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Discussion Starter #1
Hi,

I'm looking to buy a new monitor, since I feel like I get an annoying amount of blur from my panel with fast mouse movements. I also don't think the colors are particularly good and the the panel seems kind of blurry. This forum has a thread on the aforementioned screen, with about 100 pages of posts, so I hope someone can help me. If I'd buy a new IPS screen with similar specs, like the LG GL850, how much better would blurring in fast movements be? How much better would the colors be and text clarity be? I looked at the new response time tables in reviews use but I can't make out how much better it will be than my old screen. Additionally: how much better would a fast tn panel like the Omen be to something like the LG? I know the numbers but how would it differ experientially? I'm debating getting a 1080p 240hz tn panel for competitive gaming and just a nice 4k 60hz display for office work.

Hope one of you can help me out and thanks in advance!
 

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9 Cans of Ravioli
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surely you would get more input if you told us what the "terrible smudgy monitor" you're looking to replace was, lol.

LG GL850:



XB271HU (same panel as XF270HU but 165hz vs 144hz):



I've never looked at the GL850 in person but it's objectively the faster/better monitor. If the prices are similar then go for that, but fwiw I really like my XF270HU and it sits next to a 4K panel with nearly 2x the PPI.
 

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mfw
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surely you would get more input if you told us what the "terrible smudgy monitor" you're looking to replace was, lol.

LG GL850:



XB271HU (same panel as XF270HU but 165hz vs 144hz):



I've never looked at the GL850 in person but it's objectively the faster/better monitor. If the prices are similar then go for that, but fwiw I really like my XF270HU and it sits next to a 4K panel with nearly 2x the PPI.
That's got to be a graph of the response times without overdrive. The AHVA panels from that time were all around 6ms average response (with proper tuning).

The GL850 is slightly faster. It also has a much better coating, so the presentation will be better (assuming you don't care about color accuracy with sRGB content).
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Hi both of you and thanks for the replys very helpful. I failed finding frame data for the XF270HU. as I apparently didn't make it clear, its the monitor i own and which appears "terrible" to me. I was asking this question trying to find out (a) what the pixel response times of my screen are and (b) which type of improvements I can expect and (c) if there might be problems other than the panel (framerate, settings, my eyes lol -- i have some misalignment of the focal point of my eyes which has some funny effects)

I've never looked at the GL850 in person but it's objectively the faster/better monitor. If the prices are similar then go for that, but fwiw I really like my XF270HU and it sits next to a 4K panel with nearly 2x the PPI.
Well I'm trying to upgrade from the XF270HU and try to figure out, if its worth it. I started looking into 4k displays just for improved clarity for office work but ended up falling down the gaming monitor hole lol. You don't experience your Acer as blurry? Also with your pixel response times tables: which HZ and OD setting were tehy captured on and whats the source? Those pixel response times seem super high. Knowing the 271 has the same panel im gonna go to the googles again.

Let me state my question more succinctly:
(1) What imrpovements in motion clarity and color reproduction can you expect from the XF270HU panel to a high end 2019/2020 IPS panel.
(2) What improvements in motion clarity can you expect between a new fast IPS panel and a new TN panel (say Omen).
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Wow, okay, thanks again, invaluable help. Your graph was from RTINGs and and it basically gave me the missing link. So on the X 270HU the avg response time on medium overdrive is 13ms with also a noticable overshoot of about 14ms and 18ms response on 60hz, while a screen like the aforementioned LG gets an average of 8ms on 144 hz or a great 9ms on 60hz (which is half -- i think the 60hz stat is very important unless you run all your games on 144).



The GL850 is slightly faster. It also has a much better coating, so the presentation will be better (assuming you don't care about color accuracy with sRGB content).

Also @Pook you have the XF? Because the XG and XB with the same panel have black frame insertion which just might make the response time point moot (the XF, my model, doesnt).
 

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9 Cans of Ravioli
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I've got the XF. XB27 has BFI at 85/100/120hz but not 144hz.

That's got to be a graph of the response times without overdrive. The AHVA panels from that time were all around 6ms average response (with proper tuning).

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/acer/predator-xb271hu

Best Overdrive Setting: Off
Rise / Fall Time: 9.6 ms
Total Response Time: 17.4 ms
Overshoot Error: 0.0 %
Dark Rise / Fall Time: 10.8 ms
Dark Total Response Time: 19.3 ms
Dark Overshoot Error: 0.0 %

The Acer Predator XB271HU has a decent response time when using the 'Off' overdrive setting. The 'Normal' setting has a much faster response time, but there's more noticeable overshoot. We don't recommend using 'OD Extreme', as it introduces significant and easily visible overshoot artifacts behind moving objects.
 

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mfw
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I've got the XF. XB27 has BFI at 85/100/120hz but not 144hz.




¯\_(ツ)_/¯

https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/acer/predator-xb271hu
I know what happened. They were measuring 100% transitions back then. They've since changed their methodology to 80% transitions, probably to be more in line with other reviewers. If you look at the Normal Overdrive charts, 80% transitions are very quick, but they are slow to settle after overshooting (which is what they now call Total Response Time).

edit: actually, I'm wrong. They were measuring both 80% and 100% back then, too, but the way they measure overshoot must be different from other reviewers. Normal overdrive is considered ideal for these AHVA Acer monitors, but the overshoot levels on RTINGS charts are super high; though, the 80% transitions are good, as expected.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Normal overdrive is considered ideal for these AHVA Acer monitors, but the overshoot levels on RTINGS charts are super high; though, the 80% transitions are good, as expected.
Can you explain to me what youre specifically looking at when judging motion blur from reported numbers and why you don't see a big difference? I was just comparing tables and while I have no idea how it manifests experientially, the average on the newer model are about half.
 

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mfw
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Can you explain to me what youre specifically looking at when judging motion blur from reported numbers and why you don't see a big difference? I was just comparing tables and while I have no idea how it manifests experientially, the average on the newer model are about half.
It's true, the LG is considerably faster. I have first-hand experience with an AHVA monitor from the time your monitor released and with a modern TN monitor whose response time average is below 3ms. Inferring from that, the LG will definitely look clearer in motion. It's just that it might not be that readily apparent most of the time, and the biggest difference would probably be coating and color space coverage (because those are always easily noticeable).

If you want an expressive difference in motion clarity, modern 240Hz AHVA or modern 240Hz IPS would probably be your best bet.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
It's true, the LG is considerably faster. I have first-hand experience with an AHVA monitor from the time your monitor released and with a modern TN monitor whose response time average is below 3ms. Inferring from that, the LG will definitely look clearer in motion. It's just that it might not be that readily apparent most of the time, and the biggest difference would probably be coating and color space coverage (because those are always easily noticeable).

If you want an expressive difference in motion clarity, modern 240Hz AHVA or modern 240Hz IPS would probably be your best bet.

Okay that is what I was after. Thanks, you guys helped me out a lot. I specifically was looking to reduce motion blur when flicking in FPS and color reproduction for day to day consumption. I actually might try the Odysee G7 which guys here didnt like too much, but from specs it looks good and I think i actually would like the curve since its more natural fitted to my field of view.
 

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Robotic Chemist
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I think i actually would like the curve since its more natural fitted to my field of view.
Be cautious of curved displays, a 3D engine projects the image so it looks un-distorted on a flat screen. On a curved screen it will look distorted.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Be cautious of curved displays, a 3D engine projects the image so it looks un-distorted on a flat screen. On a curved screen it will look distorted.

Oh really thats interesting. Thanks for the heads up. I decided to go for a top end 1080p 240hz IPS 25 inch + a mid range 4k 60hz IPS 27 inch panel after all (instead of the Odysee or a top end 1440p IPS). Gonna get the Alienware and the LG UL600 (or Asus VG289Q).
 

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If your colors look poor, increase the screens brightness. If you're noticing blur, play around with your overdrive settings. Usually middle on the overdrive works well. Have the XB270HU and x34, both acer ips from around the time and I thought they looked junk until I got over setting my brightness @ 30%. Now run them at 60% and am still impressed by their vibrancy. I use my computer with the lights on. :)
 

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There are some tasty but 1080p IPS 240/280Hz options these days. Don't bother with the TNs or VAs. If you must have the best all around fastest monitor. Too bad they still can't be bothered to make them in 1440p and above 27".
G7 competes if not wins against most of these 240hz ips panels. Only cons would be viewing angles, which are not bad at all and the curve which I don't even notice. Input lag is low, response times as fast if not faster. I have ELMB SYNC on the vg259qm and I would say that's about the only thing faster atm except for OLED or crt. I wont have to update these 2 monitors until OLED becomes available in smaller sizes if that will ever happen.
 

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G7 competes if not wins against most of these 240hz ips panels. Only cons would be viewing angles, which are not bad at all and the curve which I don't even notice. Input lag is low, response times as fast if not faster. I have ELMB SYNC on the vg259qm and I would say that's about the only thing faster atm except for OLED or crt. I wont have to update these 2 monitors until OLED becomes available in smaller sizes if that will ever happen.
There is another review I read today for the G7 in 32", it has the same 17-30ms transition times from black, while yes I do agree with this update to Samsung's VA the transition times from blacks are better and probably finally usable.
Contrast variance between units seems to be rather large so far.
The curve though now at even more ridiculous 1000R is 100% unusable to me with any content. The VA glow of Samsung VA... hasn't been reported about yet with this generation, the previous one had it very bad along with narrow blacks viewing angle. Viewing angles are pretty darn bad on VA especially for 32" a no go for me.

The usable angles to me from rtings's video of the angles are about 15 horizontal and 10 vertical. Compared to an IPS where this is about 25-35 degrees. And I need 25 degrees horizontal minimum for a 32".

If Samsung ever gets sensible and releases a cheaper flat version 1-2 years later again, well maybe then their VA could be worth considering, till then it's a hard pass. At 32" it's unlikely ever to be worth it though. They always shoot themselves in the foot with their "wanna be gamery" features such as RGB crap and curve none of which are desirable for any monitor or TV. The only sensible RGB thing to have on monitors is ambient lighting, where it can read the input signal at full speed and adjust rear lights at best user attachable custom lights, so far I think only Philips has some of this to any usable degree. The rest are only doing accent lights = useless distracting crap.
 
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