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Discussion Starter #1
Is there a way that cars can run, with water or any other liquid instead of fuel as a medium?

Instead of injecting fuel and using atomization to generate energy, could cars use high pressure water, probably using common-rail based tech or highly pressurized injectors to spray down highly pressurized water where would the combustion chamber be in order to move the pistons.

-The residual water can then be collected and reused again.

-Basically using kinetic energy to move the pistons like hydro dams, except without the generating electricity part.

-AN increase in throttle pedal pressure leads to faster injection / pressure of water per stroke, just like a normal fuel injection in a petrol car, minus the spark or compression ignition.

The water injected could be treated to reduce corrosion,or perhaps we could use another material instead of cast iron for the engine block/pistons to reduce corrosion and the amount of pressure needed to move the pistons. This might lead to weight savings with lighter cars etc.

It'd probably not expend or be efficient enough as diesel or petrol variants but as water is a renewable resource and the whole process doesn't emit Co2 or NOx, i wonder if it is feasible with current technology to look at?

Thanks
 

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Since water, as all liquids are, is basically incompressable, you can't use liquid pressure to store energy.

And you recovery proposition is perpetual motion.
 

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...and where do you get the energy to pressurise the water from?

Water is also an extremely poor lubricant.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

...and where do you get the energy to pressurise the water from?

Water is also an extremely poor lubricant.
Not really sure to be honest. Just a novice in this field so pardon my lack of knowledge.

Whatever they use to power water jets? Perhaps an electrical motor or so? But im sure the power required might be pretty high.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by billbartuska View Post

Since water, as all liquids are, is basically incompressable, you can't use liquid pressure to store energy.

And you recovery proposition is perpetual motion.
Well, was thinking more of a pump to enable the high flow /pressure of water and the injectors to aid in enabling the movement of the pistons

What i was trying to say that the water injection would behave similarly to fuel injection, low speed idle with little flow, and increasing the rate of flow/ number of sprays with increasing acceleration just like a petrol fuel injector would. The water, once sprayed would be collected, filtered to remove metal fragments and sent into the same high pressure pump again for spraying. There's no shut off unless the engine is powered down.

Could this be done with a less abrasive liquid, in reply to artikbot's post?
 

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The problem is that you need energy to power the compressor. And that takes energy. You now have two sets of equipment that isn't 100% efficient instead of one, and no energy source yet.
 

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You're trying to build a perpetual motion machine.................

As Artikbot says, you have to start out with an energy source and you have none.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

The problem is that you need energy to power the compressor. And that takes energy. You now have two sets of equipment that isn't 100% efficient instead of one, and no energy source yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by billbartuska View Post

You're trying to build a perpetual motion machine.................

As Artikbot says, you have to start out with an energy source and you have none.
Perpetual motion? What is that?

Ah i see. I guess there isn't any other energy source i can think of other than electric motors which are inefficient as arctikbot said. Is there an energy source thwt could power such a compressor?

Is this general idea feasible, if there is such an energy source? Or do we have to wait for technology to mature before it is feasible?
 

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Electric motors aren't energy sources, they transform stored energy into work.

You need batteries, an internal combustion generator, a hydrogen cell... Something that will provide energy in the first place, which is, unlike the medium to convert that energy into work, THE single biggest challenge in moving away from petroderivate-powered vehicles.

Not how to get the vehicle moving, but where to get that energy from in a clean, renewable, safe and space-efficient manner, while also providing the sufficient power to whatever powerplant you are using (almost always electric motors, by far the most efficient powerplants available).
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

Electric motors aren't energy sources, they transform stored energy into work.

You need batteries, an internal combustion generator, a hydrogen cell... Something that will provide energy in the first place, which is, unlike the medium to convert that energy into work, THE single biggest challenge in moving away from petroderivate-powered vehicles.

Not how to get the vehicle moving, but where to get that energy from in a clean, renewable, safe and space-efficient manner, while also providing the sufficient power to whatever powerplant you are using (almost always electric motors, by far the most efficient powerplants available).
Thanks. Did a little bit of research and it seems mostly combustion engines, albeit small are used to power the pump that connects to the waterjet Which probably negates the purpose of the idea.

Or do we have to wait for power generation technology to mature to see if the idea is feasible?
 

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Exactly.

You are using an engine to power another engine, which moves the car.

You may as well use the first engine.

In terms of light automobiles: except in a scenario where regenerative braking/deceleration is not only feasible but hugely productive, such as in an EV, it's not productive to use an engine to power another engine/motor.

Trains for example are a different story, as the transmission losses, weight and complexity of a direct drive diesel drivetrain heavily outweight using the diesel engine to generate electricity, which is then used to power electric motors right at the axles.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nickyvida View Post

Thanks. Did a little bit of research and it seems mostly combustion engines, albeit small are used to power the pump that connects to the waterjet Which probably negates the purpose of the idea.

Or do we have to wait for power generation technology to mature to see if the idea is feasible?
The idea is not at all feasible. The problem isn't really with power generation, it's with the entire idea.

The basic law of physics, conservation of energy, basically says that you can't make energy, you can only transfer it from one thing to another. Another very important thing to note is this is not going to be a 100% transfer from the "fuel" energy type to the one you want. There is going to be some waste, where some of the energy gets turned into heat energy, and doesn't do us any good.

Another big thing is that there isn't any issue with how to deliver the energy to the engine in a car, it's with how to generate the energy. Currently there's 2 methods that have worked for consumer cars:

Burn gasoline/ other similar fuels
Batteries

If you want to make a more environmentally friendly car, you need a better way to provide power to the car. The batteries are promising, just need more capacity/faster charging, and a process of making the batteries that isn't too toxic.
 
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