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Why do AIO not use copper rads???

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dansi

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Instead they chose aluminium which cheapens the look and feel of things.

Lowering performance and chance of bad metal reaction.

Wont mind if they raise srp by $10-20 but you get a nice middle ground full copper/brass setup. .
 
#6 ·
Price point...

Doesn't make too much sense for a CLC to be honest.
 
#9 ·
They're not really marketed to enthusiasts and most of them are rebadged asetek and most people don't know the difference or care.

So from a business standpoint, little competition and a largely uneducated customer base gives them little reason to improve... Kind of like telecom

Edit: swiftech is making the biggest competition with the h---x series having a nice block and decent copper rad
 
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#11 ·
Keeps them at the most profitable price point. It's all based on what the majority of consumers are willing to pay. With more expensive aio units just pushing the price up even $30 more puts you at the low end of a diy custom loop. Someone did the math so this is what you get and honestly they do a pretty fantastic job as is for the price paid
 
#12 ·
It could be because of galvanic corrosion and preventive measures like anticorrosion additives ultimately failing in the lifetime of the unit. Additives increase the viscosity of water, reducing pump performance even in the short term and form biomass precipitates in the loop in the long term(bio-fouling), whether diluted a bit too much, or worked at high temperature which is ironic considering the application; resulting in the additive's failure, hence the epiphany that it is rather a tool of planned obsolescence rather than a preventive measure for galvanic corrosion, nonetheless.
Copper reacts violently to aluminum, so unless they design for an all around copper concept - which they might have trouble finding compatible sealants & screws that won't react galvanically since copper is malleable and not tough enough - the design is more reliable in the prospect of an absence of any galvanic corrosion whatsoever than not, since pure water + %100 aluminum(or %100 copper) heatsinks turn out to be both more heat capacious & also more reliable in the long term.
Dow Chemicals - Dispelling the Myths of Heat Transfer
 
#13 ·
By using a glycol coolant, which costs them pennies, they can pretty easily get 2-3 years if not more life out of their closed loop AIOs with mixed metals of alu and copper / brass before it would get bad enough to actually cause a performance issue, which is long enough to outlast their warranty period. Like almost everything made these days, they are making them as cheaply as they can get away with, and have little interest in creating something with a longevity that might actually hurt future repeat / replacement sales. They just need their products to last just long enough that their customer's minimum lifespan expectations are met. Designing them to last longer than that would be counter-productive to their bottom line.
 
#14 ·
I see these questions time and time again. Aluminum rads SUCK. the outer casing is some sort of magnetic material as my magnets stick to it easily. If you want proof that rads are all aluminum on the inside have a look at this thread I posted a while ago.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1524762/what-is-inside-an-aio-rad/0_20

This is mostly done to keep costs down and profits up. If AIO units cost $180+ most of these users would do the work needed to throw a custom loop together, which even with cheap parts out performs and out lasts most AIO units I have had experience with.
The only AIO unit i recommend lately is the swiftech h220x
 
#15 ·
Before you assume aluminum rads suck, you better pay attention to what materials are inside a DIY radiator as well as the soldering joint.

Copper is about double the conductivity of Aluminum.

BUT..

Aluminum is also about double that of Brass

http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/thermal-conductivity-d_429.html

Since most watercooling radiators have brass tubes and use solder for the brass to copper fin connection, your net conductivity is not all that different than all aluminum. Not sure what solder difference is but since most radiators are now ROHS compliant, I would assume the solder is mostly TIN which is an even worse conductor than brass.

Aluminum can perform well, it's lower in cost, and lighter in weight. The automotive industry and most motorized cooling is built with all aluminum rads.

the big downside is of coarse needing some hefty corrosion blocker to slow the corrosion process. Since many DIY wstercoolers still run plain distilled systems and copper blocks are the standard, it onlybmakes sense to match similar materials to minimize the corrosion risk. Of coarse all copper tubes/fins is best for conductivity, copper is also pretty soft and expensive.

The sealed AIO have complete control over the coolant they put in there, so naturally they can ensure corrosion is part of the design and aluminum is a good option.

Copper fins are better than aluminum fins but aluminum tubes are better than brass tubes.....

I haven't tested myself nor seen too much for back to back aluminum vs copper/brass rad testing but I bet it's pretty darn close. I know the old H220 vs H100 test I ran was pretty darn close once you mounted equal fans but that didn't isolate to just the rads. Would be interesting to see how A Koolance aluminum rad does compared to a copper/brass.
 
Discussion starter · #16 ·
Interesting point about the copper/brass rads that permeate the industry martin!

Would be a hell of test between alu vs copper/brass vs full copper rads!

i think alphacool/phobya do sell full copper rad!
 
#17 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by dansi View Post

Interesting point about the copper/brass rads that permeate the industry martin!

Would be a hell of test between alu vs copper/brass vs full copper rads!

i think alphacool/phobya do see full copper rad!
Click to expand...
Yeah alphacool does use all copper construction, and they're really no better than high quality copper/brass rads like the Black Ice SR/GTX or the EK XTX/XTC rads

(actually the new Nemesis GTX and SR2 beat the Nexxos UT60 and even Monsta slightly in their respective rpm optimized zones and the EK ones are about tied as well. So all copper makes little difference honestly, not to undermine martin who is right about the thermal of the metals. It's just that metal construction isn't the end all be all of rad performance. Number of cores, fpi, thickness, paint used, fin design, construction "quality" etc.. all have an impact.)
 
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#20 ·
Looks like a Coolgate copper plated edition radiator. It's just a plating though, not a 100% copper rad though. It has brass chambers and steel panels iirc.

Even Alphacool's "Full Copper" radiators have brass threads and steel panels.
 
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