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lololol
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
edit: live @ https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/zaunkoenig/zaunkoenig-m1k-worlds-first-carbon-fiber-gaming-mouse

oh, and without stupid holes all over the shell :thumb:

disclaimers:
1. i have had email correspondence with the few people involved in this for a few years
2. i have received 2 prototypes for free
3. the firmware is based off mine (and so is that of the ninox astrum...)

anyway, website:
https://zaunkoenig.co/

notes:
this apparently wasn't obvious, so i edited the title, but it is intended to be a pure fingertip grip mouse
3360 sensor
buttons debounce using latch method (or whatever it's called), so no delay on press or release
usb works up to 8000hz polling if you use the oc'd driver, otherwise 1000hz
no wheel (hopefully there will be in their future mice)
extremely short design intended for pure fingertip grips
best cable i've used on a mouse (https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/tensility-international-corp/30-00446/T1311-1-ND/5819495).
1 piece carbon fiber top shell

pics of the prototype i received:
 

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Set/release latch method would be the correct name as it refers to the transistor logic behind a flipflop circuit. the other terms are vague to the engineer, but more descriptive to the common mouser. It is a polished design, and looks like it has the potential to be popular among simpler fps games.
 

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No

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
 

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that's... uhh well it's cute and all but damn. even if I mostly fingertip I still like palming sometimes. hmm.
I think it's a fun project but this really could get some improvements wrt shape... even if it's just a small egg I feel it might help?
 

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mfw
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That is something.
 

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Neat. Though I think the carbon fiber is almost as bad a gimmick as a bunch of holes drilled in it. Yes, you get extra rigidity, but plastic is less dense than carbon fiber, and already strong enough. With carbon fiber you can make the shell thinner, but until you actually do so there isn't any weight savings.
 

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K but if they were gonna use carbon fiber anyway, couldn't they have just used a little more and made a bigger shell? ;-;
 

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lololol
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Discussion Starter #10
Neat. Though I think the carbon fiber is almost as bad a gimmick as a bunch of holes drilled in it. Yes, you get extra rigidity, but plastic is less dense than carbon fiber, and already strong enough. With carbon fiber you can make the shell thinner, but until you actually do so there isn't any weight savings.
they did make the shell very thin, around 0.8mm or something

carbon fiber is denser but as i understand should be stiffer for the same weight. whether the uniform carbon fiber shell is stronger or a plain abs shell (with reinforcements inside) of the same weight is the real question, and i'd bet on carbon

i stand by my opinion that holes are dumb 😄
 

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they did make the shell very thin, around 0.8mm or something

carbon fiber is denser but as i understand should be stiffer for the same weight. whether the uniform carbon fiber shell is stronger or a plain abs shell (with reinforcements inside) of the same weight is the real question, and i'd bet on carbon

i stand by my opinion that holes are dumb 😄
Yeah, I think 0.8mm is still too thick to make carbon fiber worthwhile, because it's about twice as dense as ABS, and 1.6mm thick ABS should be plenty stiff for a mouse. Given the difference in young's modulus, they should be looking to get the thickness down to more like 1/4 the thickness you'd use for plastic, or less.
 

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Take a PCB, add glides to bottom of it, put on a few switches with "levers" (a type of switch, OMRON, etc.) so you don't need extra shell for buttons or just make small finger sized buttons over the switch, add small finger sized hold point on both sides, done. No need for fancy shells :p Finger hold and glide around the PCB really.
 

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I want to get one of these in my hands so badly. For years I've obsessively analyzed physiology / pushing the boundaries of aiming. Reading their blog, it seems Patrick and Dominik have come to many of the same conclusions I have. Will be following this closely and would be very interested in a discussion with these guys.
 

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This is a promising start, but just two buttons and no wheel means offloading too many commands to the left hand in games, and having to switch to another mouse for non-gaming tasks.

Wheels are heavy, so the best path might be to add more buttons. Subdividing the top shell into 4 buttons would allow you to have both a dedicated MMB and, for those cases where MMB is bound to something, a scroll-mode button that sends wheel-up and wheel-down messages based on mouse movement (you see this on laptops sometimes, though it usually replaces MMB, which is non-ideal). Another possibility for adding buttons would be to put a thin squishy layer over the carbon sides with a set of membranes in between; this *would* add a bit of weight, but would also make the mouse more comfortable to use, and address concerns about potentially having to hold the mouse too tightly to deal with the smooth carbon surface. I used to own an R2 Omnimouse, with no wheel but four top buttons and three side membrane hotspots (on the right side, which makes sense: for fingertip grip, the mechanical grip you get from your thumb is too important to move it to press a button, so any buttons on that side would only be suitable for very low frequency commands), and, once I'd programmed it with a decent set of gestures, never found myself wishing it had a wheel.

Also: +1 for "holes are stupid". There's no way having the PCB be that exposed can be good for longevity!
 

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I want to get one of these in my hands so badly. For years I've obsessively analyzed physiology / pushing the boundaries of aiming. Reading their blog, it seems Patrick and Dominik have come to many of the same conclusions I have. Will be following this closely and would be very interested in a discussion with these guys.
Is this a pasta from Leddit.
 

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Capacitive "hidden" scroll wheel and MMB switch. Swipe the surface to scroll how far you want, tap to click. Maybe some mice have this already, like those crazy Apple etc. who knows, you don't get steps but who cares when you can program it so that in games 1 swipe no matter how long over a threshold = 1 step. More so games often ignore number of steps anyway and filter the user input heavily unfortunately.
 

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They need to just put out a lightweight glove that is ONLY omron switches scotch taped to the fingertips and a 3360 lazer to the palm all wired with really long thin wires to a pcb with a 1foot usb cable USB. dont ask where you tape the scroll wheel!
 
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