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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all
I have just built my first Custom Watercooling loop, and I started running it.
I do have some concerns about the coolant temperature though...

Here is the build:
Case : Be Quiet Dark Base 700
MoBo: Asus Crosshair VIII Hero (WiFi)
GPU: Asus EKWB RTX 3080
CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 5900X
CPU WB: Heatkiller IV
Rad1: Hardware Labs Nemesis GTS 360
Rad1 fans: 3 * NOCTUA Chromax NF-F12 PWM
Rad2: Hardware Labs Nemesis GTS 360
Rad 2 fans: 2 * NOCTUA Chromax NF-F12 PWM
Reservoir : Heatkiller Tube 150
Pump: D5 PWM

As for the temps I read:
Ambiant temp: 28°C
Idle CPU: 40°C
Idle GPU: 34°C
Idle Coolant: 37°C

Under load CPU and GPU increase but remain fine, yet coolant increases with them. Yesterday after a 4 hours gaming session It was a little above 50°C (53°C if I remember correctly).
I managed to find a huge air bubble after this gaming session, that I removed.

It gives me the impression that my loop is nicely taking heat away from components, but then has issues putting it into the air.
I tried to remove more air, in case there are some left in Rads, as that huge bubble I removed (half a tube of air...), but I can't seem to bleed some more now.

Do you guys have any opinion on this?
 

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More than likely, you're not getting enough air flow with that coffin of a case. To test this, remove the panels off your case and see if there is a temp difference. With those two radiators and the heat load you have, I would expect the deltaT between the water and ambient temps around 10-15C with ample air flow.

Best thing you can do (besides getting a case that can breath) is run both radiators as intake and all your other fans, if you have any, as exhaust.

Other options:
-Higher fan speeds
-More fans on your radiators (sandwich)
-More radiator
-Remove your case panels.
-If you have a local machine shop, take your case panels to them and have them cut out some 120 or 140mm holes (this is what I did for my case :D)

However, overall your best option is a new case.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks for you answer @StAndrew
I will try with open case, and check for more air bubble trapped in rads

If it is indeed the case, I might switch to a Corsair X570
Any opinion on that one for Air Flow?
It seems to be comparable size, aesthetics, and better air flow

And if some others have other ideas, I'm all ears :p
Indeed when I planned it, I expected it to be more than enough for the rig.
 

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Thanks for you answer @StAndrew
I will try with open case, and check for more air bubble trapped in rads

If it is indeed the case, I might switch to a Corsair X570
Any opinion on that one for Air Flow?
It seems to be comparable size, aesthetics, and better air flow

And if some others have other ideas, I'm all ears :p
Indeed when I planned it, I expected it to be more than enough for the rig.
Before buying a new case, try with the panels removed. Air pockets should work themselves out by rolling the case. Good luck. Check out gamers nexus youtube for case ideas.
 

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Hi all
I have just built my first Custom Watercooling loop, and I started running it.
I do have some concerns about the coolant temperature though...

Here is the build:
Case : Be Quiet Dark Base 700
MoBo: Asus Crosshair VIII Hero (WiFi)
GPU: Asus EKWB RTX 3080
CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 5900X
CPU WB: Heatkiller IV
Rad1: Hardware Labs Nemesis GTS 360
Rad1 fans: 3 * NOCTUA Chromax NF-F12 PWM
Rad2: Hardware Labs Nemesis GTS 360
Rad 2 fans: 2 * NOCTUA Chromax NF-F12 PWM
Reservoir : Heatkiller Tube 150
Pump: D5 PWM

As for the temps I read:
Ambiant temp: 28°C
Idle CPU: 40°C
Idle GPU: 34°C
Idle Coolant: 37°C

Under load CPU and GPU increase but remain fine, yet coolant increases with them. Yesterday after a 4 hours gaming session It was a little above 50°C (53°C if I remember correctly).
I managed to find a huge air bubble after this gaming session, that I removed.

It gives me the impression that my loop is nicely taking heat away from components, but then has issues putting it into the air.
I tried to remove more air, in case there are some left in Rads, as that huge bubble I removed (half a tube of air...), but I can't seem to bleed some more now.

Do you guys have any opinion on this?
For my TR 3970x build i have 2 thick boy high fpi 360 rads for the cpu and one high fpi 140mm rad for the gpu radeonVii. i had put all rads blowing heat out and then installed a 200m side case fan to blow air in, i also have a 140mm fan on the bottom to help push air into the case, this helped a lot vs having the secondary front mount cpu rad blowing warm air into the case, even tho it has 6 fans and the top has 3 and cool air going in from the side that little bit of extra heat just killed the efficiency of the second top 360mm rad. So yea thats what i ended up doing and its great now. 4.4ghz all core temps are great for 1.525vcore the worst i have ever seen was 81c typically around 55~65c under moderate to heavy load. TR sucks the juice out the wall socket tho lol. 600w from the wall pretty easy to achieve without using the gpu. Wonder if my 750w psu is doing all right : poke :
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Yeap @StAndrew :)
I just let it idle tonight for a few hours with only the front panel removed (so displaying the air filter) and the temps went to the following:
Ambiant temp: 27°C
Idle CPU: 36°C
Idle GPU: 29°C
Idle Coolant: 31°C

I will have time tomorrow to test more efficiently and under load.

Would be a pain to have to change case! I'd have to re-do all my tubes... And I like the look of the Be Quiet Dark Base 700
But it kind of kills the interest of having a silent case if you have to run fans at ful speed to have decent temps...
But well, still better than wondering if the tubes aren't bending themselves in the case while you are playing... :p

Thnanks for the insight
 

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I took my panels to a machine shop and for 30$ got some 140mm holes cut into them. If looks are not an issue, not a bad way to fix the case. There are some custom grill options as well if your up to it.
 

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Case does a lot, I had the same issue inside the inwin 509, it's a pretty looking case but it's an immense hotbox. I now have a Phanteks Enthoo Pro 2, and it makes an immense difference, I love this case, it actually has the airflow the rads need to get rid of the hot air. Phanteks Innovative Computer Hardware Design
 

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I took my panels to a machine shop and for 30$ got some 140mm holes cut into them. If looks are not an issue, not a bad way to fix the case. There are some custom grill options as well if your up to it.
Or you can buy a hole cutter set (attach to a drill ) for 30$ , and do your own holes.
 

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Or you can buy a hole cutter set (attach to a drill ) for 30$ , and do your own holes.
Free hand it? It would look like total butt if I tried that :D
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks @braincracking
I am indeed eying Corsair cases and Phanteks ones :)
I will look for more feedbacks dedicated to watercooling when I switch. The Be Quiet Dark Base 700 has very good reviews, and I indeed think it's a great case for Air Cooling, but now that I look back at the build, here is what I noticed:
  • Limited space for both rads, I had to remove one fan from the top one
  • I am not sure there is enough dedicated space for the top radiator, as my fan + radiator are overlapping the MoBo up to the top of the RAM sticks (which is OK, it works, but with 5 more cm in the case it would have been better
  • Top panel has a few slits at the back of it, but in the end I suppose that the air I push through my rad is actually making a hot air bubble between the rad and the top pannel. Top pannel heats like crazy when temps ramp up (it's more or less in contact with rad, so it makes sense)
  • When you put two rads, one top and one front, air intake becomes limited (I have front rad as intake, top rad pushing air out, and two 140 fans, one at the back of the case as exhaust and one on the bottom as intake).

I have spent hours today taking temp values...
I ran the three following tests :
  • 30mins idle
  • 3DMark Time Spy test
  • 3DMark time Spy stress test

Here are the results

Ambiant Temperature = 26°C

Case closed

ComponentIdlingAfter Time Spy TestAfter Time Spy stress test
CPU43°C61°C62°C
GPU35°C60°C65°C
COOLANT37°C45°C50°C

I have set my fan curve so that when the coolant hits 50°C, all fans are at 100%, so that was noisy... Completely annihilating the whole point of a silent case.

Front panel removed only

ComponentIdlingAfter Time Spy TestAfter Time Spy stress test
CPU39°C57°C52°C
GPU31°C56°C60°C
COOLANT33°C40°C45°C

At 45°C, my fan curve is at 66%, so it was far better noisewise, despite the front pannel removed. In particular considering the fact that my fans are Noctua NF-F12, making 66% hearable but really bearable.

Front and both side panels removed

ComponentIdlingAfter Time Spy TestAfter Time Spy stress test
CPU37°C54°C53°C
GPU29°C53°C57°C
COOLANT31°C38°C42°C

At 42°C, my fan curve is at 50%, and they are really quiet for a computer under full load (it roughly corresponds to my idling noise with panels on...).

What I did not try and which could help a lot is the removal of the top panel, since I think this is at least half the problem.

All in all, I think I will use my computer with front panel removed for now, and I will look into buying a new case, and this time I will pay more attention to specific watercooling reviews, since in the end, cases structure requirements does change depending on air or watercooling (from what I can see with my little experience, watercooling requires more fan slots, for air flow and rad cooling).
 

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Can you snap a side panel shot of your rig? It would help immensely. Glad you are looking into other cases. Your component temps are very high as you know, be careful with your loop temp D5 pumps start to degrade (In my opinion) at 50c and their maximum operating temp is 60c.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Thanks @Avacado
Can't put a panel shot right now, I'll try later

I've already gone past 50°C, should I be concerned and/or change my pump? Or is it stil OK?

And I am indeed looking into cases... For now I am considering Corsair 5000X tempered glass versus Phanteks Enthoo Luxe 2
Any opinion on these two? ^^
 

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I've already gone past 50°C, should I be concerned and/or change my pump? Or is it stil OK?
Entirely up to you. I don't know how long it was exposed to those thermals and if there is any degradation already. Have you noticed any decrease in flow or RPMs? Has the pump been run dry before?

And I am indeed looking into cases... For now I am considering Corsair 5000X tempered glass versus Phanteks Enthoo Luxe 2
Any opinion on these two? ^^
I own a Corsair crystal 570x and because of that I have learned to stay away from cases that have tempered glass fronts or any cases that aren't mesh in the front due to flow restriction. Have you taken a look at Be Quiets latest offerings? I will most likely never buy a non-open air case again.
 

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50*C is fine. Pump is more than fine. I have a D5 from the 2000ish which I've put through hell and is still running. These pumps are pretty robust to say the least. There are many small form factor computers that run water and get worse temps than what you are getting. One concern maybe thermal expansion so make sure the reservoir has some air to allow for safe expansion.

Yeah, the front panel looks ok. Using my best guestimate, the area of the vents looks to be approximately equivalent to 1 or 1.5 120mm fans on each side of the front panel so your front radiator should ok. But that top panel is a head scratcher. The vents are practically useless and that radiators is not breathing at all.

-While you are looking for a new case (and when you find a new one), try to run the top radiator as intake (and the front) and you should see some small improvements. I'm starting to actually recommend this to most people lately as I've found that running all your radiators as intake tends to be the best for temps. Most cases have enough cracks and vents that the extra air will find its way out.

-Also, a trick I learned long ago; I always use some black fabric tape (any tape really, but black fabric tape is very hard to see in a black case) to seal off the sides of the radiators so air flow is not allowed to recirculate as that is one of your biggest issues. Due to resistance of your air intake, you are probably getting a lot of recirculating air at your radiators.

-Lastly, make sure you maximize all the other fan locations in your case for exhaust. I generally prefer "positive pressure" but in your case (and in your physical "case"), creating a negative pressure in should support better air flow through the restricted vents (In a better air flow case, positive pressure is generally preferred).
 

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Can you snap a side panel shot of your rig? It would help immensely. Glad you are looking into other cases. Your component temps are very high as you know, be careful with your loop temp D5 pumps start to degrade (In my opinion) at 50c and their maximum operating temp is 60c.
What do you consider for degradation on these D5 pumps that are used above 50c?
I mean if one doesn’t do some care and clean ups yeah I see other issues as well. Are you referring to the electrical or water side? The age of the pump and heavy use and temps?
 

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What do you consider for degradation on these D5 pumps that are used above 50c?
I mean if one doesn’t do some care and clean ups yeah I see other issues as well. Are you referring to the electrical or water side? The age of the pump and heavy use and temps?
Electrical side. Most D5 pumps maximum thermal operating temperature is 60c. I consider degradation to be a decrease in pump RPM's or efficiency (Ability to maintain speeds) as degradation. This can also be seen if a flow meter is present.
 

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50*C is fine. Pump is more than fine. I have a D5 from the 2000ish which I've put through hell and is still running. These pumps are pretty robust to say the least. There are many small form factor computers that run water and get worse temps than what you are getting. One concern maybe thermal expansion so make sure the reservoir has some air to allow for safe expansion.
Pump degradation conversation aside, how can you actually say 50c is fine? I would be loosing my mind if I saw loop temps at 50c when my ambient was 28. I do agree that D5's are robust and versatile and to avoid getting into a debate, I respect your prerogative. I would not be comfortable with those thermals at all.
 
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Electrical side. Most D5 pumps maximum thermal operating temperature is 60c. I consider degradation to be a decrease in pump RPM's or efficiency (Ability to maintain speeds) as degradation. This can also be seen if a flow meter is present.
Agree. 60c is way warm for small electrical motor windings and all, especially for very very long time .. like StAndrew mentioned 50c while ambient is 28c something else is going on.
 
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