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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
**************************************************
The problem was solved on this AM3 motherboard

Here is the solution to avoid any reader go through this entire thread.

- The freezes were happening due to an inconsistent ACHI AMD Controller for this particular platform
- To overcome this issue you need to switch/replace the AMD one's with Microsoft's standard ACHI controller, which works perfectly fine.
- A neat explanation on how to do this is explained in this thread from the Crucial Forum : http://forums.crucial.com/t5/Crucia...vers-with-standard-Microsoft-SATA/ta-p/176373

Cheers
***************************************************


Hi there!

I hope everybody's doing fine :)
I'll try to be short and concise, I hope I won't make it too long.

The scenario:
Once in a while I update components in my HTPC, which is used mainly as media and gaming center.
This time I went for a new graphic card and and a new ssd with more capacity. The previous one was a OCZ Agility 3 (120Gb), which has performed
an outstanding duty for 7 years. The OCZ didn't break or anything, it still works great, but I wanted more games on my SSD.

My Rig (after upgrade):
Mobo -> Gigabyte GA-880GMA-UD2H
Socket -> AM3 (Yes old, but still rocking)
CPU -> AMD 1090T
RAM -> 16GB
SSD -> Samsung 860 Evo
Graphic Card -> 1060 gtx 6GB SC
OS : Win 7 Ultimate 64 bits
Case -> pc-C60
PSU : Seasonic X-650
External case with HDD's

The issue:
Win 10
Since I had decided that it was time to move to Win 10, last week I got a new SSD (860 Evo) and performed a fresh installation.
All went smooth and quick, no problems during installation and it went pretty fast as well.
Now, right after all was finally setup, I noticed some sort of freezing of the computer. It's not that you can't use it at all, it's more like a
random freeze, where only the mouse can move around, but any other window is stuck. You can't open files or programs, since it seems that they won't open.
After 2-3 minutes of absence, the system is back and everything you clicked during that interval, re-actives and it's blinking everywhere.
I was a bit perplexed, since I never have had this issue with the previous SSD. I obviously have had bsod's and reboots, but with the OCZ,
never anything like this and in particular, not on a fresh install...

Back to Win 7:
So I decided to go back to Win 7, as I also was having issues with the display in Win10 and in Win7 it just works flawlessly (at least for me).
Surprise surprise, I'm experiencing the same issue in Win7 now. I do not need to reset or re-boot, it comes back, but it is simply not acceptable,
specially when online gaming.
Something is wrong here. Even though my HW is not up-to-date, it still packs a punch for what I need. Sure I could switch to a newer AMD socket (more m-atx am4 please!) , but what I have
fulfills perfectly my needs, and all is compatible.

Trying to isolate the problem:
-> Before installation, I made sure that BIOS all was correctly selected (SATA and AHCI). However, I can't see any AHCI drivers in Device Manager, based on this article (https://www.tecklyfe.com/fix-windows-10-freezes-mouse-still-moves/). See screenshots attached.
-> I eliminated indexation on C:\ and deleted the huge hibernation file
-> I did a Disk Cleanup
-> I installed "Samsung Magician" but no new FW available. In fact, there's nothing else of interest in S.Magician for my SSD. I was inclined to
think, that these SSD's have their dedicated drivers, but I guess I was wrong.
However, the problem persists in Win7.

Solutions ? :
-> I'm not going to switch back again to Win 10, since it will happen again. I have to find the issue in Win7.
-> Is there any program out there that makes stress tests or that can measure the integrity of the ssd?
-> I have read that some people have switched from AHCI to IDE on the SSD, and for some it worked. But honestly, I don't think that switching to IDE is
the solution.

If you guys have any other hint or idea, that would be greatly appreciated.
Sorry, in the end, I couldn't keep it short...but thank you for reading this post if you reached this point.

Cheers,
Ken
 

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Discussion Starter #2 (Edited)
Hello,
I realized that I had done one additional change on this upgraded Rig, I have used another SATA cable for the installation, new cables that I bought from Amazon.es (https://www.amazon.es/gp/product/B0171PXAV2/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1).
I have switched to the "old" sata cable, which I have been using for 7 years and never gave me any problems. I just thought that using a new SSD drive also deserved a new cable. I'll see how things develop with the old cable.

Btw, which good SATA cable do you recommend ? I need one with a right angle connecting to the SSD. I had a look at this link (http://www.overclock.net/forum/355-...rmation-thread.html#user_SeansrecommendedSSDs) and on the Installation part, it mentions the following:

SATA Cables:
Whether they are plain old SATA, SATA 2, or SATA 3 cables they all have the same though put. The only difference b/w any SATA cable is the quality of the material used in the cable. (Read the testing results and more info here). The link for that test is : www.maximumpc.com/article/features/..._down_your_data_transfers_max_pc_investigates
Tha link doesn't seem to work anylonger....

On the other hand, if the sata cable doesn't solve this problem, do you think that I should make a replacement in Amazon ? I have time until the 24-May-2018.

Kind regards,
Ken
 

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Do you use the microsoft drivers or the amd's ones? You could try switching between them , although amd's would be a bit slower.

The new samsung 860 seem to have some issues with older amd chipsets . I've already read a couple of topics without any solution afaik. You could try informing samsung (new firmware maybe?)
 

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I have had a similar experience using a Samsung 850 EVO. The only "fix" was to Reset the drive to factory settings.
I didn't use the drive as a boot drive, but I used it to install games on it. Games would suddenly freeze and stop working
and only a reboot would solve the problem. There were no patterns to the time it took before a freeze would occur.
After changing cables and doing all sort of things I finally tried resetting it to factory settings. Which solved all
issues I had with the drive. It's been working flawless ever since on two different motherboards.

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/...de-to-wiping-an-SSD-Reset-to-factory-defaults

I would recommend the PartedMagic method - the second method listed.
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Do you use the microsoft drivers or the amd's ones? You could try switching between them , although amd's would be a bit slower.

The new samsung 860 seem to have some issues with older amd chipsets . I've already read a couple of topics without any solution afaik. You could try informing samsung (new firmware maybe?)
Thank you for replying Eddie
I believe I'm using AMD drivers, it wasn't until I installed the chipset drivers that the Evo 860 was recognized. On the other hand, how do I switch from AMD to Microsoft drivers? Where can I find the microsoft ones ? I will also ask in this forum (https://us.community.samsung.com/t5/Memory-Storage/bd-p/memoryandstorage). It clearly says US community though, and I'm located in Europe, not sure if I will be taken into consideration :) .
Cheers

Edit : Would you know by instance if this happens as well for the 850 Evo? If not, I might replace it with the 850.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I have had a similar experience using a Samsung 850 EVO. The only "fix" was to Reset the drive to factory settings.
I didn't use the drive as a boot drive, but I used it to install games on it. Games would suddenly freeze and stop working
and only a reboot would solve the problem. There were no patterns to the time it took before a freeze would occur.
After changing cables and doing all sort of things I finally tried resetting it to factory settings. Which solved all
issues I had with the drive. It's been working flawless ever since on two different motherboards.

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/...de-to-wiping-an-SSD-Reset-to-factory-defaults

I would recommend the PartedMagic method - the second method listed.
Thank you for replying Rusakova,
Yes, it's true, there are no patterns to the time before a freeze occurs. I've seen though that it happens when opening fresh installed programs and also when performing Window Updates, but that can be just a coincidence. I followed your link and post #62 mentions to use Samsung Magician, not sure if I should follow this path to be honest. The other methods have been proven to work for other brands.
On the other hand, I'm not sure if reset to factory settings, in this case "Secure Erase" would help, since the current FW on the drive is the only one that exists, there is no previous one.
Will investigate the "Secure Erase" tool within Samsung Magician, it tells me to create a Bootable USB. However, I think that I will have to pull out my good old OCZ and install Win7 on it as well, there's no way to format your OS drive if under use...

Cheers
 

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I have had a similar occurence on my current Intel Z170 platform and on my previous P67 rig as well. In both cases it was solved by enabling hotplug on sata ports where SSD was connected.
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
I have had a similar occurence on my current Intel Z170 platform and on my previous P67 rig as well. In both cases it was solved by enabling hotplug on sata ports where SSD was connected.
Hi Micko,
I can see the trick here, but is the Evo or any other ssd really hot pluggable ?
I could hotplug if I add this ssd as an additional storage component, on a running system.
The question remains on how to perform this, if the device I need to hot plug contains the OS itself.
I can only think of 2 ways :
1. Boot into BIOS with the ssd disconnected. Connect the ssd (power and data cable), hit F10 and pray.
2. Have an operating system installed on another drive, while Windows is running, add the Evo. Shut down. Disconnect the alternative drive, reconnect the Evo, and boot system...but then it's not a hot plugged device anymore, or?

Cheers

Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I just had an interesting read on the Crucial forum :
http://forums.crucial.com/t5/Crucia...vers-with-standard-Microsoft-SATA/ta-p/176373

In fact in the 2nd attachment of my first post, I can't see any AHCI drivers, it was enabled in BIOS though...
Where can I check which ahci driver is being used? And also, does AMD have updated drivers for each of their sockets or chipsets? Or is that rather the tasks of the mobo manufacturer? Cheers

Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk
 

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If I look at the Gigabyte page, they don't support Windows 10. Their ACHI drivers, for your board, are only supported up until Windows 8 x64.
So I think your best bet is to go with the Microsoft drivers, as mentioned in the crucial thread.
You can check in Device Manager under [ IDE / ATAPI controllers ] right click and select properties
https://extraimage.net/images/2018/05/14/a67c7a85ab798719f9523ace80f3bd2c.png
After selecting properties you can select the drivers tab and see who made the driver.
 

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Hi Micko,
I can see the trick here, but is the Evo or any other ssd really hot pluggable ?
I could hotplug if I add this ssd as an additional storage component, on a running system.
The question remains on how to perform this, if the device I need to hot plug contains the OS itself.
I can only think of 2 ways :
1. Boot into BIOS with the ssd disconnected. Connect the ssd (power and data cable), hit F10 and pray.
2. Have an operating system installed on another drive, while Windows is running, add the Evo. Shut down. Disconnect the alternative drive, reconnect the Evo, and boot system...but then it's not a hot plugged device anymore, or?

Cheers

Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk
Don't think it matters if the ssd is hot pluggable or not. You will keep using your computer as you did, nothing will be hot plugged while the computer is running. Just select this in BIOS for the sata port where your ssd is and test it for couple of hours.

For me, this is one of those fixes that doesn't make any sense, but it works. In Windows 7, only side effect is that your ssd may appear in system tray under "Safely remove hardware". Obviously, you won't ever click on it, and even if you did, windows wouldn't let you disconnect a system drive, so it is more of a visual annoyance than anything else.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Don't think it matters if the ssd is hot pluggable or not. You will keep using your computer as you did, nothing will be hot plugged while the computer is running. Just select this in BIOS for the sata port where your ssd is and test it for couple of hours.

For me, this is one of those fixes that doesn't make any sense, but it works. In Windows 7, only side effect is that your ssd may appear in system tray under "Safely remove hardware". Obviously, you won't ever click on it, and even if you did, windows wouldn't let you disconnect a system drive, so it is more of a visual annoyance than anything else.
Thanks Micko, I'll check this evening in the BIOS if I have this option :)
Cheers

Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter #13
If I look at the Gigabyte page, they don't support Windows 10. Their ACHI drivers, for your board, are only supported up until Windows 8 x64.
So I think your best bet is to go with the Microsoft drivers, as mentioned in the crucial thread.
You can check in Device Manager under [ IDE / ATAPI controllers ] right click and select properties
https://extraimage.net/images/2018/05/14/a67c7a85ab798719f9523ace80f3bd2c.png
After selecting properties you can select the drivers tab and see who made the driver.
Hi Rusakova,
Yes, in the end I did this. I could not find under the IDE /ATA /ATAPI section, exactly the mention to ahci, but I found the "Standard AHCI1.0 Serial ATA Controller"I and changed it on" Sata AMD Controller", reboot was required. Should I also change it on ATA Channel 0 & 1?.
It's true that the supported drivers are only available until Win8, but usually they are compatible with win 10.
I'll keep these changes, let's see if this keeps stable.
I have to say that the change of cable seems to have had some effect too. I had no visible freezes yesterday, but I was afk for a while as well, maybe they happened and I was not made aware.
I have one thing left to do, reinstall Win 7 with the old cable, maybe that does the trick.
Cheers

Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
*** SOLVED ***

Hi all,

I've been testing the PC for 48h now and I've had not a single random freeze any more.
The trick was to use Microsoft's Standard AHCI controller instead of the one provided by Gigabyte/AMD.
It wasn't the cable, because even with the old cable connected the freezes would keep happening.
I will update the solution on the first post, should anybody with the same platform (AM3) face the same issue.

Thank you all for your help and patience to get to the solution. I can now go ahead and install Win 10, the problem was isolated and hopefully can be amended in Win 10 as well.
I'll keep my eyes open on the Zen 3 evolution (7nm / microarchitecture) from Globalfoundries for a future build ;)

All the best,
Ken
 

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Thanks! :)

Thank you for sharing!! You saved my day. I tried min. 6 hours with Windows 7 install (different DVD, USB etc..) and sent a mail to the shop that I'll send the new SSD back. Finally I just did not let the AMD driver installer to put on its own AHCI driver, thats it.
I had a 870A-UD3 rev3.0 mobo with 1075T CPU... ( AND OCZ agility 3 120GB which I switched to 860 EVO :D )

Cheers,

Mark
 

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Hi All. Microsoft AHCI drivers seems not be a complete solution for this because of increasing the number of CRC errors in SMART when using.
 

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any update on this?

I have the 860 pro and sabertooth, same issues.
My 850 pro worked great.

Guess I'll be returning the drive.
 
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