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Because of the Zen chipsets' design limitations, USB 3.1 transmission speeds drop dramatically as circuit distance increases, forcing PC and motherboard players to add additional retimer and redriver chips or even an independent USB 3.1 IC in order for the function to work properly. This has thus increase the makers' costs.
2 - 5$. I wonder how the final retail cost will be.

also
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AMD Zen chipset designs have already been finalized and will begin shipments at the end of the third quarter and start mass production in the fourth.
Source
 

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They say its a Zen chipset issue but then don't explain why... This is an issue with USB 3.1 regardless... that is why some Z170 motherboards advertise the extra hardware they have, so that your USB 3.x speeds don't drop off...
 

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Quote:
transmission speeds drop dramatically as circuit distance increases
Long traces have greater resist to change (capacitance and inductance) who would've guessed. This is actually why you can not have GHz signals on traces without difficulties. Doubt it will be a huge deal a normal consumer will probably not even notice it.
 

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How is this a Zen design issue? Anyone that knows a thing or two about signal transfer knows the limitations of trace layouts on PCBs.

Digitimes, do your research before posting male cow excrements please.
 

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Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

How is this a Zen design issue? Anyone that knows a thing or two about signal transfer knows the limitations of trace layouts on PCBs.

Digitimes, do your research before posting male cow excrements please.
if the product is AMD = it is AMD fault. Always..... /s
 

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Intel chipset boards have problems too, mosfets get hot and thus makers need to place heatsinks on the board which costs extra. /sarcasm
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

How is this a Zen design issue? Anyone that knows a thing or two about signal transfer knows the limitations of trace layouts on PCBs.

Digitimes, do your research before posting male cow excrements please.
Hammer -> nail -> head
Digitimes doesn't care about facts
redface.gif
 

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Originally Posted by Particle View Post

Rare to see so much rational thought here in a thread about AMD.
While I will agree with you to an extent, how many people on this forum know that Intel has the same issue? The difference is Intel doesn't say anything is wrong with a product, it works as advertised, and never you mind that extra part over there that wasn't there last chipset. It is progress! I can't wait for Zen to release so people will get on with their lives, and we can get 300 new threads bashing the next thing AMD is coming out with before it is released. Now, onwards to the coffee pot.....
 

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Originally Posted by FLCLimax View Post

doesn't sound like something exclusive to AMD to me. I've seen this before.
Ditto. Want max speeds on USB, you need very short distances, short cables no extensions, quality cables, ... It's always been the case with high speed wire transfer.
Many if not all Intel boards now have no support for 3.1 on the chipset and require an external chip or card with a chip to add 3.1 and the new connectors.
 

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USB 3.0 and 3.1 are low voltage low distance connections, its why high speed cameras either use special repeater cables or use high-speed USB2.0 for small frame transmissions. I've got a QHY5L-II monochrome 1280x960 CMOS that can do 256fps at 300x200 and see planets through a telescope but that's the upper limit of 2.0 due to voltage. If they made it 3.0 or 3.1 I'd have to mount the computer on the telescope itself to record the imaging.

3.0 and 3.1 were never meant to drive things more than a couple feet from your computer.

The "increased cost" is a joke since all motherboards use 2.0 and 3.0 hubs already!

Just some article trying to talk smack-down about AMD again.

Every connection computers have ever had has had a limited maximum distance since intel made the first +5/0 chip (8085). RS232 at about 25 feet, LPT at about 15 depending on equipment. USB2.0 can make 15 but not at high speed, that's more like 7-9 feet depending on cable. This is why twisted pair communications over cat5 works well over distance, it pushes and pulls to create the data bit. There was an old standard prior to this that was able to reach a couple hundred feet with proper amplification but then we're getting back to ISDN tech and acoustic modem control schemes.

Right now motherboard design is limited in speed due to the simple maximum distance between the processor and ram slots. Our technology for data transmission has exceeded our capacity to increase the density of motherboards enough to make it matter. HBM is a solution to this, so is hypertransport. But we're still dealing with a maximum signal distance at initiator voltage and frequency.

With the garbage reliability most USB ports have on motherboards these days, I'm gonna buy USB hubs for every device I own next time I build a computer just so I don't have to plug in USB expansion cards over the 4 year lifetime of the system.

Half my USB2.0 ports won't supply reliable voltage on a Rampage IV Black and half the 3.0's didn't survive a CMOS update. Its absurd. I literally had to install an add-in board to make it possible for my joystick to hold still because the supply wiggles (analog sensors are sensitive to changes in supply) and it couldn't operate through a hub.
 

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I thought its serious. Now im just meh and dont care. BTW same issue is with z170 right? Well, packing everything under cpu ihs its finally taking its price...
 

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From the article:
Quote:
ASMedia clarified that this is purely a market rumor and its product's signal, stability and compatibility have all passed certification.
 

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This is the site that said it was delayed to next year, right? Now this sounds like enthusiast availability 4Q but "OH NOES high speed external IO is finicky".

Getting any sort of reliable top speed of the %currentyear% fastest IO has always needed (close to chipset ports or extra control chip) + short cables.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
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Originally Posted by HothBase View Post

From the article:
Quote:
ASMedia clarified that this is purely a market rumor and its product's signal, stability and compatibility have all passed certification.
Bingo....It's maybe another trick to drive shares down (but not today) or M/B companies to get a few bucks more on the finished product.
Also we might see Zen about Christmas time.
 
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