Overclock.net banner

1 - 20 of 65 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Temp's With and Without Shrouds
Part One With Shrouds

This is part one of a 4 part test.

1-Testing with shrouds.

2-Testing with-out shrouds.

3-Testing with low cfm 120x25mm fans.

4- Testing the optimum placement of fans on a GTX rad.Flow in the GTX runs from front to back.
This test is being done at CrazyJoe's request.

Testing was done on a loop comprised of the following.Stinger V-8 DO 320W Pelt Block,2x18W
DDC with Petra's Top, 480 GTX Rad with 4-108cfm Sunon and 4-115cfm Panaflo in matched pairs from front to back and about 6 feet of tubing I also had a double in res for the DO Stinger.Loop pressure was 9psi for all the tests.

I have a 3/4" shroud on the pull side of my rad and 1/2" shrouds on the push side of my rad. Fans and shrouds have clear silicone sealing the edges for a fairly air tight seal.

Heat load; 150 Opty stock 85.5W. 15V 320W Pelt run at 12V 235W. Total Wattage 320W.

I ran one hour of Prime 95 large FFT's, Measurements were taken in 10 minute intervals.Idle
temp's were taken after 15 minutes at idle.

These tests were run with uncalibrated equipment and are meant only as a very simple test.The inline temp probes are the Alphacool brand inserted in a plastic T the tips are right in the flow.One before the rad and one after I have them attached to Compu-Nurse readouts.The air in and air out temp's are from flat tape thermisters attached to a CM Areogate read-out. Room ambients are taken with a flat thermister attached to a Compu-Nurse read-out.The hardest part was keeping the room ambients the same. I finally gave up and just averaged out room ambients which will skew results some itself.

For all of the temp's I threw away the highest and the lowest full load readings and averaged out the other 4.I used the core-temp from Speed Fan 4.32 and Core Temp 0.95 which ever one was highest.

**This testing is done on a fairly thick rad with a high FPI count,2.13" thick with 20 fins per inch,results with thinner rads and lower FPI count will be different I would think in the push results mostly.

I will wait for all testing to be completed before I try to draw any type of conclusions from my
readings.But as you can see water temp dropped across the rad becomes less with less air
flow and the air temp's across the rad become more with less air-flow.

Please see following pic's for screen shots.They were taken in the final minute of each test.

Push-Pull With Shrouds

------------Idle-----Minutes--10----------20---------30----------40----------50--------60----------Average

Ambient---29C---------------29.5-------29.5-------29.5---------29---------29.5------29-----------29.375C

CPU-------- -4C-----------------6-----------6------------7------------6----------6----------5-------------6C

Water In---32.5C------------33.1-------33.2--------32.9-------32.8--------32.7-----32.5--------32.725C

Water Out-31.2C-------------32.1-------32.4--------31.7-------31.2-------31.8-----31.1--------31.7C

Air In--------27.5C------------28----------27.5--------27.5-------27.5-------27-------27-----------27.375C

Air Out-----31.5C------------32.5--------32-----------32---------32----------31.5----31.5--------31.875C

CPU temp is 23.375C below room ambient. Ambient 29.375C

Water temp dropped across rad 1.025C

Air temp dropped across rad 4.5C

Pull Only With Shroud

------------------Idle---Minutes--10---------20----------30--------40---------50---------60----------Average

Ambient------28C-----------------28---------27.5-------28-------28.5-------29.5-------29----------28.375C

CPU---------- -3C-------------------6----------6------------7---------8------------8-----------8------------7.25C

Water In----32.1C----------------32.8------32.5--------32.7----32.9--------33.5--------33.8--------32.75C

Water Out---31.6C----------------31.3------31.5--------31.5----31.3------32.5----------32.7--------31.7C

Air In----------26.5------------------26.5------26.5--------26.5-----27--------27-----------27.5--------26.75C

Air Out-------31.5-------------------32---------32----------32--------32--------33-----------33.5--------32.25C

CPU temp is 21.125 below room ambient. 2.25C hotter then Push-Pull. Ambient 28.375

Water temp dropped across rad 1.275C

Air temp dropped across rad 5.5C.

Push Only With Shroud
-------------------Idle---Minutes--10----------20---------30--------40----------50----------60-------Average

Ambient------28.5C--------------29.5--------29.5-------29.5-----29.5-------29.5-------29.5-------29.5C

CPU------------ -4C------------------8------------9------------9---------9-----------10----------10-------9.25C

Water In------31.9C--------------34.1--------34.2-------34.2-----34.3--------34.2-------34.2-------34.2C

Water Out---30.2C---------------32.4--------33.2------33.1------33.6--------33.1-------33.5------33.35C

Air In----------26.5C---------------27.5--------27.5-------27.5------27.5-------28----------27.5--------27.5C

Air Out-------31C-----------------33.5---------33.5-------33.5------33.5-------33.5-------33.5--------33.5C

CPU Temp is 20.25 below room ambient. 3.125C hotter then Push-Pull

Water temp dropped across rad 0.975C . Ambient 29.5C.

Air temp dropped across rad 6C.

Passive With Shroud and Fans Still Attached

I only ran this test for 40 minutes.I just don't like my loop running that hot. I know it wasn't really that hot but I'm just weird about my temp's.I am also going to run it passive when I take off the shrouds in the second part of this test.I would think with the shrouds and fans not holding the heat in that it will cool a little better.

I added a probe to the top upper side of my rad in this test I was about 5 minutes into it before i thought of adding one.It is the hottest part of the rad.I wish I had thought to of placed one on the middle and bottom part also for all of this testing.The middle seems fairly cool and the bottom warm but not as much as the top.My rad is inverted so my
barbs are at the bottom.

I averaged all 4 temp's on this test.
------------------Idle-----Minutes--------10-----------20----------30---------40-------------------Average

Ambient------24C------------------------26-----------27.8--------29.5-------29.5-----------------28.2C

CPU------------ -1C-----------------------17------------20----------22----------24-----------------20.75C

Water In-------39C-----------------------48.6--------51.5--------53.5------54.4------------------52C

Water Out-----38.4-----------------------48----------51.1---------53.2------54.3------------------51.65C

Side of Rad------?-------------------------39.8-------41.4---------43.5-------44--------------------42.175C

CPU temp is 7.45C below room ambient. 16.3C hotter then Push-Pull

Water temp dropped across rad is 0.35C

Testing with-out shrouds to follow. If you see any mistakes let me know and I will correct
them while I still have my written notes. If you would like me to add anything let me know
and I will if I can.
LL
LL
LL
LL
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
Rad Shroud Testing
Part 2 - With-Out Shrouds

This is part 2 of my rad testing with and with-out shrouds. All loop components remain the same. Stinger V-8 320W Pelt block,2x18W DDC's with Petra tops, 480 GTX Rad and about 6' feet of tubing. Psi was 9psi for this test as well as the previous test.

I ran 60 minutes of prime 95 with large FFT's recorded at 10 minute intervals for 60 minutes. Then I threw away the highest and lowest full load temp's and averaged them out. Idle temp's were recorded after sitting idle for 15 minutes.

I taped around the fan to rad junction with masking tape for a fairly air tight seal.

Push-Pull With-Out Shrouds

------------------Idle------Minutes-10--------20----------30--------40---------50---------60--------Average

Ambient----25C--------------------25.5-----25.5--------25.5------26---------26-----------26---------25.75C

CPU-------- -5C----------------------5----------5------------6--------6------------6------------6-----------5.75C

Water In---28.7C-----------------29.1------29.2-------29.4------29.5--------29.6--------29.6------29.425C

Water Out -27.3C----------------27.7------28.7--------28.7-----28.5--------28.7---------28.2------28.525C

Air In----------24C-----------------24.5-------25----------25-------25-----------25.5--------25.5------25.125C

Air Out-------27C------------------27.5------28-----------28--------28----------28-----------28--------28C

Average temp is 19.75C below ambient which is 3.25C hotter then push-pull with shroud.

Average water temp across rad is 0.9C.

Average air temp drop across rad is 2.875C.

Pull With-Out Shrouds

------------------Idle----Minutes--10---------20----------30---------40---------50---------60---------------Average

Ambient------28C-----------------27.5-------27.5-------27--------28.5---------27.5-------28---------------27.625C

CPU----------- -4--------------------9------------9-----------9---------11----------10---------10-----------------9.5C

Water In------32.5C--------------32.7--------32.5-------32.2-----31.1--------32.7------32.6-------------32.5C

Water Out---31.2C--------------31.6---------31.8-------31.4-----31.8--------31.5------31.8-------------31.675C

Air In----------26.5C--------------26.5----------26.5-------26--------27.5--------26.5------27---------------26.75C

Air Out--------31C-----------------32------------31.5-------31.5------32.5--------32---------32--------------32C

Average temp 18.125 below ambient which is 2.875C hotter then pull with shroud.

Average water temp drop across the rad 0.95C.

Average air temp drop across rad 5.25C.

Push Only With-Out Shroud

----------------Idle-------Minutes--10---------20---------30----------40---------50------------60-----------Ambient

Ambient-----27.5C------------------27.5------27.5-------27.5-------27.5-------27-----------27-----------27.375C

CPU---------- -1C----------------------9-----------9-----------8----------10--------10-----------10------------9.5C

Water In-----32C--------------------33.1--------32.4-------32.4-------33.2------32.1-------32.5--------32.8C

Water Out--31.7C--------------------31.9-------31.5-------31.4-------32.1-------31.7------31.6--------31.625C

Air In----------24C---------------------24---------23.5-------23.5-------24---------23.5-------23.5-------23.625C

Air Out-------31C----------------------32---------31----------31----------32---------30.5-------30.5-------31.125C

Average temp is 17.875C below ambient which is 2.375C hotter then push with shroud.

Water temp drop across rad 0.875C.

Air temp drop across rad 7.5C.

Passive With-Out Shroud

Coming Soon...


Comparisons......

Push-Pull with shroud average below ambient.....23.375C...3.625C cooler

Push-Pull with-out shroud average below ambient........19.75C
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pull only with shroud average below ambient.........21.125C......3C cooler

Pull only with-out shroud average below ambient..........18.125C
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Push only with shroud average below ambient......20.25C.....2.375C cooler

Push only with-out shroud average below ambient..........17.875C
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Water temp drop across rad with push-pull and shrouds.........1.025C

Water temp drop across rad with push-pull and no shrouds.....0.9C
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Water temp drop across rad with pull and shroud..............1.275C

Water temp drop across rad with pull and no shrouds........0.95C
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Water temp drop across rad with push and shroud...........0.975C

Water temp drop across rad with push and no shroud......0.875C
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Air temp drop across rad with push-pull and shrouds.........4.5C

Air temp drop across rad with push-pull and no shrouds....2.875C
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Air temp drop across rad with pull and shroud...............5.5C

Air temp drop across rad with pull and no shroud ........5.25C
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Air temp drop across rad with push and shroud..........6C

Air temp drop across rad with push and no shroud.....7.5C
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------.

The best cooling came from the use of fans in a push-pull configuration with shrouds. I'm actually surprised with this much difference in the temp's.I was honestly only expecting a C or at the most 2C difference.

My shroud is only 3/4" on the pull side and 1/2" on the push side.Optimum is supposed to be around 1.5". I'm going to have to get some 1.5" aluminum channel and make some. And I hope it will make as much of a difference as the 3/4" shroud has.

After this simple test I would say a shroud is mandatory not optional for optimum cooling.

Part 3 with 4 lower cfm 120x25mm fans in pull with shroud to follow soon.
LL
LL
LL
LL
LL
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I tried 4-47 cfm Yate Loons on a 1.25" shroud in pull. I'm surprised
how well they did.As before I ran my CPU at stock which produces 89W.My320WTEC was running at 12V or 226W which gave me a total heat load of 315W.

As before I ran Prime 95 large FFT's for one hour,the highest and lowest
temp's were removed and the other 4 were averaged out.Idle temp was recordedafter 15 minutes of idle.These fans are the typical 120x25mm ultralow cfm fans.
Attachment 55291

Attachment 55339

Idle -----Minutes ------10 -----20 ----30 ----40 ----50 ----6o --Average

Ambient-25C -----------25 -----25 ----24.5 --23.5 --23 --22.5 --24C

CPU- -2C ---------------10 -----10 ----10 ------9 ----9 ---10 -----9.75C

Water in-32.5C --------33 -----32.9 --33.2 ---32.7 -31.9- 31.7 -32.625C

Water Out-31.7C ------31.3 ----31.8 --32 ----31.7 --30.3 -30.3 -31.325C

Air in-31.7C -----------26.5 -----26.5 ---26.5 --25.5-- 25--- 25 --25.875C

Air out-26.5C --------26.5 -----28 ----28.5 ---27 ---26.5 --26.5 -27.375C

CPU Temp average 24C

Room ambient temp average 24C

Water into rad average 32.625C

Water out of rad average 31.325C

Air into rad average 25.875C

Air out of rad average 27.375C

4 47cfm Yate Loons on a 1.25" shroud in pull average temp below ambient 14.25C

2 -108 cfm Sunon and 2 -115 cfm Panaflo with a 3/4" shroud in pull average below
room ambient 21.125C

2 -108 cfn Sunon and 2 -115 cfm Panaflo in pull with no shroud average below room
ambient 18.125C

These fans were running 3.875C hotter then 4 100+ cfm fans with no shroud.

And 6.875C hotter then 4 100+ cfm fans on a 3/4" shroud.

I have been suggesting 100+ cfm fans on these rad's after this test I would say they will do fine with something like the 120x38mm Panaflo 69 cfm fan.Perhaps some of the higher cfm 120x25mm fans would work as well.I have been under the impression that these rads only worked well with high pressure and higher cfm fans.This test kind of blows that out of the water.

I think I realize why these cool as well as they do to.The tubing in the rad has 2 rows of 0.05x0.75" internal tubing.That produces a lot of turbulence and a filming action.Older type of rads produced turbulence by trying to be unrestrictive and were flow dependent because of it.The way these are set up you should be able to get turbulent flow even at lower flow levels since its forced to be turbulent.Of course the higher your flow the more turbulence you will get with the higher pressure..


LL
LL
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
781 Posts
Very elaborate testing there ira-k !


Push pull appears to have a lot more impact than originally thought.

Big rep for all the hard work !
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyJoe View Post
Very elaborate testing there ira-k !


Push pull appears to have a lot more impact than originally thought.

Big rep for all the hard work !


Thanks I lost my format with the # I'm still trying to make it readable...Take a look at the PDF till I can straighten this out..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
781 Posts
I already downloaded it and saved it !


Too bad a person can't insert tables into this forum ... would make life oh so much easier when posting data tables eh ?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Quote:


Originally Posted by Martinm210
View Post

Great test results, looking forward to seeing it all



Thanks Martin...This started out as a simple test and then I kind of let it snow-ball on me...Its fun though...I can't get my charts to paste with the text so far... Looks like I might have to type it all out...yuuuuuch...
...I'm glad I have the PDF or i would be pulling my hair out by now....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
Ira, seeing as how your CPU temp seems to be quite low, this is with your TEC, right?

Did I read that correct and that you were only hitting 21C with the 320W TEC and running in passive mode?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Quote:


Originally Posted by TsunoTakishi
View Post

Ira, seeing as how your CPU temp seems to be quite low, this is with your TEC, right?

Did I read that correct and that you were only hitting 21C with the 320W TEC and running in passive mode?



Yeah...Thats sick isn't it...
..That truely amazed me..With the Pelt and cpu I'm not even starting to load this rad up...And thats with the shroud and fans still on once I get them off and it would cool a lot better..Thats why I decided to try it with some little 120x25mm low cfm fans in my third test....This thing might make a killer quiet computing rad for guys who like silence...Bet your glad you bought one now...
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,967 Posts
Quote:

Originally Posted by ira-k View Post
Thanks Martin...This started out as a simple test and then I kind of let it snow-ball on me...Its fun though...I can't get my charts to paste with the text so far... Looks like I might have to type it all out...yuuuuuch...
...I'm glad I have the PDF or i would be pulling my hair out by now....

Yeah charts don't work well, but the pdf works great!

Well you've confirmed the pull is better than push, and push/pull is even better yet.

Looking forward to the low cfm fan and shroudless. Testing as long as you have and the number of times is awesome...thats the only way you can really tie down the numbers when they are only a few degrees apart.

Great example of how it should be done..


Oh...and I thought it was hot here being 25C...at least it's not 29!..lol
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,355 Posts
wow very nice temps and test....TEC huh....
hmmmm lol.....

BTW guys...
whats the "AUX" in speed fan?
mine is showing 119C!!!!!!!!

and what is the "system" reading considered as?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Thanks Guys...I still haven't gotten the charts to do right...Its more of a pain then the testing was...
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Well I have the second part W/O shrouds done except for the passive test...I really cant believe they make as much of an impact on cooling as they do..I was only expecting a C or two difference....

No PDF for part two I will combine 1-4 in one PDF when I'm finished with all 4 parts...
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Thanks...Yeah I need to make some 1.5" shrouds now and see if that is really is the optimum thickness for them...Thats a heck of a temp drop for a couple of bux...
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,865 Posts
I bent mine out of 2.3mm flat stock aluminum @ a height 0f 3", which allowed me to mount the 38x120mm fans on top for overkill or on the inside for optimal 1½" rise. The temp difference was 4-6ºC as I recall.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
22,477 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dryadsoul View Post
I bent mine out of 2mm flat stock aluminum @ a height 0f 3", which allowed me to mount the 38x120mm fans on top for overkill or on the inside for optimal 1½" rise. The temp difference was 4-6ºC as I recall.

Was that just on a pull or a push-pull? My pull shroud is 3/4" and push is 1/2" I'll just screw those 2 together and use it on the push side, then go ahead and get a stick of 1.5" channel to make my pull shroud..Then I'll try them thicker...
 
1 - 20 of 65 Posts
Top