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info about various thermal pads hardness / softness

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I would discuss these which are available for me and which proven to work (cool) very good, and these are : GELID Ultimate, GELID Extreme, Thermalright Odyssey 12.8 w/mk, Thermal Grizzly Minus 8 pad.

well, I don't understand some specs about mentioned pads hardness, softness, ability to compress, adjust..
all my knoweledge about it is based on expirience with using them, but I would like to know and understand real specs about that

I will give just one example, on 3070 TI, I replaced memory thermal pads with Thermalright Odyssey. Stock pads was 2mm (I really belive I measured correctly), and of course I used 2mm Thermalright Odyssey. However, due to fact Thermalright Odyssey is harder than stock ones, I run into another one problem. Obviously cooler was not able to make proper contact with gpu chip, leading to gpu core increased temperature (memory temperature with Thermalright Odyssey really improved hugely at same time), despite fact I used Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut paste on core (X pattern). Than I used better screws (stock ones are crap really), and some tricks to increase cooler pressure, which resulted in decrease of core temperature finally. I have 0% doubt, issue was with Thermalright Odyssey hardness (or whatever it is called).

so this would be very useful not only for me, but for many other users, to understand and get info about these thermal pads properties - it is not just replace and get better cooling (of course, you get way better cooling compared to stock ones, that is out of question), but you really need to pay attention, check every pad is making proper full contact, etc.
knowing and understanding these specs and properties would be very useful

yes, it is already known for example that Gelid Extreme is more "soft" compared to Ultimate. But I would like to understand matter more and get more specs.

now, what confuses me is this : Thermalright Odyssey for example clearly state (writen on product) Hardness as : (Sc):30~55 . And density (g/cc) as 3.1

now take a look at Thermal Grizzly Minus 8 pad datasheet :


it states Hardness as "Shore 00" in value 60 (I did not found density value).

when you google about Gelid Extreme and Ultimate indeed you get Hardness stated in "00" value.

but why Thermalright Odyssey state Hardness in " (Sc) ", while others state it as "Shore 00" or "00". Does someone knows more about meaning of that?

And what about density? Does density value actually tell us also about how hard/soft/adjustable thermal pad is? Does density correlate directly to hardness or (Gelid Extreme density is lower as I found on internet, compare to Ultimate) ?

please, let us put some info and research into this, and provide at least some rought differences in specs. so all of use can know which pads is going to behave in which way under certain conditions, or better to say what we can expect when using some of them, compared to another one

looking forward to more info ;)
tnx in advance!
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There are a number of hardness tests and each have their own scale. Hardness measurements are purely experimental and depend on the specifics of each test.

In regards to thermal pads, it’s important for small surface mount components that press on the pads in small local regions much like those hardness tests. More global parameters like the modulus of elasticity would be better suited for compressing the whole pad evenly.

Don’t confuse marketing material for proper engineering data.
 

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well from my experience both Gelid's are pretty hard to compress. The softest I found for my GTX1070 which has 1.75mm stock pad, and neither Gelid or Thermal Grizzly would compress enough.
PCB bents when screws were tightened.
Found these to be the softest: EC360® BRONZE Thermal Pad, 8 W/mk. Hardness Shore C 20
Also EC360® PLATINUM Thermal Pad has 16.6 W/mk, but Hardness Shore OO 65.
 

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I stick with thick clay just for this reason. Everyone harps on how expensive Fujiploy Extreme's are. However, I've used it on over several video cards. And never had to calculate hardness, thickness (that much) nor worry about reliability. I use 1.5mm thickness for all the things really, for example. It's really plug in play. And, for a bonus, get lower temps on vregs/mosfets/vram then any other thermal pad.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I stick with thick clay just for this reason. Everyone harps on how expensive Fujiploy Extreme's are. However, I've used it on over several video cards. And never had to calculate hardness, thickness (that much) nor worry about reliability. I use 1.5mm thickness for all the things really, for example. It's really plug in play. And, for a bonus, get lower temps on vregs/mosfets/vram then any other thermal pad.

I'm not able to get/order them.


so, lower value of Shore 00 means it is more soft?
 

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I'm not able to get/order them.


so, lower value of Shore 00 means it is more soft?
actually this is better since EC360 pads are a very low "Shore C" rather than OO or A

 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
actually this is better since EC360 pads are a very low "Shore C" rather than OO or A



thank you very much for link and informations. this is exactly what is needed for everyone to know

so for example these Bronze which is soft, would be very good solution for backplates for me (8 w/mk, if real, should be much better than stock) , or even on front side in some cases
 

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I would discuss these which are available for me and which proven to work (cool) very good, and these are : GELID Ultimate, GELID Extreme, Thermalright Odyssey 12.8 w/mk, Thermal Grizzly Minus 8 pad.

well, I don't understand some specs about mentioned pads hardness, softness, ability to compress, adjust..
all my knoweledge about it is based on expirience with using them, but I would like to know and understand real specs about that

I will give just one example, on 3070 TI, I replaced memory thermal pads with Thermalright Odyssey. Stock pads was 2mm (I really belive I measured correctly), and of course I used 2mm Thermalright Odyssey. However, due to fact Thermalright Odyssey is harder than stock ones, I run into another one problem. Obviously cooler was not able to make proper contact with gpu chip, leading to gpu core increased temperature (memory temperature with Thermalright Odyssey really improved hugely at same time), despite fact I used Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut paste on core (X pattern). Than I used better screws (stock ones are crap really), and some tricks to increase cooler pressure, which resulted in decrease of core temperature finally. I have 0% doubt, issue was with Thermalright Odyssey hardness (or whatever it is called).

so this would be very useful not only for me, but for many other users, to understand and get info about these thermal pads properties - it is not just replace and get better cooling (of course, you get way better cooling compared to stock ones, that is out of question), but you really need to pay attention, check every pad is making proper full contact, etc.
knowing and understanding these specs and properties would be very useful

yes, it is already known for example that Gelid Extreme is more "soft" compared to Ultimate. But I would like to understand matter more and get more specs.

now, what confuses me is this : Thermalright Odyssey for example clearly state (writen on product) Hardness as : (Sc):30~55 . And density (g/cc) as 3.1

now take a look at Thermal Grizzly Minus 8 pad datasheet :


it states Hardness as "Shore 00" in value 60 (I did not found density value).

when you google about Gelid Extreme and Ultimate indeed you get Hardness stated in "00" value.

but why Thermalright Odyssey state Hardness in " (Sc) ", while others state it as "Shore 00" or "00". Does someone knows more about meaning of that?

And what about density? Does density value actually tell us also about how hard/soft/adjustable thermal pad is? Does density correlate directly to hardness or (Gelid Extreme density is lower as I found on internet, compare to Ultimate) ?

please, let us put some info and research into this, and provide at least some rought differences in specs. so all of use can know which pads is going to behave in which way under certain conditions, or better to say what we can expect when using some of them, compared to another one

looking forward to more info ;)
tnx in advance!
Hi,

I damaged the scews on the metal bracket holding the die to the cooler on my MSI Gaming trio X 3070.

MSI will not help. I read you changed your screws for better ones. I could take the screws out with a screw extractor but then I would need to replace them. The screws are clamped in the bracket.

Can you give me any pointers?

Thank you
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Hi,

I damaged the scews on the metal bracket holding the die to the cooler on my MSI Gaming trio X 3070.

MSI will not help. I read you changed your screws for better ones. I could take the screws out with a screw extractor but then I would need to replace them. The screws are clamped in the bracket.

Can you give me any pointers?

Thank you


I don't know what you exactly mean by metal bracket holding. sorry, my english is not perfect. if needed, show me (you can also private message) picture, or picture of example, in case that is specific part which use different screws

anyway, most of screws on GPUs I worked on are M2 (2mm thread). so I simply order on ebay M2 screws with various lenghts, I suggest 8mm, 6mm, 4mm, but you can get even 3mm, 5, 10, etc, if needed in specific case.
they are same as stock ones and fits, but material is stronger, and I use slotted head screw type (if I translate well).

stock ones screws are so bad in material plus use cross head - in most cases it will get damaged when encounter any resistance, hence you will not be able to even tighten it properly (and more you work with it, more damaged they get).

just example from ebay of type I prefer :



with slotted head and solid material, you can tighten them just fine how much is needed. but do not over-tighten them! (which is certanly possible with such screw type).
no matter if screw itself is not going to break from over-tightening, you can break or damage other things. patient and careful ;)

if you need some specific screws which are not M2, try to check which properties and dimensions your are/was, and search for such, but better ones.

if simply metalic look bothers you, try searching for black ones, maybe they are out in market (I never bothered).
 

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I don't know what you exactly mean by metal bracket holding. sorry, my english is not perfect. if needed, show me (you can also private message) picture, or picture of example, in case that is specific part which use different screws

anyway, most of screws on GPUs I worked on are M2 (2mm thread). so I simply order on ebay M2 screws with various lenghts, I suggest 8mm, 6mm, 4mm, but you can get even 3mm, 5, 10, etc, if needed in specific case.
they are same as stock ones and fits, but material is stronger, and I use slotted head screw type (if I translate well).

stock ones screws are so bad in material plus use cross head - in most cases it will get damaged when encounter any resistance, hence you will not be able to even tighten it properly (and more you work with it, more damaged they get).

just example from ebay of type I prefer :



with slotted head and solid material, you can tighten them just fine how much is needed. but do not over-tighten them! (which is certanly possible with such screw type).
no matter if screw itself is not going to break from over-tightening, you can break or damage other things. patient and careful ;)

if you need some specific screws which are not M2, try to check which properties and dimensions your are/was, and search for such, but better ones.

if simply metalic look bothers you, try searching for black ones, maybe they are out in market (I never bothered).
Thanks for the reply. I will try to be as clear as possible.

I sent you a screenshot from this video:

He removes the metal bracket I am reffering to at 3:13.


The 4 metal bracket screws are thinner by the top of the screw so that the metal bracket can clamp to them. My terrible drawing may help figure it out.

As you can see in his green basket, the backplate screws are not fully threaded. The top part is thicker. Do you think I could replace them with the Ebay scews you showed me?

Tomorrow, I will take off some of the screws in good condition to measure their length and I will let you know.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
yes, I know how some of stock screws are.

to answer you is there any problem with using screws from ebay, like I do, I have no final answer. there may be something I'm not aware of. I don't want to give wrong answer and cause someone damage (so someone else here, more educated on this matter, can step in and share his/her expirience and opinion).
but I had zero problem using screws from ebay (actually, much better expirience, but careful not to over-tighten)
 

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all my knoweledge about it is based on expirience with using them, but I would like to know and understand real specs about that
Find a web link of an ODM thermal pads factory in Taiwan and then I will help.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·

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when I google ODM thermal pads Taiwan, I get mostly some website from China, like this one :
How about to look search results due pictures?
Some websites use images for the entire page instead of regular text.
It took me 40 minutes to find of what I was looking for, this is why I do not share everything that I know.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
How about to look search results due pictures?
Some websites use images for the entire page instead of regular text.
It took me 40 minutes to find of what I was looking for, this is why I do not share everything that I know.

it took me way more than 40 minutes and did not find and did not exactly what you claim

it is 100% up to you, if you wish to share some knoweledge regarding that, or post link of that sites

at least, I'm now aware of EC360 pads after opening this thread, and indeed Bronze which everyone claim to be pretty soft, can be very good option where 8 w/mk is enough (if they advertise true value).

EDIT - also found this site and specs for EC360


according to them, Silver is same hardness as Bronze, both are Shore C 20, but is 12 w/mk

but if they are so good, I wander how I did not notice many people use them, instead like me using Gelid Extreme, Ultimate (hard), and Thermalright Odyssey (hard)
 

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let me know which is my age?
According to OCN forum engine and it problematic configuration, I have no clue even of which is your country, at good working forums there is mouse-over text for its flag.
Most industries they are B2B, therefore even if the information gets found, they will never talk to you.
But they will talk to me, because I an related with the industry, in many ways.

Have a nice day..
 

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well from my experience both Gelid's are pretty hard to compress. The softest I found for my GTX1070 which has 1.75mm stock pad, and neither Gelid or Thermal Grizzly would compress enough.
PCB bents when screws were tightened.
Found these to be the softest: EC360® BRONZE Thermal Pad, 8 W/mk. Hardness Shore C 20
Also EC360® PLATINUM Thermal Pad has 16.6 W/mk, but Hardness Shore OO 65.
So, did you end up using EC360 Bronze Thermal Pads 2mm? I have Palit GTX1070 Jetstream with 1.75mm thermal pad thickness and also wonder what to use instead of just stacking 1.25mm with .5mm pads. Thanks in advance!
 
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