The point of 4090 vs 4090-OC

Jimbodiah · Oct 19, 2022

I've seen some reviews of the 4090 OC versions, but they all perform the same as the non-OC FE version. As far as I understand they all have the same voltage and power limits, so what is the point of these cards except spending $500-600 more for the same?

Please enlighten me. Are there somehow different limits to frequency settings?

yt93900 · Oct 19, 2022

Brand and looks this time mostly, and of course - us being stupid enough to pay the premium.
Some do run a bit cooler/quieter though. There are just a few (one?) bit worse models that are locked at 450-480W.

HeadlessKnight · Oct 19, 2022

Build quality is not the same between cards. Many are more expensive but are worse than the FE, like the MSI and Zotac cards that have less max PL than Nvidia's FE which will handicap the performance. Sure it could be possible (?) to flash those power limited cards with the FE bios, but if you got unlucky and the card decided to brick while the non-original BIOS is installed on it, you will end up with a useless $1700+ paperweight as your warranty is void.

yt93900 · Oct 19, 2022

I wouldn't call a card with lower PL 'worse' than an FE as such just because it has a lower PL. That said, a bricked can be revived in a different PC when installed as a secondary GPU, just select the correct GPU and re-flash.

HeadlessKnight · Oct 19, 2022

yt93900 said:
I wouldn't call a card with lower PL 'worse' than an FE as such just because it has a lower PL. That said, a bricked can be revived in a different PC when installed as a secondary GPU, just select the correct GPU and re-flash.

It is not as simple as you make it out to be. The card could brick in a non-recoverable state. Not to mention the possibility of hardware failure especially if the card only supports 3x 8 pins and got flashed with 4x 8 pins bios.

Jimbodiah · Oct 19, 2022

haven't seen the FE here, just the OC aib models and the non-oc windforcewhich is also the cheapest at €2200.

bhav · Oct 19, 2022

Some time ago I went through two KFA2 GTX 970 OC editions. The factory overclock on them was 1225 Mhz.

The first barely OCed anymore, and extra 10 mhz or so and died after a while. The second wouldn't even run at the stock 1225 Mhz and needed to be underclocked to 1215 and also died. They replaced it with a 980 non OC with blower cooler.

From what I thought,. they never tested the OCs, they just slapped the OC bios onto any 970 and shipped them out, whether they could manage it or not.

Now with the last several generations of GPUs, stock OC cards are pointless because they all boost based on temps. The stock OCs they do sell on those versions usually arent even very much to be worth it, and as was my experience with the KFA2 cards, I doubt they even do any testing or binning on GPUs.

Theres not much point to buying factory OC GPUs anymore.

NattyKathy · Oct 19, 2022

Judging by at least the past few generations of NV GPUs, the point of OC vs non-OC cards seems to be that manufacturers can have a "non-OC" version at MSRP and an "OC" version that's completely identical except for a different BIOS with +50Mhz on the core and costs $100-$200 more. They can then say they have cards "at MSRP" while only really making an effort to distribute the "OC" versions that cost more than MSRP. Then they can price even higher the "premium" version that actually has an upgraded VRM and cooler because the baseline has been raised.
I think RTX 2000 was when I really noticed this behavior getting out of hand with regard to effect on price tiers (thanks to NV enforcing binning and OC thru different chip revisions) but it's been going on as long as I can remember.
FWIW, ASUS, MSI, and Zotac seem to be the worst offenders with the 4090, especially ASUS. Checking MC prices, the "non-OC" TUF is MSRP at $1599 while the "OC" version with identical hardware and a pitiful margain-of-error boost increase is $1799. Hilarious.

Jimbodiah · Oct 19, 2022

I wish we had those prices. Add $1000 to that, insane.

Was kind of affraid of this, the oc being the same gpu in essence. Gotta score a FE somewhere.

Mad Pistol · Oct 19, 2022

OC is roughly within 100 Mhz between GPUs, and it all seems to be down to silicon lottery.

Bear in mind... that's 100Mhz at or around 3Ghz... 100Mhz is about 3%.

Jimbodiah · Oct 19, 2022

The OC cards are all within 3-4fps of the FE doing around 200fps. Not sure I want to pay €600 extra for that.

Imglidinhere · Oct 19, 2022

Jimbodiah said:
I've seen some reviews of the 4090 OC versions, but they all perform the same as the non-OC FE version. As far as I understand they all have the same voltage and power limits, so what is the point of these cards except spending $500-600 more for the same?

Please enlighten me. Are there somehow different limits to frequency settings?

It's not like the good old days where there was more silicon lottery and actual differences between each GPU, but nowadays there's little difference.

Jimbodiah · Oct 19, 2022

OK, thanks for clearing this up.

bhav · Oct 19, 2022

Also yea the reason I bought those KFA2 970s was they were overspecified with phases, vrms and what not.

They pump up all those useless features onto the PCB and charge more, but the GPU hasn't likely been binned.

I just buy the FE now because they look the nicest, can't be bothered with all the fancy MEGA GAMER EDITION RED GREEN BLUE TURQUOISE EXTRA FANS PENTA SLOT 1 METRE LONG editions.

In terms of binning GPUs, nvidia are likely already keeping the best for the FEs, overclock results between FE and AIBs arent even much different.

Jimbodiah · Oct 19, 2022

I will end up putting a water block on it anyway, so the cooler will end up in a closet somewhere, and than after 10 years when I find it again it will go into the trash bin

EastCoast · Oct 19, 2022

Jimbodiah said:
I've seen some reviews of the 4090 OC versions, but they all perform the same as the non-OC FE version. As far as I understand they all have the same voltage and power limits, so what is the point of these cards except spending $500-600 more for the same?

Please enlighten me. Are there somehow different limits to frequency settings?

Now you understand why EVGA got out.

Jimbodiah · Oct 19, 2022

Yeah, they make zero on the msrp version, so without the OC one there is no reason to even sell them.

ZealotKi11er · Oct 19, 2022

Most people would buy FE if they could. For Air its fine. IF you want to go water it also cheaper so u can spend the money on WB. It also does 600w.

airisom2 · Oct 19, 2022

NV cards used to be heavily power limited, but with the 4090 power isn't the issue but instead voltage which is locked. Therefore, all of the cards are going to perform within a percent or two of each other overall until voltage modification a la elmor evc is available. You might be able to squeeze out a bin or 2 lower temps with the CLC 4090s, but real-world performance looks to be the same for all of them.

These cards need more voltage, and I don't think it's a coincidence that a theoretical 4090Ti could use up that extra power generally not being used. So, I'm sitting back with some popcorn for now to see how it unfolds.

dagget3450 · Oct 20, 2022

airisom2 said:
NV cards used to be heavily power limited, but with the 4090 power isn't the issue but instead voltage which is locked. Therefore, all of the cards are going to perform within a percent or two of each other overall until voltage modification a la elmor evc is available. You might be able to squeeze out a bin or 2 lower temps with the CLC 4090s, but real-world performance looks to be the same for all of them.

These cards need more voltage, and I don't think it's a coincidence that a theoretical 4090Ti could use up that extra power generally not being used. So, I'm sitting back with some popcorn for now to see how it unfolds.

This is exactly whats coming, right around the corner a 4090ti - Honestly kind of surprised most people haven't really figured this out. I think NVIDIA believes most people have short OH LOOK SQUIRREL! Really cool, .... what was i talking about?

The point of 4090 vs 4090-OC

Jimbodiah

yt93900

HeadlessKnight

yt93900

HeadlessKnight

Jimbodiah

bhav

NattyKathy

Jimbodiah

Mad Pistol

Jimbodiah

Imglidinhere

Jimbodiah

bhav

Jimbodiah

EastCoast

Jimbodiah

ZealotKi11er

airisom2

dagget3450

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