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1-year restriction, yes. Send ENTERPRISE a PM and he'll alter your permissions to allow editing.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chunky_Chimp View Post

1-year restriction, yes. Send ENTERPRISE a PM and he'll alter your permissions to allow editing.
Why is this restriction in place on our own posts?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BradleyW View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chunky_Chimp View Post

1-year restriction, yes. Send ENTERPRISE a PM and he'll alter your permissions to allow editing.
Why is this restriction in place on our own posts?
We have had issues in the past with members who have decided to leave OCN for whatever reason who have also decided to delete their submitted content. This system is in place to help stop this from happening. While we have the ability to restore content, it can be a long task. With this new system we hope to limit the workload when it comes to restoring content.
 

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Sorry, but
Quote:
Originally Posted by ENTERPRISE View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by BradleyW View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chunky_Chimp View Post

1-year restriction, yes. Send ENTERPRISE a PM and he'll alter your permissions to allow editing.
Why is this restriction in place on our own posts?
We have had issues in the past with members who have decided to leave OCN for whatever reason who have also decided to delete their submitted content. This system is in place to help stop this from happening. While we have the ability to restore content, it can be a long task. With this new system we hope to limit the workload when it comes to restoring content.
Sorry, but why is user deleting everything over a year old any different from deleting everything less than a year old?
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Why should a user be able to delete anything more than a day old?

On the other hand, why should I not be able to edit my OP in "Ways to Better Cooling" thread to include more links to more information in the 'index' I've spent lots of time working on? Or edit post over a year old that need updating, like "Cooler Size and Clearance Comparison" (5/26/14) or "Cooler Cooling Comparison on 117-345watt CPU size heat source" (5/26/14) that need updating to include new cooler?

While this is my primary use forum, I'm active on others .. and often refer others to the above postings. Other forums have had me include my list of topics with links on their sites for member use .. meaning OCN get more hits as a result. They ask their members to read it here and post additional questions there, but still it helps OCN.
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I think this needs to only apply to threads that haven't been edited in 1 year. If someone is editing their thread on a weekly basis and then the thread becomes a year old, they lose their ability to edit it and then they have to continue asking for permission each week. That is very bad.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post

I think this needs to only apply to threads that haven't been edited in 1 year. If someone is editing their thread on a weekly basis and then the thread becomes a year old, they lose their ability to edit it and then they have to continue asking for permission each week. That is very bad.
Administrators / managers can make exceptions to the rule, which is okay by me. I can now edit mine.
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I know I'm a little crazy .. have to wonder about you sometimes.
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But for someone with a post count as big as mine trying to delete everything posted would require a total nut case. Just think how freaky nuts you would have to be to try deleting or editing your 69,463 post from Mini Sota?
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I just don't see a user deleting or editing their post as a significant problem. Maybe something happened I'm not aware of. I have packed up and left other forum when the controlling powers started acting like gods. But that is not a problem here or on any other reasonable forum.

A forum's strength is it's members. The administrator and moderators are not gods, but members who that on additional responsibility to help.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Administrators / managers can make exceptions to the rule, which is okay by me. I can now edit mine.
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I know I'm a little crazy .. have to wonder about you sometimes.
biggrin.gif

But for someone with a post count as big as mine trying to delete everything posted would require a total nut case. Just think how freaky nuts you would have to be to try deleting or editing your 69,463 post from Mini Sota?
biggrin.gif


I just don't see a user deleting or editing their post as a significant problem. Maybe something happened I'm not aware of. I have packed up and left other forum when the controlling powers started acting like gods. But that is not a problem here or on any other reasonable forum.

A forum's strength is it's members. The administrator and moderators are not gods, but members who that on additional responsibility to help.
This only applies to threads that you created, not all of your posts.

I didn't know that this was a problem though. The problem as stated is: "We have unfortunately had issues in the past where users have decided to remove what we consider valuable content that should be available to all for as long as possible."

No one ever said that people were deleting 100% of the content in their thread's OP.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

But for someone with a post count as big as mine trying to delete everything posted would require a total nut case. Just think how freaky nuts you would have to be to try deleting or editing your 69,463 post from Mini Sota?
biggrin.gif
There was one such case not long ago with a member with over 10k posts where they tried to wipe everything... I caught it after about 110 edits (all from recent posts so this new change wouldn't have helped). Not exactly light work.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoCables View Post

This only applies to threads that you created, not all of your posts.

I didn't know that this was a problem though. The problem as stated is: "We have unfortunately had issues in the past where users have decided to remove what we consider valuable content that should be available to all for as long as possible."

No one ever said that people were deleting 100% of the content in their thread's OP.
My post was based on what ENTERPRISE said in post #5 above
"We have had issues in the past with members who have decided to leave OCN for whatever reason who have also decided to delete their submitted content."
I understood 'delete their submitted content' as 'delete all posts.'

But honestly, why should someone be able to edit a post even a few days after they post it? Granted, they may have posted something incorrectly, but that's life. What we post on a forum is akin to what we say in a conversation. We can't go back and 'edit' what we say in a conversation, so why should be be able to do it here? I know, that is a rather extreme analogy, because many of the post are informational, meaning changing mistakes is content is a good thing, But how often is a mistake not found and corrected in fist week?

Also, how many years is most information relevant? Things change rapidly in this industry. Granted, not everything, but maybe the 'no edit / delete' should be from a few weeks to a year rather than over a year old ??

As for Chunky_Chimp
"a member with over 10k posts where they tried to wipe everything... I caught it after about 110 edits"
Not knowing the details, I don't know the user's intent or how many posts they would have ultimately deleted, but I seriously doubt it would have reached 1000, let alone 10,000.. And how do we know this member was in fact actually trying to wipe everything? I would thing a member in that scenario would start with what they considered their most important contributions, and once they were all deleted just leave.

i've moderated on forums in the past .. still do. My experience is members posting on a very active forum more than about 3,000 posts a year are usually general conversation with little important content. For example, I post approx. 3000 a year. Many of them are just talk with little or no real content.

Obviously this is a generalization so there are exceptions, but as a general rule any member leaving a forum and deleting their post is not going to make much of an impact on the forum. And if a forum is having many members with important content leaving and deleting, it's time for that forum to be taking a hard look at what is causing the migration, rather than 'sticking their finger in the ****' trying to stop it. The problem is not members deleting and leaving, but why members are are doing it..
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Changing horses here, but a 'Wiki' for each area might be a better way to store and organize important information. Problem is the logistics of setup and organization. Been there, done that, didn't like that t-shirt.
wink.gif
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Not knowing the details, I don't know the user's intent or how many posts they would have ultimately deleted, but I seriously doubt it would have reached 1000, let alone 10,000.. And how do we know this member was in fact actually trying to wipe everything? I would thing a member in that scenario would start with what they considered their most important contributions, and once they were all deleted just leave.
The observed rate of editing (a post every couple seconds) and the fact that it was done with total disregard as to what was in those posts, only seeming to care to move back from newest posts to oldest, indicated an intended clean-sweep of all content. I don't know how far he would have gone if I'd have left him alone but I didn't want to find out.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chunky_Chimp View Post

The observed rate of editing (a post every couple seconds) and the fact that it was done with total disregard as to what was in those posts, only seeming to care to move back from newest posts to oldest, indicated an intended clean-sweep of all content. I don't know how far he would have gone if I'd have left him alone but I didn't want to find out.
Okay, that would lead me to believe user was indeed mad (maybe even nuts) and trying to delete their posts.
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For the sake of discussion, why not let them delete them? And why is it 'okay' to edit / delete for a year, but not older posts? As a general rule i would think most posts less then a year old are more relevant tot most members than posts over a year old.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I just don't see many members posting information that is so important the forum would be hurt by it's loss.

On the other hand, you as a mod have the power to decide what posts to delete or edit. I assume there is no 1 year limit on your ability to edit or delete. So why should a member not have the same control over their own posts? On one forum I was a mod all of a members posts were deleted after banning them for life. Other forums I've worked with regular deleted posts over a certain age to keep storage at levels forum could afford.

We can discuss all of this here, but the reality of forums is the members have no rights .. none at all. Forums are their own little worlds with all power and control in the hands of the owners and leading staff, admin, mods. Forum hierarchy is the cyber equivalent of medieval kingdoms. Owner/s of the forum has total control over everything. There is no 'forum members rights tribunal' for a forum member to that a complaint to, no 'League of Forums' or 'United Forums' organizations working to give forum members any support against 'forum lords', 'forum pirates' etc. I'm not complaining, just saying how forums work.
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Some care more about their members and what is 'right and fair' than others. OCN is a good forum.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

For the sake of discussion, why not let them delete them? And why is it 'okay' to edit / delete for a year, but not older posts? As a general rule i would think most posts less then a year old are more relevant tot most members than posts over a year old.
Technical/logistical limitations. The only viable solution I know of to stymie that kind of behavior (which I won't mention) can't be done for a long time if ever for the same reason. As for "why not let them delete them?", it's strictly against the ToS. As for why it's against the ToS... I don't know. That rule's probably been around longer than I've been registered, and I've never really looked into it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

We can discuss all of this here, but the reality of forums is the members have no rights .. none at all. Forums are their own little worlds with all power and control in the hands of the owners and leading staff, admin, mods. Forum hierarchy is the cyber equivalent of medieval kingdoms. Owner/s of the forum has total control over everything. There is no 'forum members rights tribunal' for a forum member to that a complaint to, no 'League of Forums' or 'United Forums' organizations working to give forum members any support against 'forum lords', 'forum pirates' etc. I'm not complaining, just saying how forums work.
biggrin.gif
Some care more about their members and what is 'right and fair' than others. OCN is a good forum.
Indeed. It's the same deal any time the "1st amendment" argument is brought up. Websites are private entities that can set their own rules and guidelines on what can and can't be said/done. Basically, you can have all the free speech you want... within the rules. Break the rules you agreed to and that right doesn't really mean much.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chunky_Chimp View Post

Technical/logistical limitations. The only viable solution I know of to stymie that kind of behavior (which I won't mention) can't be done for a long time if ever for the same reason. As for "why not let them delete them?", it's strictly against the ToS. As for why it's against the ToS... I don't know. That rule's probably been around longer than I've been registered, and I've never really looked into it..
Server ToS or OCN ToS?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chunky_Chimp View Post

Indeed. It's the same deal any time the "1st amendment" argument is brought up. Websites are private entities that can set their own rules and guidelines on what can and can't be said/done. Basically, you can have all the free speech you want... within the rules. Break the rules you agreed to and that right doesn't really mean much.
I disagree only with 'Break the rules you agreed to' This 1 year limit on editing / deleting posts is a perfect example of a rule not agreed to. the 'Entity of OCN' decided to make a 1-year rule and now members of OCN have to live with it. No 'agreement' was ever made between 'entity' and 'members'.

For the benefit of others who may be reading this '1st amendment' refers to USA Constitution.
Quote:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. - See more at: http://constitution.findlaw.com/amendment1.html#sthash.IwkwirpY.dpuf
While many countries have some rights similar to this, few are as complete in their coverage or application. Now the 'USA PATRIOT actt' (Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism)" and it's use by organizations liek Homeland Security overrule many personal rights written in the consistutution. Basically, if they say your actions may be effecting the security of the USA you have few if any of the basic rights the constitution give people in USA
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Server ToS or OCN ToS?
OCN's, of course. I don't know of any sites where you agree to the host server's terms...
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

I disagree only with 'Break the rules you agreed to' This 1 year limit on editing / deleting posts is a perfect example of a rule not agreed to. the 'Entity of OCN' decided to make a 1-year rule and now members of OCN have to live with it. No 'agreement' was ever made between 'entity' and 'members'.
I was making a point relating to yours, what I said didn't have anything to do with the 1-year edit lock. That's a piece of site functionality, not a term to agree with. The related term is the one involving not mass-erasing one's own content. There is one inaccuracy, though, ticking the box "I agree" when you register tells us you read and agreed to the ToS even if you didn't actually read them, so you're still whacked when you break a rule. A real world example would be you getting pulled over and ticketed for talking on your phone while driving, and you telling the officer you didn't know it was against the law in that state. You'll still get the ticket because you still broke the rules. But let's not go too far down that rabbit hole, this isn't the thread for that.
 
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