It formed an even coating on the surface. With that, the material was ready to be used as an electrode.
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The results were rather impressive. When all of the electrode materials were considered, the battery's energy density was nearly 950 Watt-hours per kilogram. For comparison, the batteries in a Tesla are in the neighborhood of 250 Whr/kg.
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As always, there's no way to know at this point whether this tech can be commercialized. But this one has a major advantage in that gilsonite is cheap enough that we can afford to pave roads with it.
More at the Source

Pretty impressive stuff, I really hope the treatment process can be scaled up for mass production, nearly 4x the energy density of current batteries might be the breakthrough that electric vehicles need to really become practical for most people.
 

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Four times the Wh/kg of current batteries; that can't be cheap to mass produce, which in turn will raise the cost of any vehicle these are used in. EV's with six digit price tags...yikes.

Doing a one off in a lab setting is a different story; you have a huge budget to work with.
 

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The stupid thing to begin with is thinking that the battery tech won't massively improve once there is enough demand. I'm not saying this is the final solution or anything but proves that researchers are doing their part.

I said it before but some people are going to have constant mental meltdowns as EV news tick in. Be well folks.
 

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I'm all for a cheap solution to acquiring denser batteries. No reason by this point for us to have batteries that aren't capable of lasting a few days at least without any worry whatsoever. The issue I see is, does this affect the durability of the battery? As in, does it still maintain that same maximum charge, or does it degrade any faster?

If not, that's awesome. ^_^
 

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Originally Posted by Imglidinhere View Post

I'm all for a cheap solution to acquiring denser batteries. No reason by this point for us to have batteries that aren't capable of lasting a few days at least without any worry whatsoever. The issue I see is, does this affect the durability of the battery? As in, does it still maintain that same maximum charge, or does it degrade any faster?

If not, that's awesome. ^_^
Where degradation is concerned: dendrites do not form in the presence of asphalt/graphene-derived carbon, so there's that.

At present, graphene prices are quite high.
 

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Originally Posted by CynicalUnicorn View Post

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Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

Doing a one off in a lab setting is a different story; you have a huge budget to work with.
In this thread we pretend we know how research works.
To be fair, considering the push EV's are getting, it could be true. Though I know what you mean about research in general.
 

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asphalt can melt in very hot weather when under a very hot engine hood... I have seen asphalt even get "squishy" on 115 degree faren days... so if its squishy when a car wreck occurs, enjoy the melting face splatter?
 

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Meep
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Discussion Starter #10
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Originally Posted by Imglidinhere View Post

The issue I see is, does this affect the durability of the battery? As in, does it still maintain that same maximum charge, or does it degrade any faster?

If not, that's awesome. ^_^
Hard to say at this point, They concluded that with graphene ribbons in the mixture there is no lithium build up, which is usually the failure point (A spike in one place can cause an internal short). And from initial testing it seems to hold charge fairly well.
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Originally Posted by caenlen View Post

asphalt can melt in very hot weather when under a very hot engine hood... I have seen asphalt even get "squishy" on 115 degree faren days... so if its squishy when a car wreck occurs, enjoy the melting face splatter?
Well, its not quite the same stuff as you find on the road, the final product isn't liquid at all. Its a super porous sponge like material (3000m²/gram !) that gets plated in lithium metal. It gets explained in more detail in the source if you have time to read it.
 

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Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

If it can't be mass produced cheaply enough for the public to use, what's the point?
It might eventually be cheap enough to mass produce. Either way, there are probably niche uses where this is viable despite the high cost.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

Four times the Wh/kg of current batteries; that can't be cheap to mass produce, which in turn will raise the cost of any vehicle these are used in. EV's with six digit price tags...yikes.

Doing a one off in a lab setting is a different story; you have a huge budget to work with.
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Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

If it can't be mass produced cheaply enough for the public to use, what's the point?
Ten years ago a 3D printer could cost anywhere from $20k to $100k. Nowadays you can purchase 3D printers that can produce better quality prints for less than $1k. What's your point? That you don't understand how economies of scale works? That you can't comprehend that nearly every new technology starts off as one-off productions in a lab setting which drastically increases cost-per-unit because there are no established supply and manufacturing lines for experimental technologies?

Why is it that you've posted the most in this thread, yet you seem to know the least about the mechanisms involved in the topic?
 

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Originally Posted by Owari View Post

Ten years ago a 3D printer could cost anywhere from $20k to $100k. Nowadays you can purchase 3D printers that can produce better quality prints for less than $1k. What's your point? That you don't understand how economies of scale works? That you can't comprehend that nearly every new technology starts off as one-off productions in a lab setting which drastically increases cost-per-unit because there are no established supply and manufacturing lines for experimental technologies?

Why is it that you've posted the most in this thread, yet you seem to know the least about the mechanisms involved in the topic?
The reported coulombic efficiency of these batteries is very poor at 96%. Well above 99% is needed for a long lasting battery.

The recent announcement by Toshiba of a new SCiB battery, using niobium, is more promising and a lot closer to production. Still, not likely to be of use in cars anytime soon (cost being the main factor).
 

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I always find myself questioning this claim that proponents make that battery technology is in its infancy and will explode in the coming years. I guess people haven't been using batteries for all sorts of things for 100s of years already or anything. Looks like a mature technology to me. The desperation for next years technology to save EV's is palpable.
 

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Originally Posted by SpankyMcFlych View Post

I always find myself questioning this claim that proponents make that battery technology is in its infancy and will explode in the coming years. I guess people haven't been using batteries for all sorts of things for 100s of years already or anything. Looks like a mature technology to me. The desperation for next years technology to save EV's is palpable.
There's also a hilarious irony here: asphalt/graphene is a petroleum product.
 

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Meep
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Discussion Starter #17
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Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

There's also a hilarious irony here: asphalt/graphene is a petroleum product.
Cute, only they're using Gilsonite which is't petroleum based, but naturally occurring. Could you please stop spamming the thread now, its not like you're adding anything useful to the conversation.
 

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Because it never was really needed. It was easier to add a little gas generator to whatever you wanted to run with electricity.

Now you have EVs and renewable energy asking for this kind of energy storage. It isn't that hard to understand. In the same fashion that every other technology has evolved, based on its economics. If there is demand it will evolve.

Lastly, you can get graphene from any substance rich in carbon. For example, sugar (beet, sugar cane, etc).
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilles3000 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

There's also a hilarious irony here: asphalt/graphene is a petroleum product.
Cute, only they're using Gilsonite which is't petroleum based, but naturally occurring. Could you please stop spamming the thread now, its not like you're adding anything useful to the conversation.
Actually, Gilsonite is a naturally occurring hydrocarbon, same as petroleum. The only difference is it is solid rather than a liquid.
 

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Originally Posted by Gilles3000 View Post

Cute, only they're using Gilsonite which is't petroleum based, but naturally occurring. Could you please stop spamming the thread now, its not like you're adding anything useful to the conversation.
Graphene oxide into petroleum pitch.
 
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