Arctic P12 and P120 / P14 and P140 "Pressure Optimized" Fans : reviews/discussion thread

doyll · Jul 30, 2019

Exilon said:
Why are you saying a fan is X% better on the arbitrary scoring? Look at the performance charts VSG provided.

Because VSG's overall rating is in %.

As for your 'hands on experience' .. well, it's not what I or 99% of people I know / read about think. Go ahead and use whatever you want. But please stop trying to draw others down your rabbit-hole.

Exilon · Jul 30, 2019

doyll said:
Because VSG's overall rating is in %.

As for your 'hands on experience' .. well, it's not what I or 99% of people I know / read about think. Go ahead and use whatever you want. But please stop trying to draw others down your rabbit-hole.

99% of the people you know and you are wrong, according to a reviewer you claimed was credible. My condolences. Please stop recommending bad fans to newbies.

Exilon · Jul 30, 2019

AlphaC said:
Exilon have you seen the P12 page recently? They claim to outperform Nf-A12x25...

View attachment 284672

I have not looked at the P12 page at all, but that is a bold claim. I've seen the Vortez.net review in which the P12 lost to the A12x25 by a small margin, but considering the price that's a good result.

I still have the 120mm adapter I bought when I tried the A12x25 on my 140mm 16FPI radiators. The A12x25 was comparable to the Vardar 140 (and hence NF-A14/ML140) from a perf/noise perspective, which is an impressive result considering the size, but the fan+adapter pricing was too high to justify switching away from the Vardar 140s.

https://www.overclockers.com/noctua-nf-a12x25-fan-review/

Overclockers says the A12x25 are better on 140mm 30FPI rads than the NF-A14.

AlphaC · Jul 30, 2019

Vortez review was on a 21FPI Corsair AIO
https://www.vortez.net/articles_pages/arctic_bionix_p120_review,5.html
NF-A12x25 at 2020RPM = 30.8°C delta , 35.5 dBA (36.5 dBA when used on a case)

Bionix P120 at 2070 RPM = 32.5°C delta , 39.1 dBA (38.7 dBA when used on a case)

Corsair ML120 at 1610RPM= 32.9°C delta, 35.6dBA (35.5 dBA when used on a case)

However the review also mentions using a single fan on a 240mm radiator , which doesn't make sense to me?

We then test the fan’s performance both at 1000 RPM and maximum RPM by running an AIDA64 20-minute stress test while running only a single 120mm fan on the 240mm radiator of the Corsair H100i Pro RGB. This allows us to test single fans as well as multi packs by only relying on a single 120mm fan. We mount the fan under the radiator, inside the case, blowing through the radiator.

liszt17 · Jul 30, 2019

Hi! Thank You,and everybody else. So as I have read, the P14 very comparable with the pricier fans. Unfortunately, here in Hungary, some prices are SO ridiculous. For example, the nfa12x25 pwm here costs 33 eur...Ty series fans costs are between 12-20 eur.
But, if a 6 eur fan compatable with a 22-33 eur fan, I think it should be a bestbuy option.
So I can simpler my question:
I looking for a better 140mm fan than wb2 plus, in airflow, and noise, and low rpm airflow. Case: phanteks entho pro, without hdd cages. I like to use it as intake with mesh front and dust filter, and outtake as well.
Are the p14 good for this solution? If the clear answer is yes, then I'll buy and 5 pack , and put 2 of them front and one to bottom as intake, and one to top and one to rear as outtake. The system is vega 56 pulse fan modded (the image under)+overclocked+ryzen 5 1600 with brocken 2. I satisfied with the p12, and just want to know, the p14 performs even better at the same sound.

Exilon · Jul 31, 2019

AlphaC said:
Vortez review was on a 21FPI Corsair AIO
https://www.vortez.net/articles_pages/arctic_bionix_p120_review,5.html
NF-A12x25 at 2020RPM = 30.8°C delta , 35.5 dBA (36.5 dBA when used on a case)

Bionix P120 at 2070 RPM = 32.5°C delta , 39.1 dBA (38.7 dBA when used on a case)

Corsair ML120 at 1610RPM= 32.9°C delta, 35.6dBA (35.5 dBA when used on a case)

However the review also mentions using a single fan on a 240mm radiator , which doesn't make sense to me?

The ML120 1600RPM seem to be doing way better than I expected as well. Dropping nearly 14C with a 600RPM increase while others dropped 10-12C with 1000RPM increase.

I could be convinced that it's a measurement error, but then again the ML120 does seem to be a strong fan: http://thermalbench.com/2016/07/12/corsair-ml120-pro-120-mm-fan/3/

One thing that I forgot to mention: These fans are 27mm thick rather than the usual 25mm. This will make 28/30mm screws unable to reach if you have a gasket or pump mount. I ended up using 35mm + washers.

Grinding Vardar 140 for scale

Yes, the P14 fans are a best buy at their prices. Don't be like me and spend $150 on name brand fans to see them all get rolled by a $6 fan

doyll · Jul 31, 2019

Exilon said:
99% of the people you know and you are wrong, according to a reviewer you claimed was credible. My condolences. Please stop recommending bad fans to newbies.

Wow! You obviously don't understand VSG review standards or are just trying to case trouble.

No!

The fans I've recommended were also recommended by VSG fan in his overall ratings:

TY-147A SQ 85%, same rating as Darkside Gentle TYphoon.
TY-143 SQ 90% and it is same fan design as TY-147A SQ with identical performance at same rpms, but 2500rpm vs 1300rpm and TY-143 has ball bearings.
PH-F140MP 85%.
EK Vardar FF4-140 80%
EK Vardar F3-140ER 90%
EK Vardar F2-140 85%
EK Vardar F1 140 75%
NF-A14 IPPC-2000 PWM 75%
NF-A14 FLX 85%
Silent Wings 3 140 High Speed 85%
Silent Wings 3 140 90%
ML 140 80%

I included GTs, Vardars, etc. to give a better overall look at Thermalbench fan overall ratings, and it is clear that out of ten fans seven are in the 80-85% with two 75% and only one 90% .. which I believe is the best rating VSG gave any fan tested on Thermalbench.

I wish he had tested and reviewed Arctic P140 & BioniX P140.

Exilon · Jul 31, 2019

How is a summary rating is more relevant than a comparative noise vs flow chart of the fans when discussing fan performance?

When VSG dings % because the fan is too expensive or lacks accessories or the packaging is plain, does it affect how that fan pulls air through a restriction?

Yes, a high performing fan can be a bad fan. The Vardar 140 is a bad fan; it performs well but the failure rate pretty much killed the line. However the ratings don't reflect the post-purchase experience that would ruin the experience with a high performing fan.

JackCY · Jul 31, 2019

And now it has come to this... a % measurement of fan performance.

A lot of the cooler and fan review sites I've seen are kind of dead now. Remain online but no new content for years.

There is always something better, sure Noctua fans can be better performance/noise but they are far from better performance/price.
P14 are better than P12 to who was asking above, they move more air, similar pressure, specs says a little higher. 120mm side by side to a 140mm fan always appear like small babies.

Didn't notice any defects so far on my 4x P14 PWM PST or 2x P12 PWM. Individually packed because those are often cheaper than the 5 packs if you can buy the 5 pack at all.
The F14 has already seen some use and has a different motor, it's fine but it's not 100% perfect but then even almost all GPU fans I've ever had on GPUs are far from 100% perfect already when new. They probably need to run a while and then they improve their sound signature at least that's been my experience so far with modern fans.

Warranties on fans... the cost of return shipping is same as cost of the fan and possibly more in some countries. So yeah they give you 10 years extended warranty on P PWM fans but are you really going to send it back at your cost?
With Noctua they supposedly will refund you the shipping costs.

What does Noctua have in 140mm PWM... oh yeah, one fan A14, that's it. Same fan blade design as cheapo Silentium PC Sigma Pro, Thermalright TY14x, etc.
In 120mm they have the old F12 and now a new Nidec clone, so much innovation, one design copy of another of another of another.
So where is a Nidec GT 120mm styled 140mm fan? Nowhere.

Pretty much all 140mm fans are 27mm thick.

Even if and I gotta stress the if, as I've yet to have any fan die, one fan dies I still got 4 fans for the price of 1 Noctua/etc. So of course Noctua can afford to send you a new fan in case one dies because you've already paid for it.

doyll · Jul 31, 2019

Exilon said:
How is a summary rating is more relevant than a comparative noise vs flow chart of the fans when discussing fan performance?

When VSG dings % because the fan is too expensive or lacks accessories or the packaging is plain, does it affect how that fan pulls air through a restriction?

Yes, a high performing fan can be a bad fan. The Vardar 140 is a bad fan; it performs well but the failure rate pretty much killed the line. However the ratings don't reflect the post-purchase experience that would ruin the experience with a high performing fan.

VSG's overall rating in % is just that, overall. But the bottom line here is VSG likes and recommends the same fans I do, and TY-147A, PH-F140MP, GTs, etc. are fans we both like and recomend.

As I have repeatedly said, the Arctic P140 and BioniX P140 are not bad if they can be had for less then a fiver, but that's the super low 5-pack pricing .. which is not always available .. can't find any here in UK at the moment. Compound that with BioniX havin a significantly higher single price (£13.55-21.59 here) and they are no longer competative. Arctic website has BioniX P140 at €17.99 with P140 PWM priced at €8.99 .. that prices BioniX same range as many other 140mm fans with proven historys, .. even P140 at €8.99 has competition.

All Vardars, at least all 140mm models seem problematic, meaning even though they tested out decent they don't last like they should. I have TY-140 fans that have been in constant use for about 9 years now.

I suspect these arctic fans will be lucky to last more than 3 .. and I'm being quite kind giving them 3 years.

deepor · Jul 31, 2019

doyll said:
[...]

I suspect these arctic fans will be lucky to last more than 3 .. and I'm being quite kind giving them 3 years.

Your guess can't be right because these Arctic fans here have a 10 (ten) year warranty. There's no way the business would offer this kind of warranty if there was something crappy about its bearing or motor, it has to be reliable.

JackCY · Jul 31, 2019

deepor: as I "speculate" above, they make you pay return shipping which means you're likely going to buy a new fan instead at same cost as the return shipping instead. It could have 100 years warranty and probably wouldn't make a dent into their finances. Now if we are talking a more expensive product where return shipping in comparison is a negligible expense then yes each warranty day/week/month/year will cut into company's finances as people will return them.
With fans like Noctua you read it not so rarely how people return, get exchanges, get "free" stuff/adapters/whatever, but the products also cost at least 2x compared to most comparable other... so the buyer already paid for it in advance.
And it's all made in China/Asia anyway, even those fancy Noctuas.
Good luck finding purchase receipts after 5+ years lol so you can RMA anything

I would gladly buy square Thermalright TY or even the 150mm round ones if they ever bothered to sell any in central EU. Only selected small shops (a couple, etc.) or shops operating from Germany actually sell TR products. Nor are they exactly price competitive fans much. The TR cooler I have I also bought from a shop that operates from Germany. It's not only fans, it's all their products. And this happens to many of the smaller cooling brands. Can have great products but their distribution and availability from retailers/etailers is low. And it does not seem to be changing over time. Even if they did they are often stuck in the mid tier pricing while people often either buy expensive products ("gotta have that popular halo product everyone is talking about") and most buy the cheapest/best value anyway (that's where the bulk of sales is).

AlphaC · Jul 31, 2019

If you're talking about warranty then Thermalright only warranties for two years for their fans. Arctic has 6 years on P12 base model which is really high compared to even Phanteks (150K hour, 5 year) or Noctua NF-A14 (150K hours / 6 year). It's 10 year on the pricier Bionix P120.

There might be a motor difference since the Bionix one mentions motor improvement while the plain (non-PWM) one doesn't.

Older Noctuas were made in Taiwan by the way.

deepor · Jul 31, 2019

I saw the ten year warranty on the P12 and P14 PWM models.

Clicking on all of the P fans on Arctic's website, it's six years on the models without PWM, then ten years warranty on all different PWM models (ten years both for sleeve and ball-bearing).

Checking further on their page, they do the same on their old F models. The PWM models are ten years (also the sleeve bearing models, not just the ball-bearing models). The non-PWM models are six.

gupsterg · Jul 31, 2019

doyll said:
I suspect these arctic fans will be lucky to last more than 3 .. and I'm being quite kind giving them 3 years.

I'm upto ~22mths with the 6x F12 on my TR rig.

liszt17 · Jul 31, 2019

Hi! If anyone owns both the p12 and p14 arctic fans, can check the max noise and airflow compared between theese 2 for me? What I asking for is the noise and airflow in same and max rpm. I have 2 p12's in home, and can calculate the results in my case, I hope...Thanks!

doyll · Aug 1, 2019

deepor said:
Your guess can't be right because these Arctic fans here have a 10 (ten) year warranty. There's no way the business would offer this kind of warranty if there was something crappy about its bearing or motor, it has to be reliable.

What AlphaC said. :thumb:
Most buyers don't use warranty even in first year unless item was quite expensive. When product fails with warranty (especially lower cost items) they don't think it's worth the time to bother. Add in the time and hassle it takes plus shipping costs to return them and it can often cost as much to use warranty as buy new ones.

Computer recycle center near me has mountain of CLCs that started shortly after they were first released .. definitely still under warranty but owners didn't use them. I used to check monitors, hdd's etc. for manufacture date and pay a few quid for newer ones, then get warranty replacements .. untill they started requiring sales receipt. :thumbsdow

Many peeps think like you did here; that warranty is a gauge of life expectancy. Reality is it';s more advertising gimmick / false life expectancy than anything else.

Sme applies for mail-in rebates. Most buyers of items with mail-in rebates never process their rebates.

All that said, I just got my espresso machine replaced under warranty.

ShogoXT · Aug 2, 2019

My judgement of these fans are they are great for the price. I use the non pwm p14s hooked up to a 3 stage fan controller.

They do make noise if you don't use rubber gaskets or other pads. Also they sound a little high pitched at the middle settings.

Dead silent on the minimum setting (5 or 7v? Who knows). Highest setting is louder than I would like, but it's summer and can't complain. Besides my gpu is mostly at fault.

Exilon · Aug 3, 2019

Mine are fine without pads, but they're the PWM version.

Interestingly enough, only the PWM version advertises having a new low vibration motor design

Mention of this is absent in the non-PWM spec sheet.

====

Also Arctic P120 review vs ML120 on a high FPI radiator at various RPM

doyll · Aug 3, 2019

While on the surface review it appears Arctic are much better, but there are many things that make me wonder. At 8:40 in his review of ML120 fans he recommended them.

If you listen to his talk about his system at beginnng of that video he's running stock fans in Define case .. something all experienced Define case users know doesn't work out well. He also says his radiator and case fans are all running at full speed all the time .. most experienced computer users/builders have all fans speed controlled based on component temps. From that kind of thing I get the distinct impression he's quite new at testing/comparing products and knowing which are best.

We need test results from people like VSG and Cooling Technique.

Arctic P12 and P120 / P14 and P140 "Pressure Optimized" Fans : reviews/discussion thread

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