[ghostrider85]

it doesn't make any sense.

1. multiverse is infinite, and multiverse existed waaaay even before booker had to choose if he want to do the baptism or not, there are multiple versions of him already as soon as he was born. my point is that the multiverse didn't just started when booker went through the baptism. there are millions of booker who went through this baptism (the branching off), how is that killing one booker in one universe will erase all the comstock in the entire multiverse?

2. our booker dewitt already went through the baptism, how is that killing the booker dewitt that already went through the "branching off" will gonna affect comstock? have you seen the terminator movie? the machines have to kill sarah while john isn't born yet, killing sarah after john was born won't do crap.

 

[caenlen]

it was an eff'd up story to begin with let it go lol

i thought it was overrated game personally, i only paid $13 for it thank God. game informer gave it a 10/10 which is rare for them, only reason i jumped on it.

i beat it and yeah it was an ok game, thought it was meh tho overall. hype is hype.

 

[Marin]

The creation of Comstock was due to the baptism. It doesn't eliminate the multiverses in entirety, it just eliminates Comstock (and of course everything that branches off of that point). And Dewitt wasn't baptized otherwise he would have become Comstock which is why Comstock went into that world to take Anna.

 

[salamachaa]

Elizabeth has the ability to see all realities at once. She can also travel all of these realities. In the end Booker isn't visiting the reality he is literally living that moment with his future concious. Comstock is a branch off of one universe's Booker. Kind of like this:

=========== Booker (Universe alpha)=================
Baptised ======================= Not baptised
Comstock alpha ================== Booker alpha

All further incarnations of comstock or booker are dependent on that universes booker being baptised at that moment of time. There can be infinite other Bookers and infinite evil bookers but none of them would be booker and comstock as you know them. This is the whole point of the There is always a lighthouse etc.. thing. It isn't specifically talking about infinite bookers but rather infinite scenarios that mirror the same ideas of paradise lost (bioshock)

Edit: my formatting got messed up

 

[ghostrider85]

nah, you guys just don't get it, there are millions of me in the multiverse, how is that killing my mom in this universe will get rid of the millions of me in the multiverse? unless of course if you kill all of my moms in the multiverse. but then multiverse is infinite, killing all my moms is impossible.

you kill my mom in this universe then i won't exist in this universe, but we are talking about multiverse, killing my mom here won't affect the other me in the other universe.

 

[Marafice Eye]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghostrider85

nah, you guys just don't get it, there are millions of me in the multiverse, how is that killing my mom in this universe will get rid of the millions of me? unless of corse if you kill all of my moms in the multiverse. but then multiverse is infinite, killing al my moms is impossible.

you kill my mom in this universe then i won't exist in this universe, but we are talking about multiverse, killing my mom here won't affect the other me in the other universe.

Yes, but even in multiverse theory, a universe is created by each decision made right? In that case, there HAS to be a primary INITIAL universe (as mentioned above, an 'Alpha' universe). With no descisions made, how can there even be a multiverse? It had to start somewhere.

To use your example, if we went to the alpha universe and killed your mom, that ends YOU in EVERY multiverse.

 

[ghostrider85]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marin

The creation of Comstock was due to the baptism. It doesn't eliminate the multiverses in entirety, it just eliminates Comstock (and of course everything that branches off of that point). And Dewitt wasn't baptized otherwise he would have become Comstock which is why Comstock went into that world to take Anna.

no, our booker already went through that "baptism day" he just refused it so he remained booker.

 

[ghostrider85]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marafice Eye

Yes, but even in multiverse theory, a universe is created by each decision made right? In that case, there HAS to be a primary INITIAL universe (as mentioned above, an 'Alpha' universe). With no descisions made, how can there even be a multiverse? It had to start somewhere.

To use your example, if we went to the alpha universe and killed your mom, that ends YOU in EVERY multiverse.

exept that there is no alpha universe, not even in theory.

 

[Marafice Eye]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghostrider85

exept that there is no alpha universe, not even in theory.

Then that eliminates any idea of a multiverse. The key element of a multiverse theory for Bioshock Infinite is that a branch is made every time a decision is made, correct? Without an alpha universe where the first ever decision was made, multiverse theory is null and void. Think of it like a tree, you can't just suddenly have a ton of branches, you have to have a trunk, aka the alpha universe.

 

[Marin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghostrider85

no, our booker already went through that "baptism day" he just refused it so he remained booker.

Yeah, which is what I said, and he went back to that point and was killed. Eliminating all possibilities from that point.

 

[salamachaa]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghostrider85

exept that there is no alpha universe, not even in theory.

Not alpha universe as in the beginning universe but rather an arbitrary alpha universe. It was a bad label. I am sorry. Like I said, there are infinite evil bookers and good bookers. However, in order to spawn comstock (this particular evil booker) the booker with that exact backstory must be baptised at the exact time. By stopping that you end all other infinite comstocks. Booker at the end is a booker that never had to make that decision.

 

[ghostrider85]

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamachaa

Not alpha universe as in the beginning universe but rather an arbitrary alpha universe. It was a bad label. I am sorry. Like I said, there are infinite evil bookers and good bookers. However, in order to spawn comstock (this particular evil booker) the booker with that exact backstory must be baptised at the exact time. By stopping that you end all other infinite comstocks. Booker at the end is a booker that never had to make that decision.

but then how can you be so sure that there is only one universe that have a comstock in it? as i already said there are infinite number of universe,

 

[Marafice Eye]

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamachaa

Not alpha universe as in the beginning universe but rather an arbitrary alpha universe. It was a bad label. I am sorry. Like I said, there are infinite evil bookers and good bookers. However, in order to spawn comstock (this particular evil booker) the booker with that exact backstory must be baptised at the exact time. By stopping that you end all other infinite comstocks. Booker at the end is a booker that never had to make that decision.

No I actually think that's the key here, particularly with the 'branching multiverse' theory used in Bioshock Infinite. With the way it's described by/for the game, there simply HAS to be a beginning universe where the first decision was made to start the whole branching process. And by traveling to that universe, anything could theoretically be altered. It's the only thing that makes the game's ending work.

 

[ghostrider85]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marafice Eye

No I actually think that's the key here, particularly with the 'branching multiverse' theory used in Bioshock Infinite

there is no branching multiverse , there is only multiverse. think about it, are you saying that multiverse only existed when booker have to go through the baptism? that is ridiculous, booker already had multiple versions of him as soon as he was born, a poor booker, a rich booker, a booker who died at a young age, a booker who did not went to school, etc. etc.

in an infinite multiverse which have bajillion universes, there is no way that there is only one booker who took that baptism.

 

[salamachaa]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marafice Eye

No I actually think that's the key here, particularly with the 'branching multiverse' theory used in Bioshock Infinite. With the way it's described by/for the game, there simply HAS to be a beginning universe where the first decision was made to start the whole branching process. And by traveling to that universe, anything could theoretically be altered. It's the only thing that makes the game's ending work.

I suppose Alpha universe would be before the big bang and not applicable to the story. I thought my alpha designation to a booker and comstock was being confused for a continuing alpha universe where all other parallel universes branch from. That's why I didn't want to use that terminology.

Yes, there would need to be a point of beginning and a beginning universe.

 

[salamachaa]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghostrider85

there is no branching multiverse thery. think about it, are you saying that multiverse only existed when booker have to go through the baptism? that is ridiculous, booker already had multiple versions of him as soon as he was born, a poor booker, a rich booker, a booker who died at a young age, a booker who did not went to school, etc. etc.

in an infinite multiverse, there is no way that there is only one booker who took that baptism.

There isn't only one booker that took the baptism. The visual in the game was just representative of all bookers that took the baptism being killed by Elizabeth (an anomoly like transuniverse being)

 

[ghostrider85]

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamachaa

I suppose Alpha universe would be before the big bang and not applicable to the story. I thought my alpha designation to a booker and comstock was being confused for a continuing alpha universe where all other parallel universes branch from. That's why I didn't want to use that terminology.

Yes, there would need to be a point of beginning and a beginning universe.

i agree, alpha universe is where everything started and branched off, dewitt can't have his own alpha universe.

 

[Marafice Eye]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghostrider85

there is no branching multiverse , there is only multiverse. think about it, are you saying that multiverse only existed when booker have to go through the baptism? that is ridiculous, booker already had multiple versions of him as soon as he was born, a poor booker, a rich booker, a booker who died at a young age, a booker who did not went to school, etc. etc.

in an infinite multiverse which have bajillion universes, there is no way that there is only one booker who took that baptism.

No, you're clearly not getting what I'm saying. I'm not saying that Booker's decision was the START of the multiverses, not at all. I'm saying that for the multiverse theory used by the game, the one that says ever decision causes a split, there had to be a SINGLE universe until someone/something made the very first decision in the existence of life.

Big bang > a universe > life forms > first 'thing' to ever make a conscious decision . bam, multiverses start.

Get it now?
Quote:

Originally Posted by ghostrider85

i agree, alpha universe is where everything started and branched off, dewitt can't have his own alpha universe.

That alpha universe theoretically continues, but spawns 2 branches, one for each possible choice(and arguably in my opinion there would still be a universe in which no decisions were ever made, sure boring universe, but still sound imo). Booker can easily have his own technical 'alpha' universe as his birth was one of 2 possible outcomes, therefore, his birth would be his 'alpha' and every decision after that would begin their own sets of multiverses

 

[ghostrider85]

Quote:

Originally Posted by salamachaa

There isn't only one booker that took the baptism. The visual in the game was just representative of all bookers that took the baptism being killed by Elizabeth (an anomoly like transuniverse being)

yup, i know that, that's why i am wondering how eliminating one booker will get rid of all the comstocks.

think of it like a tree, the very root is the big bang, there are millions of branches that represents different versions of booker, how is that cutting one branch will eliminate all the other branches?

 

[salamachaa]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghostrider85

i agree, alpha universe is where everything started and branched off, dewitt can't have his own alpha universe.

True. I was only saying alpha as in that particular booker and that particular branch of "evil booker". I understand what you are saying wiith there being other multiverse bookers gettings baptised at that moment and killing just the one off would be a moot point because there would still be other multiverse comstocks with like once less beard hair or something.

That is why I was saying that the cutscene was a artistic representation of Elizabeth(s) simulataneously killing off all baptising bookers. She kind of exists everywhere an nowhere at the same time and can just do that stuff.

If it really helps to understand you can think of it as universe self correction. Elizabeth doesn't make sense in the universe. So by eliminating that outcome across all multiverses Elizabeth no longer exists and the anomoly is corrected.