[Tom's] AMD Ryzen 7 5800X Emerges As A Serious Rival For The Intel Core i9-10900K

Fight Game · Oct 1, 2020

Ashes has always favored AMD, but it's still impressive.

finalturismo · Oct 1, 2020

LancerVI said:
AMD Renoir 4000 is NOT Zen 3. It's Zen 2.

AMD Launches 12 Desktop Renoir Ryzen 4000G Series APUs: But You Can’t Buy Them

www.anandtech.com

AMD is probably going 5000 series to prevent confusion between 4000 (Renoir zen2) and 5000 (Vermeer zen3)

That makes no sense why they upgrade the name to Ryzen 4000 series without an architecture upgrade....

Also makes no sense why they called alot of the laptop series zen 2 4000 series......

Further more why they didnt match the architecture generation to the name scheme is also beyond me.

Usually when the name scheme of a product goes higher it means it a new release or its better in some sort of way.

There is not much wisdom behind their naming scheme....

But cant wait for the new Ryzen 5000 series..... i guess?

Sir Beregond · Oct 1, 2020

finalturismo said:
That makes no sense why they upgrade the name to Ryzen 4000 series without an architecture upgrade....

Also makes no sense why they called alot of the laptop series zen 2 4000 series......

Further more why they didnt match the architecture generation to the name scheme is also beyond me.

Usually when the name scheme of a product goes higher it means it a new release or its better in some sort of way.

There is not much wisdom behind their naming scheme....

But cant wait for the new Ryzen 5000 series..... i guess?

I guess Zen+ kinda ruined Zen 2 being "2000 series". 4000 series though, yeah was confusing for sure.

finalturismo · Oct 1, 2020

Intel is in hot water right now..... Japan has the fastest ARM based datacenter, and Intel is lacking the cores and security now. Many people are removing the spectar and melt down patches from Linux because of the massive performance hits..... Arm is probably the future of datacenter computing as you can stack tons of small chips on boards to get massive power gains.... Power9 has many benchmarks near platinum 8280 with Power10 chips on the way. Not to mention power 10 chips are open source.... and are picking up steam. AMD has Epyc now... Intel had a huge market in the datacenter industry but with ARM, Power10 and AMD making massive moves on the datacenter industry being 1 generation behind for this Amount of time has the potential to put Intel in the history books with Compaq. Intel is falling behind in performance while having security holes... IBM Power CPU has fixed that as its completely open source.....

IBM Power cpus with massive amount of thread processing and open source CPU.
AMD with tons of cores...
ARM being very small stackable chips.....

Intel would have to make some huge moves and soon if they don't want to disappear. The market is changing and FAST!

If you look at history some of the biggest companies in the world vanish over night like this...

bigjdubb · Oct 1, 2020

Yeah, Zen+ screwed it up. At least they stopped with the + before they got into Intel ++++++ meme territory.

LancerVI · Oct 1, 2020

finalturismo said:
Intel is in hot water right now..... Japan has the fastest ARM based datacenter, and Intel is lacking the cores and security now. Many people are removing the spectar and melt down patches from Linux because of the massive performance hits..... Arm is probably the future of datacenter computing as you can stack tons of small chips on boards to get massive power gains.... Power9 has many benchmarks near platinum 8280 with Power10 chips on the way. Not to mention power 10 chips are open source.... and are picking up steam. AMD has Epyc now... Intel had a huge market in the datacenter industry but with ARM, Power10 and AMD making massive moves on the datacenter industry being 1 generation behind for this Amount of time has the potential to put Intel in the history books with Compaq. Intel is falling behind in performance while having security holes... IBM Power CPU has fixed that as its completely open source.....

IBM Power cpus with massive amount of thread processing and open source CPU.
AMD with tons of cores...
ARM being very small stackable chips.....

Intel would have to make some huge moves and soon if they don't want to disappear. The market is changing and FAST!

If you look at history some of the biggest companies in the world vanish over night like this...

Whilst I think Intel will survive this, you make excellent points. Look at GE! A bellwether titan, now a shadow of its former self. Intel needs to get its ducks in one row soon, there is no doubt about it.

It would be beyond strange to see intel go the way of Cyrix!! Not likely, but isn't impossible either.

qwertymac93 · Oct 1, 2020

x86 has to go. I don't care if it's RISC-V, ARM, or POWER10, something has to take off — preferably something open source. It's ridiculous that so much of the computing market is held hostage by deals Intel struck decades ago. An open architecture would bring so many advantages.

Timmaigh! · Oct 1, 2020

The question for me, i have been contemplating recently, should i replace my current 7940x with 10980xe (just for fun, to have slightly better CPU, to OC somewhat higher) or will these new CPUs be so good and beat it handily even OCed, that i would regret wasting a grand for vastly inferior CPU. I mean, 3950x already traded blows with it and was faster in some use-cases, and now this Zen3 gen is supposedly another 20 percent faster... will be no doubt cheaper too. I am however not getting that one, since i have 8 sticks of RAM and anyway, do not look into whole platform upgrade. TR platform is way too expensive option as well - for something i dont really need. So the options are options are either 10980xe or save for next rig down the road in few years maybe.

BTW, now disregarding AMD stuff, is 10980xe much upgrade over 7940x anyway? I mean, OC-wise. I can run mine at 4,1GHz all-core, could probably do 4,2...but the package already draws around 250W and cooled by 360 AC Eisbear the temps rise up to 85C on hottest cores. Does the soldering and refined 14++++++++++ process of CascadeLake help to get few hundred more MHz on top of that, while still not get above those temps? Or silicon lottery thing?

Sorry for off-topic.

Section31 · Oct 1, 2020

mothergoose729 said:
intel 10 cores is plau

LancerVI said:
Whilst I think Intel will survive this, you make excellent points. Look at GE! A bellwether titan, now a shadow of its former self. Intel needs to get its ducks in one row soon, there is no doubt about it.

It would be beyond strange to see intel go the way of Cyrix!! Not likely, but isn't impossible either.

Definitely possible but GE collapse is total different level. Its combination of 2008 financial collapse - GE had GE Capital which was part of all the bad loans,etc plus bad investments into wrong sectors (wrong investment in renewable energy). They ended up selling the good parts of GE.

Not that it matters anyways the airline industry in the tank. The airplane leasing and airplane engine business is in bad shape now. Planes order getting cancelled, Tons of airplanes in the dessert somewhere in the states. The airbus a380 are all now retired officially. Government bailouts of airlines worldwide.

RHBH · Oct 1, 2020

Timmaigh! said:
The question for me, i have been contemplating recently, should i replace my current 7940x with 10980xe (just for fun, to have slightly better CPU, to OC somewhat higher) or will these new CPUs be so good and beat it handily even OCed, that i would regret wasting a grand for vastly inferior CPU. I mean, 3950x already traded blows with it and was faster in some use-cases, and now this Zen3 gen is supposedly another 20 percent faster... will be no doubt cheaper too. I am however not getting that one, since i have 8 sticks of RAM and anyway, do not look into whole platform upgrade. TR platform is way too expensive option as well - for something i dont really need. So the options are options are either 10980xe or save for next rig down the road in few years maybe.

BTW, now disregarding AMD stuff, is 10980xe much upgrade over 7940x anyway? I mean, OC-wise. I can run mine at 4,1GHz all-core, could probably do 4,2...but the package already draws around 250W and cooled by 360 AC Eisbear the temps rise up to 85C on hottest cores. Does the soldering and refined 14++++++++++ process of CascadeLake help to get few hundred more MHz on top of that, while still not get above those temps? Or silicon lottery thing?

Sorry for off-topic.

If your current build is doing what you need with no compromises I see little to no reason to upgrade.

Why not do some incremental upgrade that you'll be able to use in your next build?

A NVMe PCIE 4.0 SSD would be a good call.

You'll have less things to buy when you jump to DDR5 in 2021/2022, that's when I would upgrade in your position.

dantoddd · Oct 2, 2020

Hopefully this is true and the RDNA2 card is also a great one. Then i can build my first AMD machine since 2006

113802 · Oct 2, 2020

qwertymac93 said:
x86 has to go. I don't care if it's RISC-V, ARM, or POWER10, something has to take off — preferably something open source. It's ridiculous that so much of the computing market is held hostage by deals Intel struck decades ago. An open architecture would bring so many advantages.

X86 still exist due to Microsoft and programmers greed and AMD finding a solution to keep backwards compatibility.

Timmaigh! · Oct 2, 2020

RHBH said:
If your current build is doing what you need with no compromises I see little to no reason to upgrade.

Why not do some incremental upgrade that you'll be able to use in your next build?

A NVMe PCIE 4.0 SSD would be a good call.

You'll have less things to buy when you jump to DDR5 in 2021/2022, that's when I would upgrade in your position.

Thanks. Well, my build is doing what i need it to, i guess, but it could always be better :-D I work as architect and do a lot of archviz stuff for my/our projects among other stuff and things i feel slow me down the most are drives (i still use mechanical HDD for storage, so saving, loading, autobacking) and then rendering speed of GPUs. It is true i am not really sure if there is anything 10980xe would significantly improve for me, that much is true.

RHBH · Oct 2, 2020

Timmaigh! said:
Thanks. Well, my build is doing what i need it to, i guess, but it could always be better :-D I work as architect and do a lot of archviz stuff for my/our projects among other stuff and things i feel slow me down the most are drives (i still use mechanical HDD for storage, so saving, loading, autobacking) and then rendering speed of GPUs. It is true i am not really sure if there is anything 10980xe would significantly improve for me, that much is true.

You should go for a storage upgrade, get some SSDs with high endurance (TBW) specs for your work.

You'll feel like you got a new machine.

qwertymac93 · Oct 2, 2020

WannaBeOCer said:
X86 still exist due to Microsoft and programmers greed and AMD finding a solution to keep backwards compatibility.

The only reason Windows is still a thing is the fact that often times really old software still works with it. I've seen 30 year old DOS stuff work with Windows 10. If it weren't for people still trying to use that old cruft...

113802 · Oct 2, 2020

qwertymac93 said:
The only reason Windows is still a thing is the fact that often times really old software still works with it. I've seen 30 year old DOS stuff work with Windows 10. If it weren't for people still trying to use that old cruft...

The reason really old software works is due to keeping 32-bit compatibility along with AMD finding a solution. If AMD didn't release 64 bit extensions we'd be running IA-64 based systems.

qwertymac93 · Oct 2, 2020

Which would be even worse in terms of licensing and open hardware platforms.

finalturismo · Oct 2, 2020

LancerVI said:
Whilst I think Intel will survive this, you make excellent points. Look at GE! A bellwether titan, now a shadow of its former self. Intel needs to get its ducks in one row soon, there is no doubt about it.

It would be beyond strange to see intel go the way of Cyrix!! Not likely, but isn't impossible either.

Totally forgot about Cyrix, makes me want to get the last Cyrix model made on Ebay just to keep it as a collector 0.o

Abaidor · Oct 3, 2020

Timmaigh! said:
The question for me, i have been contemplating recently, should i replace my current 7940x with 10980xe (just for fun, to have slightly better CPU, to OC somewhat higher) or will these new CPUs be so good and beat it handily even OCed, that i would regret wasting a grand for vastly inferior CPU. I mean, 3950x already traded blows with it and was faster in some use-cases, and now this Zen3 gen is supposedly another 20 percent faster... will be no doubt cheaper too. I am however not getting that one, since i have 8 sticks of RAM and anyway, do not look into whole platform upgrade. TR platform is way too expensive option as well - for something i dont really need. So the options are options are either 10980xe or save for next rig down the road in few years maybe.

BTW, now disregarding AMD stuff, is 10980xe much upgrade over 7940x anyway? I mean, OC-wise. I can run mine at 4,1GHz all-core, could probably do 4,2...but the package already draws around 250W and cooled by 360 AC Eisbear the temps rise up to 85C on hottest cores. Does the soldering and refined 14++++++++++ process of CascadeLake help to get few hundred more MHz on top of that, while still not get above those temps? Or silicon lottery thing?

Sorry for off-topic.

I also have a 7940X and was thinking about the same upgrade. However, mine is delidded and I run 8 cores @ 4.9GHZ and the rest are at 4.8GHZ - I have also optimized my memory (3600Mhz) to below 50ns latency......I don't need more cores for what I do either so I decided against buying a new CPU for this platform (I am on ROG RAMPAGE VI - the original).

If I was you I would seek to ocerclock the 7940X since your clocks are low compared to what others have managed with this.....Unless you don't fell comfortable with this or your cooling is not up to it...I am on a custom loop with dual D5s and a MORA radiator with 9X140mm fans.

I don't play games (maybe 1-2 per year) and I am on a Pro 32" 4K monitor (60Hz) so I don't think a new CPU would make a dramatic difference either.........

I would overclock your CPU or wait till DDR5 platforms are available before I upgrade.........Also wait for ZEN 3 and see what it brings.......maybe it is worth it for you if it saves you time and helps you earn more money through your work.

Timmaigh! · Oct 5, 2020

Abaidor said:
I also have a 7940X and was thinking about the same upgrade. However, mine is delidded and I run 8 cores @ 4.9GHZ and the rest are at 4.8GHZ - I have also optimized my memory (3600Mhz) to below 50ns latency......I don't need more cores for what I do either so I decided against buying a new CPU for this platform (I am on ROG RAMPAGE VI - the original).

If I was you I would seek to ocerclock the 7940X since your clocks are low compared to what others have managed with this.....Unless you don't fell comfortable with this or your cooling is not up to it...I am on a custom loop with dual D5s and a MORA radiator with 9X140mm fans.

I don't play games (maybe 1-2 per year) and I am on a Pro 32" 4K monitor (60Hz) so I don't think a new CPU would make a dramatic difference either.........

I would overclock your CPU or wait till DDR5 platforms are available before I upgrade.........Also wait for ZEN 3 and see what it brings.......maybe it is worth it for you if it saves you time and helps you earn more money through your work.

Hey there, thanks for your input.

I am clearly not as skilled overclocker as you are, so there is a good chance i could OC my CPU higher, by the combination of those various settings, than i did, if i knew better. Really, my OCing was about changing like 5 settings in BIOS :-D, i never did the meticulous testing of stability for each core, etc... While OCing is kinda fun for me, its mostly down to the thrill of finding out how much unused potential is there left, but once there is too much work involved (like changing settings, testing stability, rinse and repeat ad nauseum, to get every last drop of performance), i am out

Anyway, perhaps i could not do much more. I dont have delidded CPU nor do i have your fancy loop, i am cooling it with basic 360 AIO (AC Eisbaer) - i am not even sure for how many watts is such AIO intended - i mean, it can keep my CPU under 90C at 4,1GHz and cca 250W...is this its cooling performance limit or if i got the CPU delidded, temps would be significantly lower, so i could allow higher clocks (more watts)?....i dont know.

Waiting for next Intel or AMD HEDT is obviously an option. I might still do it. It was my intention until last week, when i randomly found the 10980xe to be fairly available around here, so it got me thinking.

BTW, my machine got somewhat unstable lately. Getting random BSODs, funnily while browsing web or watching utube or even skyping, never during gaming, autoCAD drawinf, octane rendering or CB runs (actual heavier tasks). The reason is always WHEA UNCORRECTABLE ERROR. Do you think its down to my OC not being stable anymore, maybe cause of the degradation or whatever else, or more likely software issue? Truth to be told, my Windows is borked as hell, it screwed itself during one of those autoupdates and cant even be updated anymore. I am stuck at 1803 version or so, tried downloading their Media Creation tool to manually update it, only for the update to fail in the middle of the process.... i suppose i need complete reinstall, but since for work its OK, i am lazy to do that.

	Core i9-10900K	Ryzen 7 5800X	Performance Difference
Averages	114.8	133.6	16.4%
Normal Batch	136.3	166.6	22.2%
Medium Batch	118.6	135.3	14.1%
Heavy Batch	96.5	110.3	14.3%

[Tom's] AMD Ryzen 7 5800X Emerges As A Serious Rival For The Intel Core i9-10900K

AMD Ryzen 7 5800X Emerges As A Serious Rival For The Intel Core i9-10900K

Fight Game

finalturismo

AMD Launches 12 Desktop Renoir Ryzen 4000G Series APUs: But You Can’t Buy Them

Sir Beregond

finalturismo

bigjdubb

LancerVI

qwertymac93

Timmaigh!

Section31

RHBH

dantoddd

113802

Timmaigh!

RHBH

qwertymac93

113802

qwertymac93

finalturismo

Abaidor

Timmaigh!

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