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Okay, alright, thanks a lot! So starting at 0.1 how *AcidBath* suggested is way too low then?

Yeah of course! I was just interested to understand what range of values are "normal" ;) Ballpark numbers..
I believe he's speaking in the context of LLC4/5 on 10th gen which isn't wrong by any means! Also, 10th gen have been "upgraded" by intel and runs at a default load line of 1.10mOhm, compared to the 1.60mOhm of 9th gen which makes it a lot different than 9th in terms of recommended values.

I'd say that the safest values would be one that follows the voltage recommendation given by others, like staying below 1.36v load voltage (VCC/VSS/die sense). Note that your board cannot read die sense, so your equivalent vcore sensor would be reading north of 1.40v as it is measured at socket and tends to overestimate voltages compared to die sense. In other words, you should have a lot of voltage headroom, assuming you are able to keep your cpu cool under load.
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 · (Edited)
This method is extremely underrated as nobody bothers trying to understand how adaptive works when trying to OC. Not a bad guide at all but I do have some comments as someone who's been using the AC/DC LL method for overclocking/undervolting for 2 years now with the 9900k, and 9900ks subsequently.
(snip)
Thanks for the info you've given, especially since it's specific to 9th gen and Z390. I wrote the guide from the standpoint of tuning my i7 10700k Z490. From what you posted I see there are sizeable differences between the two. I realize the guide could be streamlined, but I decided to give it a bit of overkill since it was aimed at those who may be new to overclocking. For my guide I decided on a walk-up into OC stability by starting at .1 IA AC LL because I could not figure out a safe one-size-fits-all IA AC LL starting point for a walk-down into OC instability. As you mentioned, using HWInfo64 can supply a reasonable IA AC LL starting point though I didn't consider using that when I wrote guide. Once the fundamentals of using IA A/DC LL for Adaptive Mode overclocking are grasped there are other ways to proceed.

10th gen users got the ability to tune the Adaptive Mode voltages using the V/F curve points, which I've found to be mandatory for Adaptive Mode voltage tuning for OCs beyond the turbo boost range (unless you want to raise the voltage beyond that of the last curve point's voltage, in that case the Adaptive Mode voltage setting can be used). Some mention that voltage tuning the V/F curve makes IA AC/DC LL tuning irrelevant, which is completely valid though not in an absolute sense.

Two interesting facts about my 10700k and Asus Maximus XII are that the default bios settings (via F5) sets LLC 4 and its associated IA AC/DC LL at .460 (as shown by HWInfo64). One other bios feature I use is to set the max CPU power draw due to the limits of my NH-D15S air cooler, though that cooler is excellent with what it can handle. BTW, in RL use those limits are rarely, if ever, hit.

A comment on my use for overclocks. Face it, the 10th gen CPUs are overclocked out of the box, so for general use I run full stock bios (F5) even though it loses the OC for my DDR4 (no XMP applied). It's only for specific apps, e.g. flight sims and video production, that I run my overclocks: 4.9 and 5.0 all core, and 5.2 all core no HT. I really like the 4.9 since its voltage and heat stress is a lot less than my 5.0 which has everything pushed to the wall (with no AVX offset). The 5.2 is more of an experiment of extremes though FSX likes it. Overall, I am just happy that my meh SP 51 10700k can be pushed a little.
 

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Two interesting facts about my i7 and Asus Maximus XII is that the default bios sets LLC 4 and it associated IA AC/DC LL at .460 (as shown by HWInfo64).
that is the auto set when you change settings from defaults in the bios and not a fixed value, it will vary according to llc, cooler score (since the cooler it is the lesser guardband required), cpu model, etc
in essence it tries to "undervolt" for you
 

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When using very droopy load lines, watch out for VID hitting the ceiling of 1.52v. The VID system is limited in its voltage request range and caps out at 1.52v, I'm not sure about the implications of exceeding this range.
the board will tell the processor if its controller supports >1.52v vid so if the board tells it no, then the proc will suppress itself if the proc wants >1.52v by clipping the freq till it does not want that vid anymore.
 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
that is the auto set when you change settings from defaults in the bios and not a fixed value, it will vary according to llc, cooler score (since the cooler it is the lesser guardband required), cpu model, etc
in essence it tries to "undervolt" for you
Interesting, are you saying the Asus Maximus XII F5 "reset" is actually tweaking things up bit, while maintaining stock 10th gen clock behavior? I thought that sort of stuff was only enabled if you used the AI Overclock feature, of which I'm not.
 

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Interesting, are you saying the Asus Maximus XII F5 "reset" is actually tweaking things up bit, while maintaining stock 10th gen clock behavior? I thought that sort of stuff was only enabled if you used the AI Overclock feature, of which I'm not.
you musta changed something, else LLC wouldnt be level 4
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 · (Edited)
you musta changed something, else LLC wouldnt be level 4
If I go into the bios and press F5 which asks "Load optimized defaults" and proceed in doing so, that operations sets LLC to 4. Perhaps there's a "Load default defaults" available; sorry if that sounds flippant, don't know any other way to put it. In any event I consider this exercise more of a curiosity than something I'm concerned about. Thanks for your feedback regardless! (y) 🙂
 

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If I go into the bios and press F5 which asks "Load optimized defaults" and proceed in doing so, that operations sets LLC to 4. Perhaps there's a "Load default defaults" available; sorry if that sounds flippant, don't know any other way to put it. In any event I consider this exercise more of a curiosity than something I'm concerned about. Thanks for your feedback regardless! (y) 🙂
oops , thats not intended behavior tho, ill check this
 

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Hi,
I'm using this method to fine-tune my OC. My Z490 TUF AC/DC LL only allow two-digit steps (I'm with 0.47, can't use 0.475, only 0.48). Can I use CPU/CACHE voltage offset to round up?


Thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 · (Edited)
I assume that .47 and .48 are AI AC LL values you are using. If you really need that .005 bump, using the Adaptive mode's Offset voltage may get that fine tuning you're looking for. As its name implies, it's a voltage offset value, though it is applied regardless of the processor's power state. Instead of using this, you can also tune voltages using your OC's affected V/F curve point's voltage offset.
 

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I assume that .47 and .48 are AI AC LL values you are using. If you really need that .005 bump, using the Adaptive mode's Offset voltage may get that fine tuning you're looking for. As its name implies, it's a voltage offset value, though it is applied regardless of the processor's power state. Instead of using this, you can also tune voltages using your OC's affected V/F curve point's voltage offset.
Thanks for replying. My board allows V/F offset for 4.8, 5.0 and 5.1. I'm using OC per core 1-4 5.0, all cores 4.9 with no AVX offset. To which V/F points should I offset?

Thanks again
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
What you ask is a bit complicated. The VID requested at 4.9 is an interpolation between the 4.8 and 5.0 V/F points, so tuning either or both of those V/F points' voltage offset will change the VID requested at 4.9. Beyond that, it's up to you to figure out what will work best for your OC.
 

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What you ask is a bit complicated. The VID requested at 4.9 is an interpolation between the 4.8 and 5.0 V/F points, so tuning either or both of those V/F points' voltage offset will change the VID requested at 4.9. Beyond that, it's up to you to figure out what will work best for your OC.
Hi..I posted a question here on my z490/10850k..wanted to get your thoughts on it: 10850k/Z490 adaptive question need some help!
 

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I have a doubt...

Let's say: for 5GHz I have a VF curve of VID = 1,30v
This is for IA_AC_LL= 0.01 right?
So [email protected] will ask VRM for 1.30V and VRM will deliver 1.30V (forget VDroop for now)

If I use, lets say, IA_AC_LL= 0.9
CPU will ask for 1.30V and the VRM will deliver something higher
or
CPU will start asking VRM something higher?

Using IA_AC_LL= 0.9, WH-info will show a higher VID and the correspondent VCore, or will Show VID=1.30V and just a higher Vcore?

I don't know if I was clear... LOL
 

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CPU will start asking VRM something higher?

Using IA_AC_LL= 0.9, WH-info will show a higher VID and the correspondent VCore, or will Show VID=1.30V and just a higher Vcore?

I don't know if I was clear... LOL
cpu will ask

WH-info will show a higher VID
what values it shows will depend on cpu's calculation
it will take the current Amps and the AC DC LL value into consideration and spit out a vid reading, to estimate an actual "die sense"
this is NOT what it actually asks for unless the AC DC LL value is 0.
 

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I have not yet managed to set my adaptive vcore.
I9 10900K & Asus z490 strix gaming e

4.9ghz all core
SVID Behavior "Best Case Scenario"
LLC 4
IA AC LL 0.01
vcore adaptive 1.32v

My goal is to get about 1.2v load (it was I need to pass stress test)
But this only get me about 1.14v in load, is there a way to fix this?

Thanks alot guys
 
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