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Don’t spend much more time to find a solution.
RMA ! 😊
RMA takes time and resources and results in the loss of use of the entire system. Test all possible known problems and solve them all prior to and then RMA once all the known problem/s have been determined 100%

If the power supply is week get a better one before waisting any more time and money on other componants. Good clean power is a must with demanding computing. Does that compute? System error :p

Dirty/weak PSU's are known to wipe out multiple system componants. I always build a fresh system around a known good reliable PSU. It's the foundation next to the Mobo but is more important IMO as it can take out everything and yes even burn your house down. I know that's a bit extreme but it's possible.
 
Discussion starter · #22 ·
Have you tried disabling XMP yet? XMP isn't guaranteed and memory is usually the pain with Zen from my experience.

If your system can't run stock memory and you're still having WHEA errors - go through the pain and RMA the CPU. If errors go away, its on to the next troubleshooting step.

Beyond that - regardless of stability, as others mentioned, replace the PSU. Just don't be surprised if you do swap it, you still have stability issues with your current configuration. We just don't want to see your system burst into flames lol.

FWIW: I did research that unit. It's not terrible... Thermaltake Smart Series 530 W Power Supply Review - Overclockers but there are much better options out there without clumps of solder lose. Yes, 38A on the 12v rail is more than enough for a 5800X + 6600XT but there is more to a PSU than just power output.

I know xmp is not guaranteed but I would feel extremely dumb if my old ryzen 2600 chould handle 3200mhz ram but my new 5800x can't. I will try it again and using custom settings for ram oc.

The psu is not exactlythis model, i dont know if they have changed something it's probably just a modular version... mine looks like this:
Musical instrument accessory Electronic device Font Audio equipment Box
 
Discussion starter · #23 ·
RMA takes time and resources and results in the loss of use of the entire system. Test all possible know problems and solve them all and RMA once the know problem/s have been determined 100%
If the power supply is week get a better one before waisting any more time and money on other componants. Good clean power is a must with demanding computing. Does that compute? System error :p

This is why I didnt RMA it months ago, unfortunately I dont have the ability to return it to my retailer, I need to deal directly with AMD.

I will be testing the SoC and XMP solutions one at a time in the following weeks. This issue could take a while to manifest so I cant have fast results. ( psu replacement goes without saying) And i will be updating this thread if anything seem to work.
Thank you all for your input.
 
Make sure you run a pleathera of RAM tests, Memtest etc, GPU Tests, and at least get a cheap digital multi meter so you can probe the voltages on each rail on the PSU while under load so you know for sure you have clean power!

As odd as it sounds issues can always be related to any number of things. Mobo static discharge is just one issues for example from when building a system that can cause weird anomalies that rear their ugly face and cause gremlin problems lol. Could be something as simple as the bios. There is any number of issues that can cause problems even software. This is why I always start with a known good PSU. Limit the problem from the get go and make it easier to narrow down once problems occur.
 
Discussion starter · #25 ·
Make sure you run a pleathera of RAM tests, Memtest etc, GPU Tests, and at least get a cheap digital multi meter so you can probe the voltages on each rail on the PSU while under load so you know for sure you have clean power!

As odd as it sounds issues can always be related to any number of things. Mobo static discharge is just one issues for example from when building a system that can cause weird anomalies that rear their ugly face and cause gremlin problems lol. Could be something as simple as the bios. There is any number of issues that can cause problems even software. This is why I always start with a known good PSU. Limit the problem from the get go and make it easier to narrow down once problems occur.
Would memetest show an issue like this?

Since you mentioned it. I have seen some weird behavior from the pc. There are two examples.
Some days ago I found out that when the computer is off if I turn on or off a large floor fan connected to the same outlet as the (shut off) pc, the mouse rgb come on and off for a bit. here is a video depicting that. Also, the computer before the mobo/cpu/gpu upgrade would sometimes freeze if i where to touch it or bring a vacuum cleaner near it. This was about 2 years ago and after a point these freezes stopped. Lastly this wasn't my first choice of psu... when i build it in 2018 I had a seasonic PSU witch died in the first month of usage when, while gaming, I touched the computer. It just shut off immediately and the psu died, for a couple of months afterwards I was afraid of touching the case.(case is a nzxt h500)

I am saying all that because you mentioned mono static discharge. I haven't had any of these for almost a year now so I didn't really think about them.
 
My guess would be one of two situations. Either the mouse is so sensitive that it is picking up on the vibrations from all those manual clicks of what ever it is you are clicking on or the PSU does not have good sleep regulation and simple spikes in the power grid cause the power supply to spike the mobo causing that mouse to wake up. I'm assuming it's usb. Then again it could be a combination of the two. I D K that's a new one to me. I have carpet so the vibrations would only be acoustic through the air but it looks to me like you might have vibrations through the hard floor lending me to believe mouse sensitivity. Any bodies guess at this point.
 
Not sure if this is yours but it's too funny.

 
Discussion starter · #28 ·
My guess would be one of two situations. Either the mouse is so sensitive that ut is picking up on the vibrations from all those manual clicks of what ever it is you are clicking on or the PSU does not have good sleep regulation ans simple spikes in the power grid cause the power supply to spike the mobo causing that mouse to wake up. I'm assuming it's usb. Then again it could be a combination of the two. I D K that's a new one to me. I have carpet so the vibrations would only be acoustic through the air but lioks like you might have vibrations through the hard floor lending me to believe mouse sensitivity. Any bodies guess at this point.
Whell the pc is off so there shouldn't be any lights. I am not clicking something I am turning on and off a floor fan, and this causes the mouse led to light up.

Not sure if this is yours but it's too funny.

Not mine but looks pretty accurate. I'll find out soon enough.
 
Mice don't need clicks to come alive, depending on the mouse, a simple nudge can wake up the system depending on settings. Now that I think about it, it could simply be the PSU allowing power spikes through the mobo into the system. Test this theory by running a big transformer type stick welder “JOKE :p” on the same house grid to see if a power spike causes the issue.

Replace the welder with any other electrical unit that can cause a spike or dip or spike in your homes electrical grid. I think at this point you might as well call out an electrician at $180 per hour to make sure the house is safe to live in :p

The pieces of the puzzle are starting to unravel.
 
I know xmp is not guaranteed but I would feel extremely dumb if my old ryzen 2600 chould handle 3200mhz ram but my new 5800x can't. I will try it again and using custom settings for ram oc.
Why OC? Just run at stock and if you’re still having issues, you can be very certain it’s not the RAM and you can avoid any RAM tweaking.

I don’t know why that would make you feel dumb. It should only help prove to AMD in a RMA ticket that it’s clearly the CPU at fault.
 
I would not assume the bios can handle the earlier gen cpu and xmp settings for the 2600 as it can the 5800x. I think i need to go back and re-read everything in the original post. Those two cpu's are quite different from one another.

There is a number of things going on with the computer. OK if the 5800x is an early version I guess it is known that some of those could have been duds. I'm not an expert on that, never tried the 5800x my self and that will most likely be my next cpu. But lets rule out all other possibilities first. Even if the cpu is defective, if you can get it to run as good as possible or at bare minimum reduce the limiting factors in all the potential problems that can exist then you'd be doing your self a huge favor in making the system more bullet proof and reliable as well as capable of running cool and quiet as possible while belting out the best possible performance.

Have you pulled the mobo out of the case to make sure you don't have some weird short happening. I'm not on the bad cpu bandwagon but also not saying it is not the problem.

I think it is very possible with the given knowns that the cpu is bad but lets know for sure. However given the mouse power issue what else can be causing problems. A bad cable to a mouse or keyboard? Possabilities are limitless :/ Have you tried using a different mouse and or keyboard? Have you tried the 2600 and the vacuum trick or what ever caused the mouse to light up when you switched the toggle switch that made the 3800x mouse set up light up the mouse with out the pc being on ???

Possibilities are endless but until you learn how to diagnose specific problems, they may continue to haunt you! Have to rule out all possibilities. That's not always easy or cheap, and some times when people cheap out it causes weird problems.

Sorry OP I'm just trying to shed some light and get you to think about diagnostics before jumping on the bad cpu bandwagon.
 
Would memetest show an issue like this?

Since you mentioned it. I have seen some weird behavior from the pc. There are two examples.
Some days ago I found out that when the computer is off if I turn on or off a large floor fan connected to the same outlet as the (shut off) pc, the mouse rgb come on and off for a bit. here is a video depicting that. Also, the computer before the mobo/cpu/gpu upgrade would sometimes freeze if i where to touch it or bring a vacuum cleaner near it. This was about 2 years ago and after a point these freezes stopped. Lastly this wasn't my first choice of psu... when i build it in 2018 I had a seasonic PSU witch died in the first month of usage when, while gaming, I touched the computer. It just shut off immediately and the psu died, for a couple of months afterwards I was afraid of touching the case.(case is a nzxt h500)

I am saying all that because you mentioned mono static discharge. I haven't had any of these for almost a year now so I didn't really think about them.
My guess would be one of two situations. Either the mouse is so sensitive that it is picking up on the vibrations from all those manual clicks of what ever it is you are clicking on or the PSU does not have good sleep regulation ans simple spikes in the power grid cause the power supply to spike the mobo causing that mouse to wake up. I'm assuming it's usb. Then again it could be a combination of the two. I D K that's a new one to me. I have carpet so the vibrations would only be acoustic through the air but it looks to me like you might have vibrations through the hard floor lending me to believe mouse sensitivity. Any bodies guess at this point.
Ok I did not mention this earlier as I totally over looked the information provided while being self absorbed in my few adult beverages. It happens :/. Anyway if you had a power supply go bad it could have caused issues with any number of integrated circuits on the system mobo etc.

The biggest problem atm is not knowing all the facts. Does the mouse exhibit this weird led lights up with fans/vacuums run near the system while the 2600 is in the system? Did you observe any problems with the 2600 before or after the PSU failure?

I don’t know if this is possible but I’m wondering if traces or circuits related to the 5800x might be effected that would not be effected by the 2600.

Man I’m digging my self deep into this rabbit hole lol. Ok back to the top to re-read your original complaint :)
 
OK, I gave the op a good read and do not recal any mention of the storage drive that is being used or if the os was reloaded for a clean instal when the new cpu/mobo combo was rolled into use.

The good news is it is the same exact event ID “18” every time it crashes lol. What that means, I have no clue as it is beyond my pay grade :p but it tells us it is consistently the same exact problem every time.

If you did not do a clean OS/Driver instal with the new mobo/cpu combo then I would start there. Are you running an NVMe drive? Are you monitoring your temps? Do you have dirty power from your home electrical grid, I.e. power spikes up or down and does things like turning on the lights, ac, microwave, vacuum etc etc etc cause fluctuations in the home grid electrical. Digital multi meters would help in diagnosing AC fluctuation. I’m fortunate that I have a nice monster power power surge suppressor that has a digital readout so I can see power spikes in the grid. 1 or 2 volts is normal but there is a rate at which you don’t want the power to spike too high or dip too low one way or the other and the frequency should be as close to 60Htz as possible. This is the clean power thing I mentioned earlier and this is where a good reliable power supply will come into play ;)
 
Yes defective memory can bring a system to a halt or cause a crash which is why it is so important to run memtest’s as soon as you build a system and also when checking overclocked settings. Always test with software for instabilities. I don’t know what you know but from reading your opening post you express your self in a way that leads me to believe you are quite capable but might be taking short cuts and not testing etc to rule out instability issues. Always test ram, storage drive, GPU, cpu and power supply voltages to rule out problems from the get go. OK I’m rambled on enough for one night.

Help fill in some of the gaps so we know what’s what.
 
Discussion starter · #35 ·
Yes defective memory can bring a system to a halt or cause a crash which is why it is so important to run memtest’s as soon as you build a system and also when checking overclocked settings. Always test with software for instabilities. I don’t know what you know but from reading your opening post you express your self in a way that leads me to believe you are quite capable but might be taking short cuts and not testing etc to rule out instability issues. Always test ram, storage drive, GPU, cpu and power supply voltages to rule out problems from the get go. OK I’m rambled on enough for one night.

Help fill in some of the gaps so we know what’s what.

I read your previous posts, so I think I need to clarify some things in case is didn't express myself correctly. In case we want to explore more "external" possibilities other than xmp, soc, ram, bad cpu, horrendous psu


First of all the system.
I used to have (9/2018) :
r5 2600
b450 msi tomahawk
16gb gskill ripjaws 3200mhz ddr4 ram
thermaltake smart se 530W psu (as a replacement from the seasonic m12ii evo that got burned in the first month of usage, after touching the pc)
rx 580 8gb nitro+
2 samsung ssd 860 evo sata ssd (one of them is the boot drive) + 1 wd hdd
nzxt h500

This is the system that experienced the freezing issues i wrote above.

This February (2/2022)
I upgraded the cpu to the 5800x, the mobo to the b550 msi gaming edge wifi and the gpu to the 6600xt nitro

In the new system there is non of the weird behavior with other electrical devices like freezing when touching the case or vacuuming near it. Indeed I might had made a mistake with the standoffs in the previous motherboard.
The new-ish system experience only the mouse rgb...effect (which could indicate bad grounding the case? or something sketchy with the power supply or just ac fluctuations that make the mobo almost sent some current to the peripherals -the usb setting for always on power is off so when the pc is off the rgb mouse is also off-
And the title of this post, black screens (maybe a new form of the previous "freezes"?)

Indeed I haven't formatted the drive after i changed the cpu/mobo because I thought it wasn't needed since i wasn't making a change to a completely different platform
The house electrical wiring should be ok, it was renewed 10 years ago. I've never seen voltage drop or anything like that when using a high power device. The computer is though in the same braker as an ac unit( i started using ac 2 weeks ago so this cant be the issue.) Other high power devices are on a different braker so they shouldn't affect it.
 
Hi @TwoEyedJack what is your CPU stepping?, you can see it in CPU-Z. I bought my 5800x back in 2020 and it had the same instabilities in some of its cores under stock settings. Two weeks ago I sent my CPU to RMA and it was approved by AMD. The only solution was to underclock the CPU by going into the Precision Boost Overdrive settings and change a parameter there. I had to downclock by using "Max CPU Boost Clock Override" parameter to -75, which means 75Mhz less, so it was boosting up to 4775Ghz all cores. The other way was to give it additional voltage to reach stock frequencies but that means more temperature and degradation. I wouldn't be so doubtful that its a CPU problem since AMD had WHEA issues in some of their 5XX0 batches because CPUs were not meeting stock frequencies with the stock voltage. There are a lot of threads over the Internet, here there is also one: Replaced 3950X with 5950X = WHEA and reboots
I always wanted to believe that a bios would fix this CPU but at the end and after several Agesa versions it was always unstable, so if it's a bad CPU then nothing will solve it, only RMA, unless you go the downclocking route, which is not fair as it should work as intended.
 
Discussion starter · #37 ·
Hi @TwoEyedJack what is your CPU stepping?, you can see it in CPU-Z. I bought my 5800x back in 2020 and it had the same instabilities in some of its cores under stock settings. Two weeks ago I sent my CPU to RMA and it was approved by AMD. The only solution was to underclock the CPU by going into the Precision Boost Overdrive settings and change a parameter there. I had to downclock by using "Max CPU Boost Clock Override" parameter to -75, which means 75Mhz less, so it was boosting up to 4775Ghz all cores. The other way was to give it additional voltage to reach stock frequencies but that means more temperature and degradation. I wouldn't be so doubtful that its a CPU problem since AMD had WHEA issues in some of their 5XX0 batches because CPUs were not meeting stock frequencies with the stock voltage. There are a lot of threads over the Internet, here there is also one: Replaced 3950X with 5950X = WHEA and reboots
I always wanted to believe that a bios would fix this CPU but at the end and after several Agesa versions it was always unstable, so if it's a bad CPU then nothing will solve it, only RMA, unless you go the downclocking route, which is not fair as it should work as intended.
Stepping is 0. I dunno what this means. I see you also had hopes for quite a while if it took you almost 2 year to rma it. I didn't even knew you chould limit the pbo max boost. So this works? When you say give it additional voltage you mean an all core voltage offset? Have you tried positive curve optimizer ? If this is the case with mine and nothing of the previous works i will probably wait to go away from home for a week or so and RMA it then. Not that I think it matters that much to limit max boost by 75mhz, besides i almost never see it reach 4850. And it will make no difference in multithreaded workloads.

Here is my cpu-z. I suppose you want to see if it an early batch or not?

Font Material property Screenshot Rectangle Parallel
 
Stepping is 0. I dunno what this means. I see you also had hopes for quite a while if it took you almost 2 year to rma it. I didn't even knew you chould limit the pbo max boost. So this works? When you say give it additional voltage you mean an all core voltage offset? Have you tried positive curve optimizer ? If this is the case with mine and nothing of the previous works i will probably wait to go away from home for a week or so and RMA it then. Not that I think it matters that much to limit max boost by 75mhz, besides i almost never see it reach 4850. And it will make no difference in multithreaded workloads.

Here is my cpu-z. I suppose you want to see if it an early batch or not?

View attachment 2566715
Right, AMD released B2 stepping for their Ryzen 3 CPUs some months ago and it's believed they stabilized some of the early issues they had with some batches because of these WHEA issues among other things of course, but they won't admit that, they will just approve your RMA and forget. It took me two years mostly because I didn't want to go through the RMA times, it takes about a month, but at the end is not too much really, I kept myself busy with other hobbies and I have a 3 years old daughter so not much free time lol. My main concerns was in the moment I want to sell this CPU what I would do, I didn't want to sell a bad CPU to a person, then I would have that person complaining about blue screens plus not very honest from my side. The warranty period that AMD gives is 3 years I believe?

If you have an Asus MB you can look for that option I mentioned above, it should exist in other MB makers too, maybe under a different name. Previously that option would give you only the option to go with positive values which means overclock, but about two bios ago the negative option showed up, which means downclock. Previous to that I was using the Positive Curve Optimizer as you mention by giving positive values, the problem is that it's time consuming and you are feeding more voltage to this CPU which is hot by default, so the option of downclocking is good plus very few performance is lost. All in all, I recommend to RMA if you are getting closer to the 3 years, maybe for now you can avoid the issue by downclocking.
 
Hello, for the past months I struggle with stability issues on my r7 5800x. Right now I get black screens/restarts even while watching youtube. The history and the solutions that I have tried are many and span a number of months so i will provide a full history at the end of this post if you have the time to read it.

Right now my system consists of a r7 5800x (4month old), msi b550 gaming edge wifi (4month old), gskill ripjaws 2x8gb 3200mhz (bought in late 2018), a Thermaltake smart se 530w (i know its bad (bought in late 2018)) and a be quiet dark rock slim + a 6600xt . I have updated the bios to the latest stable one ( just 4 days ago) and i have only enabled xmp. Yet the system blackscreens and restarts. The timing is weird It happens every week or couple of days and then it stops for a couple of days, when it does happen i get a couple of crashes back to back with varying frequency. The crashes come with the same WHEA errors about Cache Hierarchy Error on pretty much all the APIC ID (most common i suppose is APIC ID 2, 12,14. best cores are 3, 7, 1, 2, 6, 5, 4, 8 ) (look at screenshot for periodicity of the errors ).

Thats pretty much the gist of the issue. Its unstable even at default settings (pbo auto) with just xmp enabled i don't think 3200 is pushing the memory controller, what chould be the cause of this ?



For a more detailed description.
I bought the 5800x and the b550 mobo 5 months ago to upgrade my r5 2600, b450 system. so the ram and the psu is repurposed from a system that was running just fine for about 3 and a half years.

First I didnt knew much about PBO oc so I just enabled it set ppt to 120 , tdc 95, edc 120. and curve optimizer -20 "bad cores" - 15 the two "good" cores and max turbo +50mhz. The system run fine with no crashes for about 2 months. 0 problems in multithreaded applications or single threaded and it frequently boosted to 4850-4900 while gaming. Suddenly 2 months later the crashed started in extreme intensity, meaning the pc would constantly crash back to back even while just trying to browse my files(so i doubt it the usual instability that is observed with pbo one in a blue moon because two months is a long time) .

Then the struggle started, At first i tried core cycler, I run it for many nights (trying different settings per core and different FFTs always for more than 2 iterations of 1hour per core) I found the "stable settings"-nothing extreme best cores at -3 bad cores at -20 and some at -13- that gave me no errors and the crashes stopped.(at the same time i tried using xmp off and even pbo off)

After some weeks of perfect stability the same thing happend, the pc started being extremely unstable. I further increased the curve settings till it was stable for a couple of days/weeks. Then it would once again go into an extreme crashing period where the once perfectly stable system would continuously crash many times a day.

The same pattern of: no crashes for weeks followed by many crashes in a single day remedied by me increasing the curve settings (always run core cycler to check for errors) would continue for many weeks till i reached positive number in some cores to make them "stable".

Now I gave up on curve optimizer i put everything in default except xmp, the system run for a couple of days and then started crashing again so 4 days ago I flashed the newest bios and again 4 days with no crashed and today it crashed twice one in YouTube and once in a game. For a last resort (before trying pbo off and performing an all core traditional oc pr just leaving it with the old boost technology) I enabled curve optimizer all core to positive +5.

I have tried using loadline calibration control for both cpu and soc voltages (soc stays at 1.0 even at prime 95)
I have tinkered with the gpu, performing ddu installations of the drivers various oc settings and I can say that this was not the issue right now it is just running with a power limit +20 setting.

I cant think of anything else to do now, and it has started really exhausting me, i am afraid of using it nowadays. I dont want to admit it to myself but maybe i have a bad cpu and i need to send it back which is a big pain since this is my main computer. I suppose maybe the mobo or the gpu chould be at fault or more possibly that sketchy, old, psu. Or even my installation of windows? Maybe the chipset drivers? Who knows even my house power wiring might be at fault and any power surge in the system from a different defice like an AC or a washing machine affect its.

I waited this long to post it because till now i was overclocking but now we are at stock. I have read many threads on ryzen 5800x issues but i ve never seen this particular behavior.

Thank you for reading my whining post.

Take a look at the periodicity of the errors bellow in case i didn't explained it well. I have colored them in "blocks" keep in mind that every crash grouping is accompanied by me not doing anything for the first few crashes of the grouping and then changing the settings.
View attachment 2566599


View attachment 2566600

View attachment 2566598
Have you checked thermals during any of this? Turning all PBO/OC off & running at default stock setting should result in no errors if your cooling is working. I have a 5600X & at ~77c is about my point of crashing using any form of OC. Not instant crash, eventual. Using a cheap EVGA AIO, I can run mine at 4.7GHZ all core @ 1.26v but my room needs to stay under 77F or I need to de-tune to play games. That only happened when the A/C broke. Anyway, the CPU overheating will cause the same error, not all chips can make it to 90C without crashing. AMD says it's the "max" so, give or take a few C, in my case "take" about 20C off the top. PBO can run some aggressive temps & more juice than one really needs. These 5000 series chips aren't voltage friendly, they heat up quick. I find mine running stable with my room ~73F, AIO 28C & CPU 38C idle, gaming AIO/CPU go to CPU 68C/AIO 31C. If my TIM starts to go bad, I'll know because I'll get frequent crashing, etc. Checking temps I'll find my CPU hitting 77-80C under any load & error 18's. Fix the TIM & problem solved. I had an AIO with a pump that was low flow & the only way I found out was swapping it as a last resort. I keep a known working one on hand & a stock air cooler just in case. FYI, if we RMA'ed every chip that didn't make it to 90C, AMD would have a serious problem. Most of us try to avoid that temp altogether, so we really don't know how many chips can't do 90C.

I don't anyway. Typically, I don't buy a CPU & max its temp to see if it can take it. Your description matches what mine does nearly to a "T" if my paste dries out or there's some other cooling issue.
 
Revert to the mean by running everything at stock, then if needed re-enable XMP on the RAM leaving the CPU at stock speeds, then if needed overclock the CPU.

Your issue is most likely due to a communication problem between the RAM and the CPU, but you could have a bad motherboard, bad RAM or a BAD CPU. Occasionally none of these things test as bad, but still are.

However, returning everything to stock and running for several hours would be a good start towards isolating the problem as well as changing the settings and configurations for one component at a time.

Regardless of what else you do, get a new Gold or Above PSU and go for at least a 750Watt since you obviously intend to overclock your present and future CPUs.

The worst case scenario is that you will have a good PSU handy and who doesn't need an extra PSU? I always like to have a spare myself.

Good luck.
 
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