This is my first time doing a custom WC loop and I was wondering how bad is it too run a mixed metal set up. All my blocks and rads are all copper. However my barbs, compression, and a thin plate on my xspc razer waterblock has either stainless steel ,chrome or nickel. I was planning on running a pure distilled water + deadwater. Do I need to add corrosion inhibitor? I researched it and never got a clear answer. I prefer not to add a bunch of additives to the water.
Mixed metal in a custom loop
Earmufifn585
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This is my first time doing a custom WC loop and I was wondering how bad is it too run a mixed metal set up. All my blocks and rads are all copper. However my barbs, compression, and a thin plate on my xspc razer waterblock has either stainless steel ,chrome or nickel. I was planning on running a pure distilled water + deadwater. Do I need to add corrosion inhibitor? I researched it and never got a clear answer. I prefer not to add a bunch of additives to the water.
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well the risk is your blocks and rads can get corrosion. and in terms of algae just get a silver coil, that really all you need for that. but as of the metals im not entirly sure on. i think your xspc razer block is nickel. i havent seen a stainless steel water block before. but if you have aluminum im pretty sure you'll have problems.
sorry if im not much help im learning about custom water cooling as well.
sorry if im not much help im learning about custom water cooling as well.
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No aluminum, but the xspc razer has a stainless steel plate on top of the GPU cooper block. I am going to deadwater route for anti-growth because I don't want to add more metals to the loop.
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Redline water wetter can be picked up from almost anywhere. It has a corrosion inhibitor in it. Trust me when I say this. If you want all your bits to be nice and perfect like the day you got them, four years later, mix only brass and copper, copper sulfate as a biocide, and a little bit of water wetter. The water wetter won't have a negative effect on your system unless you over do it. If you do it perfectly you can even drop 1-2C. Goodluck
It would be rather unusual for watercooling blocks to be plated with or made of stainless steel, so it is most likely nickel although I'd think you could check what it is from the manufacturer's web page.
Otherwise, copper, brass, nickel, and to a lesser extent silver are effectively safe to mix because they only have small relative voltages on the anodic index, which is how metal compatibility is determined. That means that any galvanic reaction will be small and slow assuming your loop is normal (undamaged blocks and plating, non-reactive coolant, etc.). Over the expected lifetime of a standard loop, using those metals, there shouldn't be enough galvanic action to matter (again, assuming that the loop is properly maintained). On the other hand, Aluminum has a more significant relative voltage when matched with those other metals which makes the reactions more vigorous, and thus cause damage a lot faster.
edit: I quickly checked out XSPC's specs on the Razor block and it's not clear from the description or photos whether the stainless steel plate gets wet or not, maybe someone who owns one can shed light on that.
Otherwise, copper, brass, nickel, and to a lesser extent silver are effectively safe to mix because they only have small relative voltages on the anodic index, which is how metal compatibility is determined. That means that any galvanic reaction will be small and slow assuming your loop is normal (undamaged blocks and plating, non-reactive coolant, etc.). Over the expected lifetime of a standard loop, using those metals, there shouldn't be enough galvanic action to matter (again, assuming that the loop is properly maintained). On the other hand, Aluminum has a more significant relative voltage when matched with those other metals which makes the reactions more vigorous, and thus cause damage a lot faster.
edit: I quickly checked out XSPC's specs on the Razor block and it's not clear from the description or photos whether the stainless steel plate gets wet or not, maybe someone who owns one can shed light on that.
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I looked at that too, then how do people go about running fittings not the same metal as their rads/blocks just with distilled? I believe dead water is copper sulfate. I heard redline water wetter can crack acrylic. How about running propylene glycol? But I heard that also has it's problems.
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You will be fine with what you have listed. Just be sure to use common sense and do regular maintenance on your loop.
Fittings are usually nickel plated brass or painted brass, the SS plate is not a factor if it doesn't touch water, not a worry anyways as manufacturer's have been using stainless for a few years at least. See Heatkiller, Aquacomputer, & EK. I believe Dead water is copper sulfate. Could go the PHN nuke route.
What kind of radiators did you get? Make sure to do a proper flushing of them to get all of the manufacturing debris / soldering flux out of them before putting into use. This is where I believe, alot of people's problems arise from. As the above chart illustrates, since the different manufacturers do not list the type of solder used in their rads. With the exception of the Aquacomputer modularity system radiators which don't use soldering at all in these rads due to different design. When you think you've flushed them good enough, do it some more, just search "the rad dance" for more info.
Good luck, remember the dumb question is the one you didn't ask.
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Fittings are usually nickel plated brass or painted brass, the SS plate is not a factor if it doesn't touch water, not a worry anyways as manufacturer's have been using stainless for a few years at least. See Heatkiller, Aquacomputer, & EK. I believe Dead water is copper sulfate. Could go the PHN nuke route.
What kind of radiators did you get? Make sure to do a proper flushing of them to get all of the manufacturing debris / soldering flux out of them before putting into use. This is where I believe, alot of people's problems arise from. As the above chart illustrates, since the different manufacturers do not list the type of solder used in their rads. With the exception of the Aquacomputer modularity system radiators which don't use soldering at all in these rads due to different design. When you think you've flushed them good enough, do it some more, just search "the rad dance" for more info.
Good luck, remember the dumb question is the one you didn't ask.
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Nothing will beat flushing and cleaning every few months. But if your still interested in being able to do longer runs http://www.overclockers.com/pc-water-coolant-chemistry-part-ii/
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I defiantly do a lot of maintenance, maybe once every 2 months. My rads is a Alphacool ST30 which is full copper and a XSPC EX240 which is a brass/copper. I will take a look into the chemistry article to get a better idea of what I need to do. Are automotive coolant harmful to plastics?
"Although we have used an acrylic top for aesthetics we have a thin stainless steel plate between the copper base and the acrylic. This allows us to use LED lighting, while keeping the strength and reliability of an all metal waterblock."
Quoted form XSPC. They have the stainless steel plate basically being the top for the block. So it contacts the water and even touches the copper physically I think .
http://shop.xs-pc.com/xsp/XSPC-Razor-GTX690_31722.html
"Although we have used an acrylic top for aesthetics we have a thin stainless steel plate between the copper base and the acrylic. This allows us to use LED lighting, while keeping the strength and reliability of an all metal waterblock."
Quoted form XSPC. They have the stainless steel plate basically being the top for the block. So it contacts the water and even touches the copper physically I think .
http://shop.xs-pc.com/xsp/XSPC-Razor-GTX690_31722.html
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The stainless steel plate kinda sounds like a decorative piece imo
As of antifreeze Idk I'm sure your blocks would be OK but your tubing is another story. Depends what there made of. If they can't handle the chemical then it could lead to problems also the pump could be ruined as well.
But antifreeze is mostly made of water and glycol. I wouldn't trust it still if it'll work.
As of antifreeze Idk I'm sure your blocks would be OK but your tubing is another story. Depends what there made of. If they can't handle the chemical then it could lead to problems also the pump could be ruined as well.
But antifreeze is mostly made of water and glycol. I wouldn't trust it still if it'll work.
The stainless steel plate is functional and not just decorative. It is made of high content chromium for corrosion resistance, which places it next to copper on a galvanic scale.
Granted, this is for the GTX680 Razor, but the construction is identical. Let's you take a peek inside of the waterblock
http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/XSPC-Razor-GTX680-Water-Block-Review/Water-Block-Deconstructed
Granted, this is for the GTX680 Razor, but the construction is identical. Let's you take a peek inside of the waterblock
http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/XSPC-Razor-GTX680-Water-Block-Review/Water-Block-Deconstructed
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Different allows will have different mixtures, different metals, different casting techniques, and a whole mess of varieties.
The thing about matching steel in your loop is there are a LOT of different alloys, and even then most alloys can be then categorizes as "passive" or "active" which have two completely different electrode potentials so even the exact same alloy can have different SEPs.
I can guarantee you if EK uses steel in their block it's fine. They do all their R&D, beta testing, etc. and they're not going to put a product on the market that will not only muck up their reputation but also loose them tons of $$ in RMAs. In fact the EK Supremacy uses a stainless steel injection plate and that's one of the most popular CPU blocks on the market. Have you ever opened your pump up? The impellers housing is usually stainless steel.
In short I wouldn't worry about a product that has stainless steel so long as it's from a PC liquid cooling company. Trying to use your own steel things, or using something not designed for liquid cooling might yield some catastrophic results but if a major PC liquid cooling manufacturer is using in their products they've already done all the research and safety testing.
Made of chromium? Not sure where you go that info but it's pretty wack. Chromium is it's own element entirely. The plate is stainless steel, stainless steel is an alloy consisting primarily of iron, nickle, and chromium usually. So yeah it has chromium in it but typically only around 10% depending on the specific alloy.Originally Posted by Buzz247
The stainless steel plate is functional and not just decorative. It is made of high content chromium for corrosion resistance, which places it next to copper on a galvanic scale.
Granted, this is for the GTX680 Razor, but the construction is identical. Let's you take a peek inside of the waterblock
http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/XSPC-Razor-GTX680-Water-Block-Review/Water-Block-Deconstructed
Different allows will have different mixtures, different metals, different casting techniques, and a whole mess of varieties.
The thing about matching steel in your loop is there are a LOT of different alloys, and even then most alloys can be then categorizes as "passive" or "active" which have two completely different electrode potentials so even the exact same alloy can have different SEPs.
I can guarantee you if EK uses steel in their block it's fine. They do all their R&D, beta testing, etc. and they're not going to put a product on the market that will not only muck up their reputation but also loose them tons of $$ in RMAs. In fact the EK Supremacy uses a stainless steel injection plate and that's one of the most popular CPU blocks on the market. Have you ever opened your pump up? The impellers housing is usually stainless steel.
In short I wouldn't worry about a product that has stainless steel so long as it's from a PC liquid cooling company. Trying to use your own steel things, or using something not designed for liquid cooling might yield some catastrophic results but if a major PC liquid cooling manufacturer is using in their products they've already done all the research and safety testing.
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and yes typically OTC stainless is 10% - but it can be as high as 18% for specific usages. Psst... never said it was "made" of chromium - said it was stainless steel in the first line and "high content chromium... slow down there sparky
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ok so you didn't like the wording but that is exactly what "high content" means in alloy metals. It is a stainless steel with a high content of chromium for corrosion inhibition.... better?Originally Posted by ZytheEKS
Made of chromium? Not sure where you go that info but it's pretty wack. Chromium is it's own element entirely. The plate is stainless steel, stainless steel is an alloy consisting primarily of iron, nickle, and chromium usually. So yeah it has chromium in it but typically only around 10% depending on the specific alloy. .
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Too bad they didn't put that R&D budget into their nickle process awhile back.... *snickers*Originally Posted by ZytheEKS
I can guarantee you if EK uses steel in their block it's fine. They do all their R&D, beta testing, etc. and they're not going to put a product on the market that will not only muck up their reputation but also loose them tons of $$ in RMAs. In fact the EK Supremacy uses a stainless steel injection plate and that's one of the most popular CPU blocks on the market. Have you ever opened your pump up? The impellers housing is usually stainless steel.
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My bad, must have read it a little too fast.Originally Posted by Buzz247
ok so you didn't like the wording but that is exactly what "high content" means in alloy metals. It is a stainless steel with a high content of chromium for corrosion inhibition.... better?and yes typically OTC stainless is 10% - but it can be as high as 18% for specific usages. Psst... never said it was "made" of chromium - said it was stainless steel in the first line and "high content chromium... slow down there sparky![rolleyessmileyanim.gif]( "rolleyessmileyanim.gif")
![tongue.gif]( "tongue.gif")
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That issue was/is not exclusive to EK.Originally Posted by Buzz247
Too bad they didn't put that R&D budget into their nickle process awhile back.... *snickers*
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I looked over the chart again but stainless steel is more dissimiliar to copper than aluminum is.
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Think you misread.... look right below copper listing.. at 18% and 12% chromium corrosion resistant stainless steel... then go further down to find aluminumOriginally Posted by Earmufifn585
I looked over the chart again but stainless steel is more dissimiliar to copper than aluminum is.
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NEXT!
ya I know - but couldn't resist lol I have ... issues with EK in general (well I have issues in general but trying to stay on topic here lol) You do have to admit, the handling of the problem is what gave EK such a bad rap for awhile there (IMHO still but that is a different matter) Why are we discussing EK anyway - this is a XSPC block in questionOriginally Posted by ZytheEKS
That issue was/is not exclusive to EK.
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Even then that table only lists a single type of stainless steel.
http://metals.about.com/od/Corrosion/a/Galvanic-Corrosion.htm
This table is done with sea water so the differences are much more exaggerated, but brings me back to my point: There are lots of stainless steel alloys with MANY different electrode potentials.
No, iron is. Iron =! [does not equal] stainless steel.Originally Posted by Earmufifn585
I looked over the chart again but stainless steel is more dissimiliar to copper than aluminum is.
Even then that table only lists a single type of stainless steel.
http://metals.about.com/od/Corrosion/a/Galvanic-Corrosion.htm
This table is done with sea water so the differences are much more exaggerated, but brings me back to my point: There are lots of stainless steel alloys with MANY different electrode potentials.
Rather than wildly speculating, I shot off an email to a contact I have used at XSPC before asking specifically what Type of stainless is used and chromium content. Hopefully not one of those "corporate secret" things and will get a reply that is useful for this thread. Usually hear back within 24hours on questions like this. I have good confidence it is a passive level steel being used. Be silly if not...
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