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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, i've been looking for some gaming laptops. I am looking at msi and sager after a few recommendations i got.

i have some questions though about it.

I am interested in a 15 inch laptop. Specifically, i have been looking at the GT60 and np8258 from sager.

Here are some laptops from msi, but looking mainly at the gt60.

http://www.xoticpc.com/custom-gaming-laptops-notebooks-msi-laptops-ct-95_51_165.html

i was wondering about the build quality of the new msi laptops. How is the cooling? Is it reliable? and how about the graphics card? I was interested in the 860m because i heard it was actually maxwell, but it seems that they are still kepler based. so i guess it doesn't matter if i have a 860 or 870 since they will both be kepler.

Also i was wondering about laptop processors. Do the processors necessarily have to be i7 to play the games? I don't see how an i5 would make that much of a difference playing games as to using an i7. Wouldn't that also save power? same with the 860/870.

here is the sager model i was looking at: http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np8258-clevo-p157sma-eta-march-p-6988.html

same questions for the sager. build quality/cooling/reliability, etc.

thanks.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Novacore View Post

Hi, i've been looking for some gaming laptops. I am looking at msi and sager after a few recommendations i got.

i have some questions though about it.

I am interested in a 15 inch laptop. Specifically, i have been looking at the GT60 and np8258 from sager.

Here are some laptops from msi, but looking mainly at the gt60.

http://www.xoticpc.com/custom-gaming-laptops-notebooks-msi-laptops-ct-95_51_165.html

i was wondering about the build quality of the new msi laptops. How is the cooling? Is it reliable? and how about the graphics card? I was interested in the 860m because i heard it was actually maxwell, but it seems that they are still kepler based. so i guess it doesn't matter if i have a 860 or 870 since they will both be kepler.

Also i was wondering about laptop processors. Do the processors necessarily have to be i7 to play the games? I don't see how an i5 would make that much of a difference playing games as to using an i7. Wouldn't that also save power? same with the 860/870.

here is the sager model i was looking at: http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np8258-clevo-p157sma-eta-march-p-6988.html

same questions for the sager. build quality/cooling/reliability, etc.

thanks.
An i5 would be fine, you'll have top performance for not quite as long but it still will perform well for a couple of years. I had an AW with an i3 and it was fine, I could play any game I wanted, but maybe not on high, so that depends on you. Can't help you on anything else, but an i5 should be fine, but an i7 would be better. Just depends on your budget and how important it is that you play games on highest settings possible. Hope this helps.
 

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Personally I would go with Sager, and by default it has an i7 4700MQ in it. Unless your budget is that tight I would go for the 4700MQ. I don't even see an MSI with an i5 for the GT60 range.

MSI has a single heatpipe and fan to cool both the CPU and the GPU. The Sager has a dedicated fan and Heatsink for the CPU and another pair for the GPU. I have never owned an MSI but personally don't like the styling and have heard mixed review on quality. I guess the same could be said for the Sagers as well, but in my experience. The sagers I have used have been solid built, but were no where near the quality of the m18x I have.

I don't know if the newer notebooks MSI has come out with are better, but there wasn't a major chassis design so I doubt there would be an improved cooling system. I would do some research and temps, and read up on them before making your final decision. I am sure either machine will be pretty night, but none of them are perfect.
 

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Keep in mind that a laptop i5 is only a dual core and the i7 is a quad core. That is the big difference on laptops.

I think its like this:
Pentium is a dual core with no hyper threading or turbo
i3 dual core and gets turbo
i5 dual core and gets turbo and hyper
i7 quad core and gets turbo and hyper

After adding that information i agree with identity.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by identitycrisis View Post

Personally I would go with Sager, and by default it has an i7 4700MQ in it. Unless your budget is that tight I would go for the 4700MQ. I don't even see an MSI with an i5 for the GT60 range.

MSI has a single heatpipe and fan to cool both the CPU and the GPU. The Sager has a dedicated fan and Heatsink for the CPU and another pair for the GPU. I have never owned an MSI but personally don't like the styling and have heard mixed review on quality. I guess the same could be said for the Sagers as well, but in my experience. The sagers I have used have been solid built, but were no where near the quality of the m18x I have.

I don't know if the newer notebooks MSI has come out with are better, but there wasn't a major chassis design so I doubt there would be an improved cooling system. I would do some research and temps, and read up on them before making your final decision. I am sure either machine will be pretty night, but none of them are perfect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiftstealth View Post

Keep in mind that a laptop i5 is only a dual core and the i7 is a quad core. That is the big difference on laptops.

I think its like this:
Pentium is a dual core with no hyper threading or turbo
i3 dual core and gets turbo
i5 dual core and gets turbo and hyper
i7 quad core and gets turbo and hyper

After adding that information i agree with identity.
Yeah, i think im going to go with sager then. and i asked about the processor because if it didnt make that much of a difference, then i would have just gone with a cheaper laptop and get a 860 in it. but i didnt know the laptop processors were made like that. sager also doesn't come with windows installed, which is a plus because i can just install linux/windows when it gets here.

know if the maxwell versions of these gpus will come out soon or is it too far off to matter? i heard the maxwell versions would use a lot less energy than the kepler.

also, about that alien ware. i'm more of a desktop guy and never went with mobile computers. but from what i saw of the desktops, they seemed really over priced. im not sure how it is with their laptops. what is it about the alien ware that you like?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiftstealth View Post

Keep in mind that a laptop i5 is only a dual core and the i7 is a quad core. That is the big difference on laptops.

I think its like this:
Pentium is a dual core with no hyper threading or turbo
i3 dual core and gets turbo
i5 dual core and gets turbo and hyper
i7 quad core and gets turbo and hyper

After adding that information i agree with identity.
Good information, yeah the i5s are dual cores only. You really lose a lot in the step down from the i7.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Novacore View Post

Yeah, i think im going to go with sager then. and i asked about the processor because if it didnt make that much of a difference, then i would have just gone with a cheaper laptop and get a 860 in it. but i didnt know the laptop processors were made like that. sager also doesn't come with windows installed, which is a plus because i can just install linux/windows when it gets here.

know if the maxwell versions of these gpus will come out soon or is it too far off to matter? i heard the maxwell versions would use a lot less energy than the kepler.

also, about that alien ware. i'm more of a desktop guy and never went with mobile computers. but from what i saw of the desktops, they seemed really over priced. im not sure how it is with their laptops. what is it about the alien ware that you like?
Maxwell is available in the Soldered chip version of the 840, 850, 860m(2gb) as of what i read a week or two ago, I haven't looked much more. The MXM slot cards 860m (4gb), 870m, and 880m are all keplers with modifications. If you need a supplemental laptop maybe look into a sager or msi with the soldered chip (when you look on xotic, the configuration will have no other options for GPUs) but most of them are single heatpipe design.

As for alienware buying new is expensive, you gotta look for specials, deals, coupon codes, etc... Then you need to call and haggle. The more you're spending, and the longer the warranty you buy the more wiggle room they have.

The m18x is an awesome machine, all metal, dual GPU, excellent cooling. I normally buy used or off of the refurbished outlet using coupon codes to keep it affordable. If I lost the ability to buy them refurbished with 25-35% off coupon codes I would go back to sager.

Buying a new or refurb with a long warranty is a good idea with alienware, if you buy a laptop + 4 year warranty, in 3.5 years if the laptop dies from whatever, you call them up and they generally replace it with an equivalent tier in the newer model of the notebooks. So you pay $500 extra for the warranty but they take care of you if you have an issue down the road.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by identitycrisis View Post

Good information, yeah the i5s are dual cores only. You really lose a lot in the step down from the i7.
Maxwell is available in the Soldered chip version of the 840, 850, 860m(2gb) as of what i read a week or two ago, I haven't looked much more. The MXM slot cards 860m (4gb), 870m, and 880m are all keplers with modifications. If you need a supplemental laptop maybe look into a sager or msi with the soldered chip (when you look on xotic, the configuration will have no other options for GPUs) but most of them are single heatpipe design.

As for alienware buying new is expensive, you gotta look for specials, deals, coupon codes, etc... Then you need to call and haggle. The more you're spending, and the longer the warranty you buy the more wiggle room they have.

The m18x is an awesome machine, all metal, dual GPU, excellent cooling. I normally buy used or off of the refurbished outlet using coupon codes to keep it affordable. If I lost the ability to buy them refurbished with 25-35% off coupon codes I would go back to sager.

Buying a new or refurb with a long warranty is a good idea with alienware, if you buy a laptop + 4 year warranty, in 3.5 years if the laptop dies from whatever, you call them up and they generally replace it with an equivalent tier in the newer model of the notebooks. So you pay $500 extra for the warranty but they take care of you if you have an issue down the road.
All of the new alienwares are actually aluminum, not just the 18. The 14 17 and 18 are all aluminum now.
 

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That's true, I forget that, the entire line is a metal chassis now.

Before the m17x-R3 and 4 and the m14x-R1 and R2 were a plastic shell and the m18x was the only metal one they made.

Nova, if you're considering an alienware, and don't intend to do much tweaking or overclocking you're probably OK with a new one. But if you're maxing something out with the intent to overclock and adjust everything, the BiOS the AW 17 and AW 18 come with is sort of crippled with odd fan profiles. A lot of the performance benchers on NBR are pretty unhappy with the way the functionality they are missing. MR. Fox over at NBR dropped his 780s in his R2 and beat is AW18 with 4930XM and 780s in benchmarks.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by identitycrisis View Post

That's true, I forget that, the entire line is a metal chassis now.

Before the m17x-R3 and 4 and the m14x-R1 and R2 were a plastic shell and the m18x was the only metal one they made.

Nova, if you're considering an alienware, and don't intend to do much tweaking or overclocking you're probably OK with a new one. But if you're maxing something out with the intent to overclock and adjust everything, the BiOS the AW 17 and AW 18 come with is sort of crippled with odd fan profiles. A lot of the performance benchers on NBR are pretty unhappy with the way the functionality they are missing. MR. Fox over at NBR dropped his 780s in his R2 and beat is AW18 with 4930XM and 780s in benchmarks.
Another prime example was how the GT 650M on the AW M14X R2 would throttle at 67C.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by identitycrisis View Post

Good information, yeah the i5s are dual cores only. You really lose a lot in the step down from the i7.
Maxwell is available in the Soldered chip version of the 840, 850, 860m(2gb) as of what i read a week or two ago, I haven't looked much more. The MXM slot cards 860m (4gb), 870m, and 880m are all keplers with modifications. If you need a supplemental laptop maybe look into a sager or msi with the soldered chip (when you look on xotic, the configuration will have no other options for GPUs) but most of them are single heatpipe design.

As for alienware buying new is expensive, you gotta look for specials, deals, coupon codes, etc... Then you need to call and haggle. The more you're spending, and the longer the warranty you buy the more wiggle room they have.

The m18x is an awesome machine, all metal, dual GPU, excellent cooling. I normally buy used or off of the refurbished outlet using coupon codes to keep it affordable. If I lost the ability to buy them refurbished with 25-35% off coupon codes I would go back to sager.

Buying a new or refurb with a long warranty is a good idea with alienware, if you buy a laptop + 4 year warranty, in 3.5 years if the laptop dies from whatever, you call them up and they generally replace it with an equivalent tier in the newer model of the notebooks. So you pay $500 extra for the warranty but they take care of you if you have an issue down the road.
well that sucks. the chassis i wanted only comes with the 4gb version. guess i have to work with: http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np7358-clevo-w350ss-p-6991.html

and how about 13 inch laptop. the one i linked is a 15 inch, but there is a 13 inch version with same specs: http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np7338-clevo-w230ss-eta-march-p-6992.html

would it be hard to game or even read text on a 13 inch laptop? i like the idea of a more portable gaming system, but i don't want to sacrifice the ability to actually play the game.

btw im buying from the U.S.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Novacore View Post

well that sucks. the chassis i wanted only comes with the 4gb version. guess i have to work with: http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np7358-clevo-w350ss-p-6991.html

and how about 13 inch laptop. the one i linked is a 15 inch, but there is a 13 inch version with same specs: http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np7338-clevo-w230ss-eta-march-p-6992.html

would it be hard to game or even read text on a 13 inch laptop? i like the idea of a more portable gaming system, but i don't want to sacrifice the ability to actually play the game.

btw im buying from the U.S.
My friend bought a np 7330 a few months ago. He was extremely concerned about the 13.3" screen. He tried his moms MBA with the 13" screen and was pleasantly surprised. The screen size will do in a pinch, but if you are playing on it for 8 hours i would expect it to not be so great, but if you are sitting for 8 hours i would think a external monitor would be around.
 

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I think the 13" unit has had heat issues in the past. I haven't really read about them too much, but you gotta figure temps will come dwon with the maxwell hardware in it. More performance with less heat should benefit that laptop. I don't know if I could handle a 13" laptop personally to game, maybe if I flew a lot for and needed something to read documentation or work on the plane. Otherwise I would stick to a 15" If you really want the maxwell, don't need max performance and want to buy now, maybe it would be worth a look at the slimmer MSI models too. There are some nice looking MSI slim chassis notebooks out their, and most of them should be available with maxwell now.

I believe people speculate that the Maxwell MXM cards might come out as early as June, or could be October. But most of that would be based on previous release information. I don't think anyone can guarantee when the next revision of MXM mobile GPUs based on maxwell will be out. I am never a proponent of waiting for tech unless its right around the corner. These Sagers are lower prices than the previous Gen by a little bit so they're a decent bargain for the performance. I can't wait to see more specs of these new ones. I know the 21st was the day Sager would have them in hand. So hopefully in the next week or two we will have early user information about them. Maybe wait at least that long to prevent buying something with glaring issues?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiftstealth View Post

My friend bought a np 7330 a few months ago. He was extremely concerned about the 13.3" screen. He tried his moms MBA with the 13" screen and was pleasantly surprised. The screen size will do in a pinch, but if you are playing on it for 8 hours i would expect it to not be so great, but if you are sitting for 8 hours i would think a external monitor would be around.
Quote:
Originally Posted by identitycrisis View Post

I think the 13" unit has had heat issues in the past. I haven't really read about them too much, but you gotta figure temps will come dwon with the maxwell hardware in it. More performance with less heat should benefit that laptop. I don't know if I could handle a 13" laptop personally to game, maybe if I flew a lot for and needed something to read documentation or work on the plane. Otherwise I would stick to a 15" If you really want the maxwell, don't need max performance and want to buy now, maybe it would be worth a look at the slimmer MSI models too. There are some nice looking MSI slim chassis notebooks out their, and most of them should be available with maxwell now.

I believe people speculate that the Maxwell MXM cards might come out as early as June, or could be October. But most of that would be based on previous release information. I don't think anyone can guarantee when the next revision of MXM mobile GPUs based on maxwell will be out. I am never a proponent of waiting for tech unless its right around the corner. These Sagers are lower prices than the previous Gen by a little bit so they're a decent bargain for the performance. I can't wait to see more specs of these new ones. I know the 21st was the day Sager would have them in hand. So hopefully in the next week or two we will have early user information about them. Maybe wait at least that long to prevent buying something with glaring issues?
well this laptop will be going with me to work. most of the time at work will be down time, so i will be able to do w/e. and it varies from 8-12 hour shifts. i will have to carry the laptop a lot, maybe in a backpack. if there are no issues playing on a 13 inch screen, i think i would get that.

identity, you think the ones they just brought out might have issues? can you explain mxm? isn't the 2gb 860 mxm? and if not, is it worth the wait to you?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Novacore View Post

well this laptop will be going with me to work. most of the time at work will be down time, so i will be able to do w/e. and it varies from 8-12 hour shifts. i will have to carry the laptop a lot, maybe in a backpack. if there are no issues playing on a 13 inch screen, i think i would get that.

identity, you think the ones they just brought out might have issues? can you explain mxm? isn't the 2gb 860 mxm? and if not, is it worth the wait to you?
Its unlikely that their will be any major issues, its a refresh of the model lineup, not something totally brand new, so at the very least, read up on the model you want with the 765m in it and see what the major complaints were.

the 860m isnt an MXM card its soldered to the motherboard in that laptop, as well as the single heat pipe 15" you link a couple of posts ago. The original body style you were looking at has an MXM Slot type card which can be upgraded. the soldered cards cannot be.

I probably wouldn't wait unless I knew for sure I could buy a true maxwell in june in one of the dual heatsink model laptops with an upgradeable MXM slot style card. Change is the nature of technology, I feel like waiting leads to more waiting because there is always something new coming out.
 

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I have experienced both (well Clevo from Novatech for me)
I had the orange edged 17"one with an 8800MGTX , which was an excellent machine, sold it for a good price when I returned to desktops.
My Youngest son has an MSI built Medion Erazer with a core i5 and a GTX 460M and that is handling drunken student abuse just fine.

Remember when dealing with Laptops that a Core i5 is generally a dual core chip, so a core i7 would suit better if you can stretch to it
smile.gif
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by identitycrisis View Post

Its unlikely that their will be any major issues, its a refresh of the model lineup, not something totally brand new, so at the very least, read up on the model you want with the 765m in it and see what the major complaints were.

the 860m isnt an MXM card its soldered to the motherboard in that laptop, as well as the single heat pipe 15" you link a couple of posts ago. The original body style you were looking at has an MXM Slot type card which can be upgraded. the soldered cards cannot be.

I probably wouldn't wait unless I knew for sure I could buy a true maxwell in june in one of the dual heatsink model laptops with an upgradeable MXM slot style card. Change is the nature of technology, I feel like waiting leads to more waiting because there is always something new coming out.
lol man this sucks. the chassis i wanted is upgradeable, but the one with the 860m is not. maybe i could just buy a super cheap laptop locally to play casual games like hearthstone until a laptop with the right specs comes out.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Novacore View Post

Hi, i've been looking for some gaming laptops. I am looking at msi and sager after a few recommendations i got.

i have some questions though about it.

I am interested in a 15 inch laptop. Specifically, i have been looking at the GT60 and np8258 from sager.

Here are some laptops from msi, but looking mainly at the gt60.

http://www.xoticpc.com/custom-gaming-laptops-notebooks-msi-laptops-ct-95_51_165.html

i was wondering about the build quality of the new msi laptops. How is the cooling? Is it reliable? and how about the graphics card? I was interested in the 860m because i heard it was actually maxwell, but it seems that they are still kepler based. so i guess it doesn't matter if i have a 860 or 870 since they will both be kepler.

Also i was wondering about laptop processors. Do the processors necessarily have to be i7 to play the games? I don't see how an i5 would make that much of a difference playing games as to using an i7. Wouldn't that also save power? same with the 860/870.

here is the sager model i was looking at: http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np8258-clevo-p157sma-eta-march-p-6988.html

same questions for the sager. build quality/cooling/reliability, etc.

thanks.
I know that you stated that you will be looking at the sager, but since I have a GT60, I thought I would chime in.
I have an older one with the 670m, but the chassis looks the exact same. I really like the chassis, yes it is plastic, but it feels like nice plastic (the thing is already like 8 pounds, I am assuming that even if they used aluminum it would be heavier). I have not dropped it yet (knocks on wood), but I have had things fall on it [anything from metal to stone to plastic] and nothing has left a mark on the lid. The cooling is great, as long as you keep it on a flat-non-cloth surface the temps should be fine. If you can lift the back up even more then the cooling will be even better. One nice thing is that if you use headphones and are alone you can use the turbo mode for the fan. It sounds like a jet, but it does work pretty well.

I believe the i7 to be worth it over the i5, if you plan on keeping this for a few years, why not do everything to make it as good as it can be (the i7 should also increase the money you would get if you needed to sell this).

Is there really a point for waiting for maxwell? Do you plan on playing games without the powerbrick? I mean if the release of it is soon, sure wait, but I do not think it will make a real difference.
 

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I ordered a NP8278-S from Sager on 3/18. I just got off the phone with the sales rep and they told me that the ETA on them getting the new chassis and 8xxM is the end of March. At that point they still need to assemble and ship the laptop via UPS ground. I'm looking forward to getting my laptop, but I'm impatient lol.
biggrin.gif
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chargerz919 View Post

I ordered a NP8278-S from Sager on 3/18. I just got off the phone with the sales rep and they told me that the ETA on them getting the new chassis and 8xxM is the end of March. At that point they still need to assemble and ship the laptop via UPS ground. I'm looking forward to getting my laptop, but I'm impatient lol.
biggrin.gif
What kind of battery life are you expecting with that Sager? I called up Sager a few minutes ago and they said that the NP9377 would only get about an hour of battery life (Granted it has SLI 880m's) I was curious what you think you might get for battery life with your config
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by funkmetal View Post

What kind of battery life are you expecting with that Sager? I called up Sager a few minutes ago and they said that the NP9377 would only get about an hour of battery life (Granted it has SLI 880m's) I was curious what you think you might get for battery life with your config
If I'm not plugged in and on the go, I would probably try to be using the "battery boost" that the new 800m series comes with. Should be able to get 2 hours out of the 870M with that. Full 60 FPS though, I'd assume and hour and a half tops while gaming.
 
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