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Discussion starter · #21 ·
I dunno whats going on, but my vCore is almost all the time above 1.45 V, also with the v3 balanced plan provided by you.

v3 balanced plan (only idle):
View attachment 2475157

with your first balanced plan I have real idle.
The first plan is not using CPPC2 (autonomous mode).
This one should switch on idle mode after 20-30 seconds of no high load and no user input.
Try to check you have Global C-States enabled, both CPPC options forced to Enabled and DF C States Enabled as well.

I will update now with the latest profiles.
You can check if it's switching or not to Idle mode with Resource Monitor with the new profiles.

2475158


If there are cores "Parked" on the right column then it didn't switch to Idle.
In this case could be you have something which is preventing idle running.
There are lots of things that could... even Chrome extensions.
 
Oooh @ManniX-ITA you remind me
Windows performance monitor, has an ACPI tracking tool for deep sleep states
Idk if you remember the old Matisse PBO OC day-tutorials
Image

Maximum ACPI here not only indicates pretty much what 1usmus CTR tool shows (core quality)
But minimum ACPI state also shows the current sleeping state

Go-to Computer Managemement -> Peformance Monitor -> % Processor Performance -> Add each of the threads in order
Optionally double click on one - change the Bar thickness between cores and threads - and sort by CCX order :)
Fully sleeping cores will drop to 0
Low idle cores, will drop to 20-30% ACPI value
It pretty much indicates how high it can boost on a virtual performance Index
It can be also used to figure out Clock Stretching a bit. Works like a more simplified "effective performance" tracking of HWInfo ~ while HWinfo uses AMD close source algorithms for tracking
 
Discussion starter · #23 ·
Oooh @ManniX-ITA you remind me
Windows performance monitor, has an ACPI tracking tool for deep sleep states
Idk if you remember the old Matisse PBO OC day-tutorials
Image

Maximum ACPI here not only indicates pretty much what 1usmus CTR tool shows (core quality)
But minimum ACPI state also shows the current sleeping state

Go-to Computer Managemement -> Peformance Monitor -> % Processor Performance -> Add each of the threads in order
Optionally double click on one - change the Bar thickness between cores and threads - and sort by CCX order :)
Fully sleeping cores will drop to 0
Low idle cores, will drop to 20-30% ACPI value
It pretty much indicates how high it can boost on a virtual performance Index
It can be also used to figure out Clock Stretching a bit. Works like a more simplified "effective performance" tracking of HWInfo ~ while HWinfo uses AMD close source algorithms for tracking
Oh nice thx I didn't though about it!
Lots of digging to do and not enough time :rolleyes:
 
Discussion starter · #24 ·
@Latte

Could be maybe it's a BIOS issue? Which version are you running now?

I'm using F31 and these are the relevant options more or less, check out:

2475164


2475165


2475166


2475167
 
@Latte

Could be maybe it's a BIOS issue? Which version are you running now?

I'm using F31 and these are the relevant options more or less, check out:
These are more or less the same settings I use, too. I also use F31. Maybe F32 is a better one?
Btw, your v4 plan works better now with my VID's. They go below 1V now, but my vCore never goes below 1.025V and my frequencies barely go below 3.6GHz. The default windows balanced plan does. Really weird indeed!
 
  • Enable Global C-States for hibernation to function properly
  • Go into NBIO DPM , put both P0 states into number 2 = 600mhz link speed, leave the other on auto
  • Main voltage field, put CPU VDDP at 900mV , see if you have any WHEA on ycruncher first 4 tests 2*4min
    then lower it to 880mV (stock 930mV)
    This is required for FCLK beyond 2000Mhz to function :)
  • CPU VDD1.8 you can put to 1.83v or 1.85v
    it has subtle positive effects
    ~ but some boads bug it out at 2.1v which has negative effect
  • APBDIS to 0 for missing mode
    this is so once AMD stops being *** around and actually enables back variable FCLK and vSoC , then it will function again and lower powerdraw a bit
 
Discussion starter · #27 ·
These are more or less the same settings I use, too. I also use F31. Maybe F32 is a better one?
Btw, your v4 plan works better now with my VID's. They go below 1V now, but my vCore never goes below 1.025V and my frequencies barely go below 3.6GHz. The default windows balanced plan does. Really weird indeed!
That's a nice improvement :)
No stay away for now from F32, wait for a new one.

The frequencies should go down to 2200 MHz but it could depend on the background apps.
Consider that my 5950x has more threads and can distribute over more cores the background processes.
This helps in keeping a low frequency.
The standard Windows Balanced plan works quite differently, so a different behavior is expected.

Let me know what you feel about speed and responsiveness, how it goes with temp spikes in idle and active use.
 
Discussion starter · #28 ·
  • Enable Global C-States for hibernation to function properly
  • Go into NBIO DPM , put both P0 states into number 2 = 600mhz link speed, leave the other on auto
  • Main voltage field, put CPU VDDP at 900mV , see if you have any WHEA on ycruncher first 4 tests 2*4min
then lower it to 880mV
This is required for FCLK beyond 2000Mhz to function :)
CPU VDD1.8 you can put to 1.83 or 1.85, it has subtle positive effects ~ but some boads bug it out at 2.1v which has negative effect
Thanks, I'll have to check!

I really want to go back to the Unify-X as soon as possible to experiment more eheh
With the Master on F31 any FCLK above 1900 is a no-go.

Last time I tested with NBIO DPM to State 2 got BSOD in Windows...
Usually I set it all to 1 and it's better.
Didn't test with mixed.

Global C-States you mean forced to Enable?
Guess in Auto it is enabled, cores are parking...
 
Thanks, I'll have to check!

I really want to go back to the Unify-X as soon as possible to experiment more eheh
With the Master on F31 any FCLK above 1900 is a no-go.

Last time I tested with NBIO DPM to State 2 got BSOD in Windows...
Usually I set it all to 1 and it's better.
Didn't test with mixed.

Global C-States you mean forced to Enable?
Guess in Auto it is enabled, cores are parking...
BSOD would mean some kind of instability
High freq link speed does work ,300mhz mode only is used for low power states
only the highest powerstate need this
Sorry that i did forget couple of parts to write and the quote is not full

You need to enable it twice only once is buggy
Although i could run all on mode 2 and all on mode 1
Mode 1 i can not recommend ~ but this was observed with SiSandra MCE
Can not recommend it strongly enough :)
Not only matters for memoryOC but matters for in cache tracking and link speed checking.
Vermeer is very b*tchy about little changes, as it does continuously autocorrect

CPPC even if came enable or disabled ~ is buggy
Force enable stuff you know that you want to use.
Never trust auto :coffee:
 
That's a nice improvement :)
No stay away for now from F32, wait for a new one.

The frequencies should go down to 2200 MHz but it could depend on the background apps.
Consider that my 5950x has more threads and can distribute over more cores the background processes.
This helps in keeping a low frequency.
The standard Windows Balanced plan works quite differently, so a different behavior is expected.

Let me know what you feel about speed and responsiveness, how it goes with temp spikes in idle and active use.
Your v4 plan is snappy as hell, without a doubt! But these high vCore voltages (99.9% > 1.4V) are scaring me. My idle temps are also 2-3 degrees higher (33°C - 35°C) than with windows balanced plan. And no differences in gaming (Godfall Benchmark).

What I do not understand is, why are the temps so good with such a high permanently vCore?
 
Discussion starter · #31 ·
Your v4 plan is snappy as hell, without a doubt! But these high vCore voltages (99.9% > 1.4V) are scaring me. My idle temps are also 2-3 degrees higher (33°C - 35°C) than with windows balanced plan. And no differences in gaming (Godfall Benchmark).

What I do not understand is, why are the temps so good with such a high permanently vCore?
High vCore is not a problem, because there's no power consumption.
It's going to increase only the IOD part temperature a little bit.

Being almost always high means the CPU can quickly scale the clocks up, that's why should be more reactive than the any plan using P-States that lowers the vCore.
With CPPC2/autonomous mode is the CPU itself deciding what voltages and clocks to keep to be reactive, not the Windows scheduler.
To adjust the vCore my Master needs 400 ms which is an eternity for responsiveness.

This means that I can touch many others parameters in the plan to decrease the temperature; in particular the spikes.
You should see much less spikes with this plan than with the Balanced while monitoring with the HWInfo graph the CCD temperature.

This keeps much more in check, less high variations with low usage processes, the CPU Tcl/Tdie temperature which is used for ramping up and down the fan.

Did you manage to check if the idle state is kicking in?

I wonder if someone else tried the plan and can verify this behavior as well.
 
Discussion starter · #32 ·
BSOD would mean some kind of instability
High freq link speed does work ,300mhz mode only is used for low power states
only the highest powerstate need this
Sorry that i did forget couple of parts to write and the quote is not full

You need to enable it twice only once is buggy
Although i could run all on mode 2 and all on mode 1
Mode 1 i can not recommend ~ but this was observed with SiSandra MCE
Can not recommend it strongly enough :)
Not only matters for memoryOC but matters for in cache tracking and link speed checking.
Vermeer is very b*tchy about little changes, as it does continuously autocorrect

CPPC even if came enable or disabled ~ is buggy
Force enable stuff you know that you want to use.
Never trust auto :coffee:
Yes, maybe it was that Master BIOS having issues...
I wonder how can have this big effect; it's the integrated GPU NB link if I'm not wrong.

Yes I usually force enable but this is quite a random profile...
Didn't expect to run still the Master at this point!
 
High vCore is not a problem, because there's no power consumption.
It's going to increase only the IOD part temperature a little bit.

Being almost always high means the CPU can quickly scale the clocks up, that's why should be more reactive than the any plan using P-States that lowers the vCore.
With CPPC2/autonomous mode is the CPU itself deciding what voltages and clocks to keep to be reactive, not the Windows scheduler.
To adjust the vCore my Master needs 400 ms which is an eternity for responsiveness.

This means that I can touch many others parameters in the plan to decrease the temperature; in particular the spikes.
You should see much less spikes with this plan than with the Balanced while monitoring with the HWInfo graph the CCD temperature.

This keeps much more in check, less high variations with low usage processes, the CPU Tcl/Tdie temperature which is used for ramping up and down the fan.

Did you manage to check if the idle state is kicking in?

I wonder if someone else tried the plan and can verify this behavior as well.
All that makes a lot of sense. I could see how the core’s idle state was kicking in. I guess the differences in vCore etc lies really in our different core count. But overall I enjoy your plan. Will definitely test it for longer now.
 
Yes, maybe it was that Master BIOS having issues...
I wonder how can have this big effect; it's the integrated GPU NB link if I'm not wrong.

Yes I usually force enable but this is quite a random profile...
Didn't expect to run still the Master at this point!
You are right , but not only for this
It is used on APUs, but it does shedule clock gating.
I saw a little measurable difference on SiSandra in the cores utilization
If it was fully non functional, the result should not be different for you - neverless of what you set

This is all the Information i could find about it
I can see that this can make issues with BAR mode , but it shouldn't ?

I didn't research before playing with it, but saw that "efficiency mode" pretty much does what the links individually do
Slow do boosting, but not limit it
Slow down internal GMI Link speed
Soo i kept them by the difference they did, not by what's technically correct
 
Discussion starter · #35 ·
@Veii

This is the Processor Performance counter:

2475197


It just goes from a 120-130 value down to 64 when switching to idle.
Can't make it go lower but I guess that's because it's kinda working in CPPC2 mode.

The core parking is not tracked by another counter:

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This is the sz Balanec Ryzen v4, it's terrible :)
Responsiveness is awful and mostly the clocks are set at 3000 MHz with an extremely slow ramp up.
It's a P-State plan with 50% energy performance preference policy which is bad; not even in autonomous using this policy can save from too much loss of performances.
But even with that one the Performance % goes down to 64, same as mine.
Wonder if there have been changes in Windows 20H2 about of the power states are handled...

2475200
 
Discussion starter · #36 ·
You are right , but not only for this
It is used on APUs, but it does shedule clock gating.
I saw a little measurable difference on SiSandra in the cores utilization
If it was fully non functional, the result should not be different for you - neverless of what you set

This is all the Information i could find about it
I can see that this can make issues with BAR mode , but it shouldn't ?

I didn't research before playing with it, but saw that "efficiency mode" pretty much does what the links individually do
Slow do boosting, but not limit it
Slow down internal GMI Link speed
Soo i kept them by the difference they did, not by what's technically correct
It deserves a set of benchmarks to run :D
I think set all at 1 with the 3800x gave me some more stability, maybe less WHEA errors? Not sure.
 
This is the Processor Performance counter:
View attachment 2475197

It just goes from a 120-130 value down to 64 when switching to idle.
Can't make it go lower but I guess that's because it's kinda working in CPPC2 mode.
I like that 150% wall there
Don't think any core would exceed beyond 200%
But on both nothing sleeps
This is strange and awkward
I've seen them fully fall down and sleep ~ but for more information ,you'd have to wait 1-2 weeks till i can play again with my system

At least you have it now in your hands
HWinfo or other wake up tools are not needed if you only finetune the PPlan by this nice tool
I look forward to more improvements than v4 :p
 
Discussion starter · #38 ·
I like that 150% wall there
Don't think any core would exceed beyond 200%
But on both nothing sleeps
This is strange and awkward
I've seen them fully fall down and sleep ~ but for more information ,you'd have to wait 1-2 weeks till i can play again with my system

At least you have it now in your hands
HWinfo or other wake up tools are not needed if you only finetune the PPlan by this nice tool
I look forward to more improvements than v4 :p
Let's hope, hope you can soon get back your fingers on a keyboard :)

Yes it goes down with P-State mode; I'm testing the other plan which I knew already.
It's the efficient community and the clocks goes down to 560 MHz and the Peformance% index to 20.
But it's as well sluggish and slow like hell :D

I'm checking maybe I can do something better without so much lag based on this one with P-State but I'm not sure it's achievable...
I've used c0ffeebeef42 plan as well which is based on the Community as well but they all are terribly laggy.
Plus low P-State clock plans were all causing BSODs with my 3800x and EDC set to 1.
 
Let's hope, hope you can soon get back your fingers on a keyboard :)

Yes it goes down with P-State mode; I'm testing the other plan which I knew already.
It's the efficient community and the clocks goes down to 560 MHz and the Peformance% index to 20.
But it's as well sluggish and slow like hell :D

I'm checking maybe I can do something better without so much lag based on this one with P-State but I'm not sure it's achievable...
I've used c0ffeebeef42 plan as well which is based on the Community as well but they all are terribly laggy.
Plus low P-State clock plans were all causing BSODs with my 3800x and EDC set to 1.
Hmmm, actually try EDC 2 if you haven't
EDC 2 and PPT/EDC limits ontop of an perCCX OC + 5X PBO - on Matisse runs fantastic
I never had that low idle issues - soo it really might not be the powerplans that cause you issues :(

I wish you can sort this out
It's funny, both of the shared ones work wonderfully on a 3900X
But maybe yours is twice as fast - and this then looks laggy
I need to test it better through, before i criticize
Well probably just want to assist where i can ~ as you take over the work on which i actually wanted to work on soon too :)
Soo i wish you best of success and harsh critique to make it even better :coffee:\ :giggle:
 
Discussion starter · #40 ·
Updated the profiles; reverted to P-State as I had performance issues with autonomous mode (lower CPU-z scores)
 
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