is X3D chiplet on 7950X3D better binned overall than on 7800X3D?

Wolverine2349 · Mar 12, 2023

I know on the 12 and 16 core parts, at least one chiplet was better binned than on the 6 and 8 core counterparts with Ryzen 5000 and 7000 series.

Do you think same applies to 3D cache chiplet being better binned than it will be on 7800X3D and thus if you disable non 3D chiplet you will on average get better clocks and thermals and more performance for same power usage than on a 7800X3D?

Am I correct in the thinking that disabling CCD1 turns 7950X3d into a 7800X3D and better binned?? And disabling CCD0 the 3D cache one turns it into a 7700X perhaps a worse binned one if you believe results at TechPowerUp where the CCD0 disabled turning it into a 7700X performed a little worse than the actual 7700X

Ryzen 7950X3D with One CCD Disabled - The 7800X3D Preview

Ryzen 7 7800X3D will be the most affordable Zen 4 X3D processor, but it doesn't release until April. We reconfigured the Ryzen 9 7950X3D to match the specs of the 7800X3D and ran it through our test suite, which includes 14 games at 720p, 1080p, 1440p and 4K. Results are impressive.

www.techpowerup.com

Blameless · Mar 12, 2023

I doubt there is a significant binning difference and if there was, it would be in favor of lower leakage, which may or may not be 'better' depending on one's expectations. Lower leakage parts will be less thermally limited with mundane cooling, but tend not to scale as far if given room to stretch their legs.

Anyway, it's impossible to say with any confidence until the 7800X3D is released and there are enough samples being tested for a large scale comparison.

Wolverine2349 · Mar 12, 2023

Blameless said:
I doubt there is a significant binning difference and if there was, it would be in favor of lower leakage, which may or may not be 'better' depending on one's expectations. Lower leakage parts will be less thermally limited with mundane cooling, but tend not to scale as far if given room to stretch their legs.

Anyway, it's impossible to say with any confidence until the 7800X3D is released and there are enough samples being tested for a large scale comparison.

Which would probably have lower leakage? And do you think the 7800X3D will just have the 3dCache chiplet only physically on the die, or will it also have a defective and thus disabled 6 or 8 core non-3D chiplet?

I know in the past that 5950X had better thermals than 5800X as t was dual chiplet and easier to cool. Would same apply to 7950X3D with non 3D chiplet disabled meaning 3D chiplet easier to cool than 7800X3D?

Really my birthday is in 12 days and I so do not want to wait for 7800X3D in 1 month. But I only want 8 cores with 3D VCACHE.

Why oh why AMD did you not just release the 7800X3D when the others were and charge a markup for it and just forgo the 7900X3D. I mean these are gaming chips and like almost no game benefits from more than 8 cores. I doubt productivity gurus are going to buy the 7950X3D nor 7900X3D over the regular parts given they are worse in most productivity benchmarks anyways. Its gaming centric.

But if 79050X3D VCache chiplet is truly overall on average better binned than 7800X3D and/or runs cooler due to dual chiplet design even with 2nd non 3D chiplet BIOS level disabled, I can justify paying the premium to not having to wait.

ZealotKi11er · Mar 12, 2023

I have seen 7950x3d CC0 runs at 5.2, while 7800x3d is 5.0.

simonabamber · Mar 12, 2023

nobody knows as the chip isn't out yet.

Wolverine2349 · Mar 12, 2023

ZealotKi11er said:
I have seen 7950x3d CC0 runs at 5.2, while 7800x3d is 5.0.

Yeah that was mentioned in TechPowetUp review.

On AMD specs it says boost for 7800X3D up to 5GHz. How often is that accurate and is it often better than stated.

Though AMD mentions 5.7GHz for 7900X3D and 7950x3d but of course we all know that is non 3d ccd1 which of course they will advertise.

Is there any official spec or doc on x3d CCD0 on 7900x3d and 7950x3d from AMD regarding base and boost clock?

This is a hat. · Mar 13, 2023

The 7800X3D can also bump up to 5250Mz with a positive 200+, and is expected to be about 1% better in games due to the single cache die.

Edit : This result is an estimate that anyone with a 7950X3D can easily test.
I doubt anyone has a 7800X3D at this point.

Paradigm Shifter · Mar 13, 2023

I understand enthusiasm, but crystal balls don't work, and anyone with the knowledge will be under NDA.

Wolverine2349 · Mar 13, 2023

This is a hat. said:
The 7800X3D can also bump up to 5250Mz with a positive 200+, and is expected to be about 1% better in games due to the single cache die.

Edit : This result is an estimate that anyone with a 7950X3D can easily test.

Though if at the BIOS level you disable the non cache CCD, it is already a single cache die and should behave no differently. No different than if AMD or TSMC disabled the other CCD before shipping it correct?

This is a hat. · Mar 13, 2023

Wolverine2349 said:
Though if at the BIOS level you disable the non cache CCD, it is already a single cache die and should behave no differently. No different than if AMD or TSMC disabled the other CCD before shipping it correct?

As mentioned earlier, this is just an estimate, and the 1% claim is based on testing (Soulseeker) core parking vs. cash die.

Wolverine2349 · Mar 13, 2023

This is a hat. said:
As mentioned earlier, this is just an estimate, and the 1% claim is based on testing (Soulseeker) core parking vs. cash die.
View attachment 2604857

Wel yeah an estimate, but core parking and disabling one CCD are not the same. I mean disabling the 2nd non-3D CCD in the BIOS makes the 7950X3D no different in its function at any level than a 7800X3D but perhaps a better binned 3D cache chiplet usually though some variance with TSMC 5nm chiplet silicon lottery? Does it not? I mean what difference is there.

This is a hat. · Mar 13, 2023

Wolverine2349 said:
Wel yeah an estimate, but core parking and disabling one CCD are not the same. I mean disabling the 2nd non-3D CCD in the BIOS makes the 7950X3D no different in its function at any level than a 7800X3D but perhaps a better binned 3D cache chiplet usually though some variance with TSMC 5nm chiplet silicon lottery? Does it not? I mean what difference is there.

That tester is saying something a little different.
"He says that there is no difference in the 3DCash chiplets and there is no advantage to the 7950X3D, so they may have delayed the release of the 7800X3D on purpose.
In any case, it appears that all 3DCash dies on the 7000X3D are limited to 1.1v and 5250Mhz.

simonabamber · Mar 13, 2023

my 7900X3D will not go above 5150mhz no matter what CO/OC settings I try. It's a hard limit

(ignoring eCLK)

GoldPunchTR · Mar 13, 2023

Is it 100% certain that 7800x3d will perform better then 7950x3d in gaming?

ZealotKi11er · Mar 13, 2023

GoldPunchTR said:
Is it 100% certain that 7800x3d will perform better then 7950x3d in gaming?

In theory once AMD/Microsoft figure out their stuff it should not perform better.

ozlay · Mar 13, 2023

This is a hat. said:
The 7800X3D can also bump up to 5250Mz with a positive 200+, and is expected to be about 1% better in games due to the single cache die.

Edit : This result is an estimate that anyone with a 7950X3D can easily test.
I doubt anyone has a 7800X3D at this point.

How can it be easily tested? It has a smaller cache size.

Wolverine2349 · Mar 13, 2023

This is a hat. said:
That tester is saying something a little different.
"He says that there is no difference in the 3DCash chiplets and there is no advantage to the 7950X3D, so they may have delayed the release of the 7800X3D on purpose.
In any case, it appears that all 3DCash dies on the 7000X3D are limited to 1.1v and 5250Mhz.

Well so in that case disabling the 2nd CCD on 7950X makes it behave with 0 difference than 7800X3D then? Or is there any advantage the 7800X3D has over 7950X3D with 2nd non-cache CCD disabled in BIOS per the tester?? Like is one physical CCD have an advantage over 2 even if one is electronically disabled through the BIOS.

And yeah ticks me off so much AMD would delay 7800X3D. I mean why oh why did they even release a 7900X3D with only 6 core 3D cache chiplet.

Everyone and their mother knows almost every game in existence does not get any benefit from more than 8 cores so why did they even release dual chiplet versions of this when they already have the regular 7900X and 7950X non 3D that are better for productivity anyways. And for multi purpose system users the non 3D cache chips are still good at gaming. The 3D cache chips are gaming chips and games do not use more than 8 cores. You cannot have both in one as seen by how much better performance gets when shutting down the non-3D cache 2nd CCD on 7950X and how it improves gaming performance be a solid or even dramatic amount has shown.

Blameless · Mar 13, 2023

The answer to every 'why' regarding what's released and when is 'because it makes more money that way'.

Those that want an AM5 V-cache part now will drop for the 7950X3D or even 7900X3D, which have higher margins than the 7800X3D will.

Wolverine2349 said:
You cannot have both in one as seen by how much better performance gets when shutting down the non-3D cache 2nd CCD on 7950X and how it improves gaming performance be a solid or even dramatic amount has shown.

There is no or negligible performance improvement if things are properly scheduled, which for most games on most setups only requires using the most recent firmware, the most recent Windows builds, and the most recent AMD drivers.

A 7950X3D is well suited to gamers who do other things than gaming and are willing to pay for nearly the best of both worlds, without the power/cooling requirements of a 13900KS.

rv8000 · Mar 13, 2023

Unless you exclusively play games, the 7950X3D and 7900X3D are better CPUs.

The difference is likely to be negligible outside of one to two oddball games. The main advantage of the 7800X3D is it won’t have any issues with scheduling as there’s no opportunity to jump between CCDs.

TLDR: If you only play games, wait for the 7800X3D. If you do other things as well, the 12/16 core 3D SKUs are better. It’s as simple as that.

This is a hat. · Mar 14, 2023

simonabamber said:
my 7900X3D will not go above 5150mhz no matter what CO/OC settings I try. It's a hard limit

(ignoring eCLK)

Some argue that you need to disable ram overclocking and apply CO first to find the maximum.

is X3D chiplet on 7950X3D better binned overall than on 7800X3D?

Ryzen 7950X3D with One CCD Disabled - The 7800X3D Preview

Wolverine2349

Ryzen 7950X3D with One CCD Disabled - The 7800X3D Preview

Blameless

Wolverine2349

ZealotKi11er

simonabamber

Wolverine2349

This is a hat.

Paradigm Shifter

Wolverine2349

This is a hat.

Wolverine2349

This is a hat.

simonabamber

GoldPunchTR

ZealotKi11er

ozlay

Wolverine2349

Blameless

rv8000

This is a hat.

Top Contributors this Month

Recommended Communities